What is the view from across the pond on Mike Riley's performance in yesterday's game? I'd be interested to get a different perspective.
It was on pay per view or you need the season pass to see it. I'm sure it will be on FSW later this week. We'll report back on it.
Arsenal fans hate him. Utd fans are indifferent, i think, i can't speak for them. I know I am dissappointed with his performance. He should've put his foot down earlier in the match. he let things get out of hand by not carding earlier and by not booking some clearly bookable offenses. Even if Rooney dived, Riley did not call a foul when Cole slide in on Ronaldo in the box and it was a clear foul and should've been a penalty
Whilst I would be critical of several things that went on in the game, his carding wouldn't be one of them. On the whole. He was in a no win situation. If he went out and carded early on, like you suggested, he'd have booked Cole after 55 seconds, and we'd probably have ended up with about 10 yellows and who knows how many reds. However, by not carding early, he let things fester, and it culminated in a 5 minute period where things started to just boil over slightly. However, his major downfall was firstly not even awarding the FK on Ljungberg, which made the Arsenal players feel hard done by, and let down, and then his failure to give the first CLEAR caution of the game to Gary Neville for his cynical foul on Reyes. Having not cautioned then, it made him look inconsistent when he finally did caution, ironically to Cole for exactly the same type of foul. From that moment on, I think the players lost confidence in him, and well, we all know what happened in the second half.
Hey, Jack Taylor awarded a penalty in the first 45 seconds of a World Cup Final, and I've certainly seen yellow cards doled out within two minutes of the start of a game in 1) The Olympics; 2) the Euro finals recently. Cards are there for precisely that reason, to say "I'm not having this crap today!" By not breaking out the yellow for Cole, or the yellow for Neville also early on, he didn't stamp the proper authority on the match, imho. You cannot keep players on the pitch if they insist on not being sportsmen. The free kick not given for Ljungberg was absolutely a dreadful decision, and I believe should have been a free kick and USB caution as well. It was a push from behind, with no defense behind him. I don't think I could call DOGSO, because in my opinion it did not meet the four Ds, but it was clearly a tactical foul. The tackle from behind on Reyes was another decision so clearly foolish that it told me all I needed to know about the match: If this sort of play won't be cautioned, NOTHING will. Certainly not simulation, for instance, or anything less flagrant. While true that the match is always a no-win situation for a referee, I think a little preparation was lacking. Knowing the history of the two teams, even recently, and their current standings, a prepared referee would have to say, "Okay, this is a match where I have to control everything early. AND I have to be aware that one team absolutely will try anything NOT TO LOSE, where the other will try anything to WIN." Equally, the circumstances of the exact same fixture last year between the two teams should have been taken into account, particularly with regards to rewarding a fairly dubious penalty late in the game that would change the entire outcome of the match. The FA made a mistake anyway assigning a "homer" to the match under such circumstances, and their calling Ruud van Nistelrooy on the carpet for an equally dubious SFP after the fact is a bad attempt to save face; furthermore, it underlines that they, too, thought the match control was...uh...lacking. In all honesty, I don't think Riley prepared properly for the match. Nor do I think he properly prepared his Assistants--who could easily have spotted three quite bookable offenses with some help on where they should have been positioned.. As much as it pains me, I actually think Neale Barry or even Uriah Rennie could have controlled that match better, as bad as Rennie's man-management skills are. But there you are.
I applaude the "look" they are giving RVN. He should have been ejected. The opponent's leg was planted with his body weight being supported on the one leg. RVN making the contact just below and to the side of the knee, then making an obvious kick/rake follow on, could have caused long term injury. My 14 year old Son stated the sad truth when he said "Dad, he can get by with it, he is too popular to be ejected at the beginning of a match".
I personally think Mike took the right approach. And I very seriously doubt he didn't prepare properly. If he referee's a tougher game throughout the rest of his career (even a WC final wouldn't match the intensity IMO), I'd love to see it. He couldn't possibly have avoided the pre-match hype, and being the biggest game of his career, he'll certainly have prepared. IMO, he was right to try and use common sense. It was a game watched by 450m people, around the world. That rivals the FA Cup final. The last thing anyone wanted, where possible, was to see players sent off for needless red cards. Had Mike gone out with the attitude of cautioning anything that moved, he'd have had to have been consistent and the game would have had a few off. So I think he was right to try and use common sense and man-management. He clamped down very early on, making a strong point with his whistle and threw speaking to the players what was and wasn't acceptable. And I think it worked. Prior to the first yellow card, yes, there were fouls, but none seriously bad fouls. However, from the moment he failed to at the very least, give a free kick against Ferdinand, all his efforts in applying man-management were wasted, as Arsenal players lost confidence in him. He then compounded it by not cautioning Neville for the first very serious, and very cynical foul of the match. Only 2 minutes later, he cautioned Cole for exactly the same thing. He was never going to have much respect or authority from then on. His failure to spot RvN's assault on Cole and failure to book Rooney for diving only added to the lack of confidence in him. As Jeff Winter said, I think this game is becoming unrefereeable. I really don't know if we have a referee who can successfully handle this game anymore. Jeff Winter did ok when he reffed the FAC game at OT. Steve Bennett had a mare last season, Graham Poll had a go at Highbury last season and made several mistakes, Mark Halsey's had a go a couple of seasons ago, and sent off Sol Campbell for 'elbowing' Solskjaer, which arguable set the whole animosity off. And now our supposedly number 1 referee had a nightmare of a game, and prevented the animosity spilling over. Now, Arsenal fans, and their players, not only despise SAF and RvN, they cannot stand Rooney for diving, and the Neville's for their 'special treatment' handed to Reyes. Rather than calming the waters, there is now even more love lost between the two teams, and I dread to think what will happen when those Man Utd players are in front of the Arsenal home crowd. And more worrying than that is who is capable of handling it. Bennett, Riley, Poll and Halsey (our 4 most senior referees) are out of the running by virtue of the controversy they've created in their handling of recent games, and Winter is retired. Uriah Rennie wouldn't be let anywhere near such a big game, and Man Utd might have something to say if he was put in charge, given their history, and Neale Barry and Alan Wiley don't really have the big-match experience. The only viable option IMO is Dermot Gallagher, who is our most experienced referee, having been a FIFA ref for years and reffed at Euro 96. He is calm, respected and doesn't shirk the big decisions. But the PGMO don't seem to like putting him on the big games. It's a dilemma, and one the PGMO will have to think long and hard about come January. Of course, the other option is to bring in a foreign ref (with most people here calling for PLC, as you'd expect), but they're unlikely to understand the magnitude, rivalry and history of the fixture and the teams, and could make it worse. One things for certain, whoever does ref it, won't be able to win, no matter what they do.
Clearly this is the "moment of truth" in the game. I think the first caution often is, but it was the wrong caution, and late. It does bring up an issue though. If the game has become unrefereeable (I don't happen to think ANY game is unrefereeable--more later), then the old "common sense" approach isn't going to work. In fact, stating that the game is unrefereeable is an admission of this fact. If common sense worked, it would be a controllable game. Let me take one from Sandy Hunt's book, since I know it well. US v China in the Olympics warm-up. Now, anyone who knows anything about women's football knows the history of these teams. They are highly skilled, and extremely aggressive--especially toward each other. In the match, Sandy called 13 fouls, total. 9 of them were yellow card offenses. The first card came out at 26 minutes. The next one didn't come out till the second half, at minute 52, but then they came fast and furious. 55, 61, 61, 72, 74, 75, and the last at 84. Oh, the score at half was 2-0 US; in minute 49 it was 2-1 US. Is it a surprise that the next caution came within three minutes? In minute 69 the score went to 3-1. The next caution was also within three minutes. Now what does this say? It says that these women knew exactly what they were doing when they fouled someone, and that the fouls were premeditated and tactical. It also says that they had enough skill NOT to foul someone, had that been their desire. Yet no one was sent off. The game was perfectly under control. Cards were necessary. Cards were appropriate. It is preposterous to assume that one can referee in such a rivalry without using cards. It is also absurd to assume that a card can be used too soon. Sometimes the whistle is not enough. I'd even opine that in such a game, the whistle CANNOT be enough. Then PGMO need to reconsider how they appoint their referees. If present tactics are not working, then, umm...adjust and adapt your tactics. I find it funny that you mention Uriah Rennie's history with Man Utd. Wasn't Mike Riley's history with both teams equally well known? The fact that Arsenal are 8-8-4 with Mike Riley refereeing and Man U are 12-3-4 over that same period would seem to suggest something to Arsenal fans, especially as their team has by far the best record over that span of time, and since Riley is also from the home area--well, read what you wish. It isn't possible to please both sides, if either. Decisions cannot be made on such bases. I love Dermot Gallagher, certainly, but maybe the problem is that the old guard of referees simply don't have the proper attitude toward the match, and perhaps a new approach is needed. It's certainly time to start giving Barry and Wiley and Rennie some big match experience, otherwise there will be no options in the future, and this rivalry isn't going away soon. I can hardly wait to see what happens in the return leg at Highbury. Especially if they get a referee who doesn't clamp tightly down quickly.
Just to clear up a few things. I don't confess to knowing anything whatsoever about the rivalry between the USA and Chinese womens teams, but I'd say it's a pretty fair guess that it isn't half as physical and intense as the Man U-Arsenal game. However, I understand what you're saying about carding. In hindsight, it would probably have been better had Mike cautioned early. In hindsight. I still believe he was right to take the approach he did. He felt he could keep a lid on it through communicating and talking to the players, and to a certain extent he did. And had he cautioned Gary Neville when he should have, i.e. before he cautioned Cole, then I believe he would have had half the trouble he ended up having. And thats despite not sending off Rio. As it was, tempers boiled over, and he had to start issuing yellows, and any common sense approach had to be ditched. When I said the game is now unrefereeable, what I meant was that there is now so much bitterness between the two sides, and certain hatred of certain players by fellow players and supporters, that nothing a referee does will really stop it. What it will take is for the managers to make it clear that they should get on with the football rather than settling old scores. If Dermot, or whoever gets the return, goes out and starts carding early, I really don't think it'll stop it. And as Mike showed, even common sense and talking won't help, as it's so easy to be inconsistent and therefore lose the confidence of the players. However, I'm pretty certain the FA will have a word with both teams (managers, coaches, chairmen, players) and tell them that this bad feeling has to stop now. If they don't, I really believe the impact of the referee on the game will be negligable. As for the appointment, I don't know what else the PGMO could really have done. We've now had England's top 4 officials do the PL game, and one of England's most experienced do it, and all it's created is trouble. There are calls for someone like Rob Styles, who went to the Hitler school of man-management, to get the game, as he is a no-nonsense, Don-era ref, who will throw the cards around like confetti. Perhaps the game needs that. But I'd still make one last attempt at putting someone the players can almost associate with, and who they might respect and listen to, on the game, i.e. Dermot. Neale Barry and Alan Wiley are good referees, another two less card-happy referees, who will try to communicate with the players, but whether or not they could handle the game is questionable. Certainly I'd rule out Matt Messias, Any D'Urso, Mike Dean, Phil Dowd, etc. As for Uri, he definitely won't get it. After all, he was interviewed in the summer, just to retain his place on the SG. Plus, he has numerous run ins with SAF that would probably rule him out. As for Mike, he is from Leeds, which is not only a fair bit from Manchester, but Yorkshiremen traditionally hate Mancs. And they showed the 7 pens Mike had given at OT before the game, and of them, 1 was definitely wrong, 2 were highly dubious, and 4 were stonewall. So he has a 50% success rate now!
If the FA is ever serious about bringing in foreign officials to referee their matches, the rematch should be the first attempt at it. I would select Markus Merk or Collina to do the match. Both men know the teams and players from international and Champions League games. They are also used to highly charged, emotional atmospheres from their own home leagues. In an environment as charged as this one will be, it probably makes sense to ensure that the officials are as neutral as can be. The only possible way to do this just might be getting the best officials from other countries to officiate this match. The FA should take this step to eliminate a needless controversy involving home-country referees.
There is no way they will do that. It would end any cred that english referees have left. If the english referees committee did that and I was an english referee I would be looking for them to to gun down. It would be an absolute kick in the teeth if the most advanced referees set up in the world had to call upon a big name like collina or frisk etc to do a game that may have a bit of feeling. I can not see it happening and so it should not. I have to admit I have the same opinion as blatter, the referee who causes upraw is probably doing just as good to the game as if he had had a prefect game. This forum is an example of that. At the expense of poor Mike we have had something to talk about and really critically analyse since sunday. Thats why I love this game and love the job I do. And with news paper articles solely on referees performances only keeps me on my toes that much more. Hell give me the game. I'm not baised, I hate them both.
Let D'Urso do it. He could throw out as many yellows as he wanted, but he'd forget to send anyone off. Best of both worlds!
In the US, we've seen the highlights and also the replay on Fox... I viewed the game with some top-ranked referees in St. Louis, MO. Our consensus: Mr. Riley had an average game but he - and his AR - missed a potential send off when van Nistelroy fouled Cole AND gave a PK which was at least borderline. We thought there was no/minimal contact and NOT deserving a (potentially) game deciding PK. We are neither ManU nor Arsenal supporters...we just like good soccer.