Make Copa America 4 year west hemisphere tournament

Discussion in 'Copa América Centenario 2016' started by olckicker, Jul 4, 2006.

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  1. efernandez9

    efernandez9 Member

    Jun 6, 1999
    Joe Pool Lake
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    the invite of japan was pure business and sort of an 'order' from FIFA, they were about to co-host the wc02, fifa wanted them to advance to second round (longer exposure on the Tube) and be in well standings with international opinion

    that is why they invented the confederations championship, that is to be staged the year before the WC at the same venue where the next WC will take place. Recall confe cup in germany last yr? and the same will happen in 2009 in south africa!
     
  2. fox3c

    fox3c New Member

    Jul 5, 2003
    Kentucky
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA


    Yeah, were assuming that only 5-10% of the population has any interest, and Brazil is a fairly sizable country. It was just supposed to be a rough estimate sort of thing anyhow.
     
  3. Lime-ade

    Lime-ade New Member

    May 31, 2006
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    I wasn't slamming you or anything, just putting the economic factors in perspective, which was your aim as well I think.

    People know the US is big and rich, they sometimes just don't know how big and rich. One state would be the 6th biggest economy in the world and even without that state the US would still be the world's largest economy. And then some people think we should have public transportation between LA and Chicago, other than airplanes, despite their being 1700 miles apart, which even then is only half the country.
     
  4. dcsundevil2002

    Apr 20, 2006
    Ashburn, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    What I was saying is this -

    16 teams means more matches, means more tickets, means more people staying in more hotels, means more people buying food and beer and such. Having 16 teams instead of 10 or 12 means that there is more revenue for the host nation. Simple...little...equation.
     
  5. dcsundevil2002

    Apr 20, 2006
    Ashburn, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What I was talking about was CONMEBOL expanding its tournament to allow for 6 CONCACAF "guests." Not merging the two regions. I do not think a regional merger would benefit anyone.

    Frankly, I like that the USA will pretty much always qualify for the World Cup, and that is due to the fact that we are a Big Fish in a very small bowl. If we had to qualify against the CONMEBOL nations, do I think we would make the 2010 WC? If there were 8 spots for the larger group, yeah, maybe #5 or 6. That is why I think would suck to merge the regions.

    I do think that expanding the Copa would benefit both parties. It would increase the revenue for CONMEBOL and the host nation and give the USA a better quality tournament to play in.

    CONMEBOL would get higher revenues from a 16 nation tournament, especially if someone like FSC or ESPN tried to get the viewing rights to broadcast in the USA. The host nation would benefit simply because there would be more people attending more matches. As shown in Germany, the USA is starting to get a large amount of fans that will travel to attend tournaments. More people means more tickets sold, more hotel rooms booked, more beer sold and so on.

    The USA would get a higher quality competive tournament in a forgien nation that will blood our players and give them better experiance.

    These are good reasons all around. Will The USA or Mexico ever win the Copa? Mexico probably will, and the USA might. If the USA ever wins the tournament, Brasil and Argentina would definately make sure that their players are allowed to play in a tournament that is not during the Euro league time frame.
     
  6. El Cabrito

    El Cabrito Member

    Dec 22, 2002
    Ca
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    There is no debating the impact of the US dollar. What i was getting at is exactly how many people who wearn't already watching Copa America will we gain by adding the US to the tournament. In my opinion the amount gained won't be as high as some are touting.

    What i'm getting at is while it is true that the US does infact have a good sized socccer viewing population most of them do not particularly follow the US national team. Hence I fail to see exactly how the US will attract so much more money by being in it.

    Please don't get me wrong I belive the US would be a positive effect on the tournament because they would be another decent team... but the economic impact is being over stated.
     
  7. dcsundevil2002

    Apr 20, 2006
    Ashburn, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    I am not so sure about this. I have been following the USMNT since 1990, and I was shocked at how many US Soccer fans went to Germany for the WC. If the build up that we had for that is even halved, I would still say that a large number of US Soccer fans would attend the tournament. I didn't even go to Germany, yet I am thinking of heading down to Venezuela for the Copa, if the USA takes part.
     
  8. Caturro

    Caturro Member

    Aug 3, 2004
    Chile
    Club:
    Santiago Wanderers
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    You probably missed the point I was trying to make. Are we talking about the quality of the teams involved in the tournament or the money being generated by it?

    Obviously a bigger tournament will generate more income (if only to the host country, might I add because anything that goes to CONMEBOL ends up in Leoz's pockets). The economic benefit of having the US in the tournament is questionable at best, seeing the lack of interest here in the US and the lack of interest that the team will generate in South America.

    As far as the quality of futbol improving because of CONCACAF competition, save for Mexico, is a moot point. Like I said, CONMEBOL has been doing alright the past few years... even smaller teams have accomplished relevant things.
     
  9. Caturro

    Caturro Member

    Aug 3, 2004
    Chile
    Club:
    Santiago Wanderers
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    Well, consider the factors: it was the WORLD CUP, and it was in GERMANY. As an example, I doubt many Americans hold both Copa America AND Venezuela in high regard. If the US was to participate this Copa America, do you really think they'd have enough people to fill have of a stadium? Please, futbol is not yet a strong enough magnet for tourists in the US.
     
  10. fox3c

    fox3c New Member

    Jul 5, 2003
    Kentucky
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA


    It would certainly need some time to grow, and you'd need to bring ESPN, univision, or some other network on board that would promote it. But it could be done. Before 1990 the world cup wasn't even on US tv typically. But 15 years later, the ratings and viewership are doing quite well relative to other sports, and major networks are paying hundreds of millions of dollars for television rights for future cups. Enough hype will also bring more traveling crowds to "experience" it.
     
  11. dcsundevil2002

    Apr 20, 2006
    Ashburn, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    Exactly. Once the US Soccer fans start putting the Copa America down on their calendar and we can watch them on TV, more of us will want to come down and spend two or so weeks in a CONMEBOL nation for a tournament.

    You have got to build it slowly, but it will work and you will soon see the Stars and Stripes on Soccer fans in the stadiums.
     
  12. leonidas

    leonidas Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    May 25, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    i think it's possible. im sure english-language rights are available for next year's copa america. i mean, espn2 or something can show some of the bigger games involving brazil and argentina and mexico...and then the other games can go to like ESPNU or classic or something.

    i would think that US Soccer would have to start lobbying now though to get into the 2011 tournament.
     
  13. Argentine Futbol

    Argentine Futbol Red Card

    Feb 21, 2003
    Old Greenwich, CT
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    I think we should not invite Mexico.. We should invite other Concacaf countries that need the experience or the atmosphere.
     
  14. efernandez9

    efernandez9 Member

    Jun 6, 1999
    Joe Pool Lake
    there is 2 guest teams in 2007: mexies and CR
    there is talk to add one more grp - that could be very well what you are dreaming of

    so is very posible....


    what they need to do is have top 2 teams from copa America qualify directly to the WC....and take a spot or 2 from the confederation that offers the runners up for the title
    I will like to see also the .5 spot from both confederations to be played in this continent, not vs Oceania or asia
     
  15. JAIME CHILE

    JAIME CHILE Member+

    Apr 26, 2006
    V.Alemana y Stgo
    Club:
    Cobreloa Calama
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    12 NT's (10+Mexico&USA) it's ok in my opinion.

    I saw Trinidad&Tobago and Costa Rica in WC, and they would have problems to play against Chile, Perú, Colombia, Uruguay, but if they want to play in C.A., let's go! (but with 14 we have problems with the fixture: we need 12 or 16). I'd like to see Surinam NT in C.A., but I know they can't.

    PS: No saudies and japaneses (it's C.AMÉRICA) please.
     
  16. leg_breaker

    leg_breaker Member

    Dec 23, 2005
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    America has a very small football support base, it's not a lucrative market for anything other than NFL, baseball, basketball or nascar. I'd bet not even 0.5% of Americans know what the copa america is.

    There's no need for a merger because in the current system, conmebol can invite the supposedly 'lucrative' teams, whilst still keeping all the power.
     
  17. gromit

    gromit Member

    Jun 20, 2006
    Wallace's House
    I see very little downside to making it a 16 team tournament roughly concurrent with the European Championships. I can understand the S. American purist point of view, but it would an opportunity for the S. American teams to prove their superiority especially if they are able to field "A" teams.

    Involving six Concacaf qualifiers in addition to guaranteeing the ten CONMEBOL nations seems like a great format. For this to really fly from a USA perspective we need to get MLS to either take a break for the tourney (and the WC, too!) or adopt a Fall to Spring calendar.

    Getting the U.S. and Mexico involved has got to make the tournament more lucrative overall just through selling additional media and marketing rights. In addition, the U.S. would probably eventually host the tournament.

    Makes too much sense. Never happen. ;)
     
  18. Dan-ny-m398

    Dan-ny-m398 Member

    Aug 25, 2004
    Long Island NY
    Club:
    Olimpia Asuncion
    Nat'l Team:
    Paraguay
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    According to the US Department of State, there are 29 countries with travel warnings, Colombia is the only Souith American country on the list.

    Are you serious?? bringing up the US Department of State statistics , to try to prove a point wich is totally ridiculous, you can bring CIA stats too if you want, but the bottom line is that USA-Paraguay will not sell out in a Venezuelan stadium even if you post NSA stats, the bottom line is the same, The US usually have a significant group of people willing to travel to see the Nats play. Venezuela,like most country, have American ex- pat community. Chavez can say alot of things about the American Gov't, but I doubt he will turn away American fans with deep pockets.

    Really??? U think we can sell out a 50,000 seat staduim??

    Furthermore, The US is a TV market is huge. In the past, marketing companies over- estimate the value of their TV contracts. This resulted in the US not being to view some matches. With the ratings rising, "The Mouse" and other networks may be willing to shellout the money. BTW, TV rights is a huge cash cow in the sporting world, so this would be a BIG deal for any organization.

    SO you think ESPN is ready to go throw a NBA type of money for the tv rights of Copa America?? well I guess U didin't know that Telemundo owns the rights to copa america in the US, and they bought it for a couple of six packs and some change, so that is all the TV money we can get from the US for now.

    Is funny how people that have nothing to do with our Copa , telling us what we should do with it,
     
  19. dcsundevil2002

    Apr 20, 2006
    Ashburn, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I agree. Very true.
     
  20. Lime-ade

    Lime-ade New Member

    May 31, 2006
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA

    No funnier than you writing this from Long Island, NY.
     
  21. Dan-ny-m398

    Dan-ny-m398 Member

    Aug 25, 2004
    Long Island NY
    Club:
    Olimpia Asuncion
    Nat'l Team:
    Paraguay
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA


    I wish it was that simple, but if you have a 16 teams and some of them are Guatemala, Honduras , Trinidad Tobago and Panama, doesn't really mean more tickets, to give you an example U think we can sell out Guatamela-Bolivia game?? or a Panama-Peru game?? and by having those two games we would be missing a Peru-Ecuador , or a Bolivia-Chile, they might not sound great games to you, but we have our rivalries and they are fun for us, that is the reason we don't want to get more teams that would not bring any benefits to our copa, we would have to make 4 groups and we would not have the games we want to see, take Paraguay-Uruguay, wich is more of a karate tournament than anything and if we see a goal in that game is a mayor plus, well it sells out everytime is played, so your logic of 2+2=4 doesn't really apply to our tournament.
     
  22. Dan-ny-m398

    Dan-ny-m398 Member

    Aug 25, 2004
    Long Island NY
    Club:
    Olimpia Asuncion
    Nat'l Team:
    Paraguay
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA


    What's so funny about that?? most of the members here are writing from somewhere inside the US.
     
  23. Dan-ny-m398

    Dan-ny-m398 Member

    Aug 25, 2004
    Long Island NY
    Club:
    Olimpia Asuncion
    Nat'l Team:
    Paraguay
    Re: New format about COPA AMERICA


    Somehow I'm missing the relevance of this to Copa America, how is this going to make a Bolivia-Guatemala, game more profitable??
     
  24. El Cabrito

    El Cabrito Member

    Dec 22, 2002
    Ca
    I hope this point hasn't been made,

    But why do US fans feel the need to change a perfectly good competition when they rarley participate in it?

    What the US should do is accept their Copa America invitation on a CONSITENT basis and show some respect for the tournament. Then, perhaps after a couple of years of participating they can ask to be put in the waiting list to host the darn thing....
     
  25. Vinotinto10

    Vinotinto10 New Member

    Sep 8, 2005
    Miami,FL
    that's True,you could not be more right.
     

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