I'd argue that anyone hanging on to the outdated meme of MLS as a retirement league isn't much of a "soccer fan".
And this is where the "battle" lies between the owners. On one side you have the owners who are wedded to the old media model (which is crazy seeing as the RSN's are essentially dead, or barely hanging on in a select few markets), and blindly still believe in it. On the other side you have the owners who see how the landscape has and is rapidly changing and don't want to end up on the outside looking in. Now the question becomes how does the league make their product more compelling for the out of stadium viewer? That's what's ultimately going to drive sponsorship and media revenue upward. The calendar flip also limits their options for the next TV deal too. Ask yourselves this: where and how do NBC, ABC, CBS(Paramount), and/or Fox fit MLS into their broadcast schedule? Saturday and Sunday nights/afternoons? Those are out (American football). Sunday nights on NBC are already spoken for (NFL-NBA-MLB). Same with ESPN/ABC. ABC is not going to give you the time slot that American Idol and Dancing with Stars has currently. Paramount just went from paying $75M/season for the rights to broadcast Serie A, to paying them $10M per season....... Outside of Amazon and Apple who's going to give MLS more than they currently are getting? I don't know the answers. One thing I do know is the way things were prior to 2023, didn't work. Certainly not for the broadcast companies who either weren't interested at all, or not enough to pay more than they did previously. Things are far from perfect now too. IMO, the league has fumbled a very good opportunity and platform to grow the league's profile amongst current and potential new fans.
The retort is a league that has only had one team win their continental tournament in the last twenty years and can only draw because of a few thirty something year old players isn't worth watching. They can see the young talent once they get transferred to a real league. . I love MLS but they can't get to the Club World Cup without hosting it tells you those fans will stay ignorant to what's really happening without a reason to watch.
I will also say that league IMO missed a golden opportunity with the calendar change as well. They talk about giving the regular season more stakes. USL wants to add Pro/Rel to give their seasons more stakes. LigaMX has proven that you don't need Pro/Rel to make the regular season have meaning. MLS should have seriously considered having two sprint seasons like LigaMX has. That way the regular season has high stakes. You know..... just like the NFL..... Except now you have even more meaningly games, plus even more playoff game inventory for the media partners.
This is true but at the same time you the league should give Apple a reason to increase the payout in the future. Since Apple and MLS have worked together by shortening the deal and moving to Apple TV without a pay wall, you can at least assume they both see value and want to grow together still. Selling FOX on spending more for the linear deal would be the next target you would imagine. How and when they broadcast those games I'm not quite sure but they did mention their numbers are up this year as well.
And again, way too many die-hards (on both sides) are way too tied up in the CCC results. 80%, 90%, 95% even of MLS's potential audience they're trying to gain does not care, probably barely even knows, what the CCC results are. The CCC results are a 'nice to have' but won't be meaningful until FIFA can prove that last year's CWC isn't a one off and is something that can be sustained at that interest level over multiple cycles. MLS owners know this. They know their road to growth isn't winning the CCC and showing up in the CWC every 4 years and getting the die-hards who show up at the bar at 9am on Saturday mornings to watch the EPL. There's not enough of a market there. Their road to real, sustained, 'push into the top 4' growth is converting the average American sports fan who's already dedicated to one or more leagues in this country to also add MLS to their rotation. You only need a small slice of the American sports fan who already follows some combination of the NFL/MLB/NBA/NHL/college to get massive growth in MLS.
I think it's more about the next generation. People aren't suddenly going to switch from NFL, MLB, NBA or NHL to MLS.
For that to happen those fans will need to like soccer too to begin with. With EPL and Liga MX easily accessible here why would they choose MLS? That's the entire point. What has MLS done to get those fans that are on the fence? @wantmlsphilly has a point, MLS is just seen as a retirement league that gets way past their prime stars and its quality is subpar. Getting one or two "stars" in their latter years isn't enough. Now before you say that's not what MLS is, you are right, we know because we follow MLS. Those that don't, well, they still hold to that idea.
For the same reason I started watching MLS. For the same reason everyone else in this forum started watching MLS. For the same reason Dutch fans watch Eredivisie, Belgian fans watch the Pro and Swiss fans watch Super League when the Premier League and Bundesliga are available. Bus fare from Moenchengladbach to Brussels is $20.
Sure, but the road to that isn't "Win the CCC regularly so that we have teams appearing every 4 years in a competition that might or might not show up on the average American sports fan's radar".
If we use our reason as to why we started watching MLS and think it applies to everyone else then MLS would already be the most popular soccer league here in the US. Liga MX and EPL would be fighting for scraps in the US market.
According to reports coming out of MLS HQ its not exactly "fighting for scraps". It does have to put up with other leagues being on free to air TV but that's not going to last.
Not necessarily just that but it would help. It comes down to quality. Better quality will give you better results. MLS constantly losing just makes it seem that it is behind in quality. As for the CWC, that's played every year. Well now renamed Intercontinental Cup. Liga MX has played it 20(?) times. Would winning it have helped and put MLS on notice? Maybe. Only European and South American clubs have won it so we don't know what perception it would have created for MLS if they had ever won it.
Didn't say MLS was fighting for scraps. But if people would watch MLS for the same reason we watch it then Liga MX and EPL wouldn't have a chance in the US market. Do you care about the quality of MLS? Nope. Neither do I. Do you care that MLS doesn't have "history"? Nope. Neither do I. Do you care MLS has no ProRel? Nope. Neither do I. And I can continue but you get the point. The reasons we have for watching MLS doesn't apply to others. They watch EPL and Liga MX for their own reason and those two together outnumber every MLS fan. They are more than us, that's just a fact. The question is how do you get them to follow MLS instead of following a league that is in a different country of their own?
You're assuming that none of the fans who watch the Premier League and Liga MX watch MLS. But that's not the case. I was at Yankee Stadium when they delayed kickoff because the FA Cup Final went into extra time. There's an overlap. You can enjoy both. You can enjoy all 3. Just because a million people watch the Premier League game that's on OTA on a Saturday afternoon doesn't mean those million people don't watch MLS. 660,000 people on average watch MLS games in the flesh.
I guess. Then there is nothing the owners should be worried about. Everyone that needs to watch MLS is already doing it.
Which, again, is not what anyone said. You just like making up strawmen instead of actually discussing points don't you?
I've noticed that some of you don't read what other people post and when someone replies and the reply doesn't jibe with what you haven't read you come up with "it's just strawman or you like making stuff up".
And your quote proves that how? Where does it state "Then there is nothing the owners should be worried about. Everyone that needs to watch MLS is already doing it."? In fact it very explicitly calls out that there are two different strategies on how to get more people to watch MLS, but at no point does it say "Everyone that needs to watch MLS is already doing it".
I was replying to Paul. I could have kept on replying but with Paul, and some of you, it doesn't matter. You guys always have a counter as to why things are good.
First off, this isn't my point but what was said by the owners in the book. Mas is the main owner pushing this and it was one of the points Messi made after winning MLS Cup. Messi finally signed because of the stadium and the thought things will be changing. He also doesn't see himself as a coach or working in TV so he's looking at his equity in the team and how he will influence as an owner. On day one when he sat down with the GM he asked what trophies he can win. When MLS executives broke down into Pods to come up with what they need to do this is what the book revealed. They believe that to become one of the leagues of choice you need to be able to compete in international competition. As always, it's just the evolution of the league.
Well, you could argue it isn't on the radar because they never win. In almost every American sport winning can change things. If by some miracle the US wins the World Cup, I can see more people caring about it. It seems to have made a difference for the woman.
But that's apples and oranges. The World Cup is the primary competition for national teams and every national team is in the competition at some level. The CWC and the CCC are at best secondary competitions that teams don't even play in every year (unless your name is Barcelona or Real Madrid). A club's primary competition is their league.
Would Barcelona or Real Madrid rather win La Liga or UCL? Even looking at it from a financial perspective which is better to win? Same for MLS. Winning MLS Cup is $300k. Winning CCC is $5M plus whatever FIFA gives out to play in the Intercontinental Cup at the end of year plus whatever amount they'll give just for qualifying for the group stage of the CWC. As an MLS fan, which is better? My guess is you'll have different answers. But for owners winning CCC is definitely more beneficial than winning the MLS Cup.
And the discussion was how do we bring in more eyes to watch. This was one of the points, win ten times and your fans will care. I know I hear Sounder fans remind everyone that they've won the CCL. I would think I Messi was in the final plenty of eyes would have been on that game around the world.