Los Angeles - San Jose W.C. Semi Game 1 (Saturday, 11/1) postgame thread [R]

pardon the "troll"...

That's far too simplistic. Dallas sucked all season. The Galaxy started off w/ a brutal 8 game road stretch and never got into a groove. The 2nd to last game of the season, things started to click and LA is now showing that it is a dangerous side. It finished 9th best in MLS, but during the summer it held it's own vs. some pretty tough competition in Korea (Nacional, 1860 Munchen and PSV) WITHOUT Pescadito.

LA has come to life at the right time. It was always there, which is why its fans have been so frustrated. Granted, a generous playoff system has given them new life, but they're still a quality side.

Hey, if SJ can come back from this deficit, it will win the Cup. My prediction...

 

Honest assessment

I wouldn't trade Yallop for any coach in the league but I think the following blame can be laid at Frank's feet:

1. Onstad: anyone claiming he was faultless on that critical first goal is simply not being honest with themselves. Teams are going to get chances no matter how good your defense is, and that opportunity was a fluke. The fact is the Galaxy have had about three meaningful shots in the last two games and Pat hasn't stopped one of them. Once again Onstad was timid, stayed on his line and was slow to react. See: my same comments about Onstad going back to April.

2. Slow center backs: Agoos and Dayak were exploited - perhaps intentionally. Balls were dropped over the top of them, I think because Sigi knows Onstad is hesitant to come off his line.

3. Chris Roner: Is anyone surprised that our plucky nobodies aren't a match for the likes of Cobi Jones when the playoffs come around and push comes to shove?

4. Faria: His dreadful performance was as predictable as his insertion to the game.

5. Waibel: Losing 2-0, desperately needing a goal and looking short of answers, we lose a ball-holding, left-sided midfielder to injury. Into the game comes - not Artruo Alvarez - but - incredibly - impossibly - Craig Waibel. A poor defender with no ball skill whatsoever. I think Yallop betrayed his justification for this when he said being down two goals wasn't so bad, but three was a mountain. Batsh!t-looney-fricking BIZARRO.

6. The Not Ready for Prime Time Players: We have too few top shelf players. It's fine and dandy to be the best darn team in the league when everybody else is gearing up, but the playoffs is not the time to find out you're squad is not good enough. Add to that they've seemed flat, taken by surprise and unorchestrated/lacking ideas in attack. Did we leave the offense to figure things out for themselves? I think Frank has said as much.

Despite attempts to deflect our disappointment onto the league schedule and structure... We all know how the league works, it's NOT Britain, and THIS is when you have to perform. The Quakes can't shed great players, sit on allocations, then have Yallop turn around and say "Regardless of the playoffs, we've done well considering the players we lost." That's offensive.

NOT Yallop's fault:

Injuries to DeRo and Corrales: the real turning point and bigger than all the above. I'm not giving up on Sunday, but I'd feel a lot better about our chances with these two in the game and on their game.

 

Noah, I agree with your criticisms of Yallop. While I wouldn't trade him for another coach, I fully expect that he will get the Canadian National Team job when the MLS season is over. So I'm thinking that like it or not, we have to replace him.

Onstad is not nearly as good as Joe Cannon. Of course, I don't think we ever had a chance to get Joe back, even when he came back from France, if we had cut Onstad for Cannon, we probably didn't have the cap room. I'm sure that Cannon is more expensive than Pat.

On the slow center backs, yeah, we should have drafted faster center backs, but we do have Robinson who is coming on well. Too bad he's injured. For that matter, too bad Agoos and Dayak aren't 100%.

Roner is not ready at right back. That sucks, but it wouldn't cripple us if Agoos, Dayak, and Robinson were healthy. Of course, losing Conrad sucked, but again, we were up against the cap.

Faria sucks. No he's not quite as bad as Harut, but he still sucks. Partly it's lack of fitness, partly it's lack of coordination with his teammates, partly it's lack of desire. Whatever, it adds up to this guy wouldn't be on the bench if Ching was healthy.

Waibel is crap. He might be ok as a sub for a center back, but as a starter he's crap. He also needs to learn to stop fouling every opposing player he encounters. I hope we cut him immediately after the season ends, say, Monday.

The Not Ready For Prime Time Players. Yeah, this one is entirely Yallop's fault. Even assuming that we don't have enough "Stars" on the team, Yallop should have had the guys hungry, focused, and driven when they stepped on the pitch. And he shouldn't have served them Pete's Wicked Ale at halftime! Sheesh! Our guys came out of the locker room completely flat for the second half. What sort of pep talk was that?!

In any case, this team, these players, are going to have find some sort of fire within to drive them through this next match. Someone on the team has got to light a fire under the players. Now is when we miss Cannon and Barrett's will to win.

GO QUAKES!!

- Mark

 

I just wonder what, if any, effect whatever it was that went on in the tunnel between Dayak and Ruiz had on the locker room at halftime.

 

Whatever effect it had on the Quakes, it may well have fired up the filth.

Towards the end of the game, I thought that Mullan, Walker, Dunivant, Dayak, Roner, and Waibel were still playing hard, though not necessarily well. While the rest of the guys appeared to be sleep walking. Even Dayak seemed a bit out of it. Donovan was nearly invisible. Russell either ran out of steam or just lost interest. Agoos was completely off his game after playing reasonably well in the first half.

Whatever went on in the Quakes locker room during halftime, it sure as hell wasn't inspiring. The coaches really need to make sure that the guys stayed focused and fired up. Instead, they came out sleeping walking in the second half.

I hope our new coach or coaches don't make that mistake again.

GO QUAKES!!

- Mark

 

Sorry Wayne but Faria has been USELESS for the Quakes and I said as much right after we signed him. He didn't add anything to the offense when he was subbed in and he looked like he was sleepwalking through the whole match. Start Walker or DeRo if he's healthy, use Alvarez instead of Lagos or just chuck the whole thing and start a thug lineup and beat the crap out of Ruiz and the galaxatives, literally. If we're not going to win why not injure them to the point that they can't win the cup?

 

Wait a minute, Tom, we may split hairs here, but I was objecting to the comparison with Harut. I said that I don't think he is as bad as Karapetyan. I did not say that he was good, or that he was doing the team any good, at least at the present time. The one thing I have said all along, on Faria's behalf, is that it is going to take some time before he gets in sync with the team. The very fact that he is out there may be even damaging team chemistry. He could improve with time, but unfortunately, we don't have that time. [add] I also agree with you about starting Walker. He's paid a hell of a lot more dues, he's got club seniority, and ought to get the starting position.

 

I still can't forgive the Germans for bombing Pearl Harbor.

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The reason we can't have a single table championship is because of the lack of relegation and UEFA/Champions League spots. Through the end of the season, teams are fighting against relegation or for a spot at European competition. Only a few teams are not in danger of relegation nor in reach of Europe. I highly doubt that there will ever be true relegation in the US. A greater North American/Central American competition is more likely, but the US has too few teams and the majority of Central America is too poor.

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I don't blame Onstad for the goals, but he certainly isn't prepared for the playoffs due to his unfamiliarity with the playoffs and his age. Another problem between him and the defense is the apparent lack of communication. Cannon barks out orders, where Onstad is a bit more timid. Perhaps Saunders will be a better fit.

 

.. even though they were Japanese

 

Agreed. American oligarchs who own sports franchises have no interest in taking the potential financial hit(s) involved with relegation (ie, lowered interest/attendance).

Can you imagine how much money teams like us (with an already small fanbase) or Chicago/NE/Col/NYNJ (who pay to play in monolithic NFL stadiums) would conceivably lose? I also can't fathom a team keeping a talented player like Landon or Ruiz if the team was demoted. Thus, interest sinks. Then, of course, there's the issue of minor-league teams who do not have pro quality facilities getting promoted. What are they going to do? Pull money out of thin air to build pro stadiums?

America is just not soccer-crazed enough to support relegated franchises, and may never be. With little exception, we Americans barely support/acknowledge our minor leagues in other, more popular sports. Just not our mentality. Look at the "national pastime", baseball. Most minor league teams, at all levels, get minimal support and use lots of gimmicks to try to bring people in. Look at football. When NFL Europe originally started, half the teams were in the US. But no one supported them, so they moved the whole league over there to cut travel expenses. Look at hoops. Nobody went to the CBA games, and the league went bye-bye. Look at hockey. One of the two highest-level minor leagues in North America, the IHL, folded a couple years ago, moving a few teams to the surviving league, the AHL.

In all cases, there are of course exceptions. Usually these are minor league teams in cities who do not have pro teams in the same sport, like Portland in soccer and Providence in hockey. But those teams are always in the minors, and the odds don't bear out that relegated franchises could survive long in this country, IMHO.

Could overall interest in minor league sports improve if there was a possibility of promotion to the "big leagues"? Possibly. But I doubt it would be enough to make a difference. And that makes relegation (in any sport) highly unlikely.

I presume you mean a competition like the CONCACAF Champions Cup, but with more advertising money and television?

 

Go watch Animal House, then come back here

Any updates on injuries to DeRosario and Corrales?

 

Yes, let's.

Prior to the expansion of 1969, both Major Leagues played a single-table format.

From 1969-1997, even divisional play could still have been called a single-table format (division champions played division champions for the league championship and the right to represent their league in the World Series).

Since 1997, the silliness of extra tiers of playoffs have ruined baseball. And why? Because there's extra money to be made from gate receipts and TV revenue.

Does MLS have the cachet to command greater gate receipts and TV revenue from its post season? No. Gates are below average, and TV coverage, let alone revenue, is non-existent.

Therefore, the argument can be made that the MLS post-season hurts the league more than it helps, because there's been no demonstrated need for more tiers of playoffs...since no one's watching.

 

My 2 cents. Sorry if I'm rehashing points already made many times in this thread, but I don't have time to review all these posts and edit:

Playoff format:

I think it's possible to have your cake and eat it too. That is, make the regular season mean something and have a playoff system with at least the potential for more revenue. You just need to give the teams that did well in the regular season more advantage. For example, shorten the regular season a little bit and play a 3-game aggregate goal series. The team with the better record gets 2 home games. Plus maybe give them tie-breaker advantage.

This would give most teams something to fight for down to the end, even the teams fighting for 2nd vs. 3rd spot, etc. And it gives the team with the better record real advantage. As it is now, I think it may be an advantage to be the team with the worse record. If you play the 1st game at home and get a lead, you can bunker down and play defensive soccer and make it very difficult for the team with "home field advantage".

Frank:

"Frank can't coach in the playoffs": Uh, he did pretty well in 2001. Did he suddenly forget "how to coach in the playoffs". I don't think so.

Halftime: There's a lot of people out there who seem to know what he said or didn't say in the locker room last Saturday night. Does anyone really know? For all we know it could have been the greatest motivational speech in the history of sport. The result wasn't good, but that doesn't necessarily mean he didn't say the right thing, etc. Besides, these guys are professional players in the playoffs. They don't need someone to tell them why they should be motivated. Who knows, maybe he over-motivated them from the outset and they overdid it in the first half, then came out a little tired in the second.

Frank's comment to the effect of "No matter what, we've had a good season": A lot of people are reading into this that he doesn't really care about the playoffs or something like that. I think nothing could be further from the truth. It's a fairly subtle psychological thing, but I think what he's trying to do here is get the team to relax a bit. If you go in thinking "if we blow this game, it's all that work for nothing", you're going to feel pressure. When you feel pressure, you're liable to play tight. On the other hand the team that feels like they've got nothing to lose, "lucky to be here" is going to be loose. I think he was trying to counteract that psychology a bit. Didn't appear to help much so far, anyway.

Chances of winning:

Yeah, it's pretty bleak. Small field, Gals bunkering down, Quakes weak in the air, possibly missing DeRo and Corrales, Gals dangerous on the counter, etc. But you can't give up. Good players never give up. If they did, we'd never have great comebacks in sports. And good fans don't give up either.

One Quakes goal and you'll feel a huge momentum surge that could carry them to a miraculous victory. The Quakes should play inspired, a little pissed off, and a little desperate, like it's their last soccer game ever. They'll have to channel their emotions so they don't do something stupid, like get a red card. But they've got to play with a sense of controlled desperation and a lot of passion.

There's very little margin for error. Another Gals goal would be really tough. But it's actually a bit better than "down 2-0 at halftime". There's 90 minutes left.

 

Spot on J. The lowest seeded teams shouldn't be given the luxury of any home fixtures. It can totally negate the "earned" advantage of the higher seed, as we've seen in this series.

Of course, we're the only ones whining about the playoff format (so far) because we're the only higher seed who hasn't taken care of business.

 

Right On Spartacus! Will you lead us in a rebellion against the fascist scum that run MLS?!



Oh, sorry. Wrong millenium.


But yeah, I'd much rather see a drastically curtailed MLS post season. How about this? The top six (rather than eight) teams make the playoffs. Eastern team 2 hosts Eastern team 3 in a single game playoff. Western team 2 hosts Western team 3 in a playoff. Both team 1s get a week of rest. Both team 1s host the winners of the 2 vs. 3 playoffs. The winners play for the MLS Cup.

It's a much shorter post season. It gives the top teams a solid home field advantage. It's pretty easy to schedule because it's short. With four of ten teams missing, each regular season game becomes a little bit more important. With twelve teams, it puts even more pressure on each team to win as many games as possible. Still not as good as relagation, but certainly better than the current system. (And I've advocated this in years past. I didn't pick six teams just to exclude the filth.)

GO QUAKES!!

- Mark

 

And while Faria isn't really as bad a Harut (a little artistic license there), he sure costs a lot more. If all of our forwards were healthy: Donovan, DeRo, Ching, Jamil, Faria. Who would you cut? Do you even have to think about it? You cut Faria. He's expensive, he's not as good as any of the other guys, he's got less upside than Jamil, and we could use the salary cap savings to get some more defenders (or maybe get Joe Cannon back?).

GO QUAKES!!

- Mark

 

COME AND SEE THE VIOLENCE INHERENT IN THE SYSTEM!

HELP! HELP! I'M BEING REPRESSED! I'M BEING REPRESSSED!

 

Thanks Spartacus. I needed a giggle.

No matter what the playoff system is, or might be, or might never be, the ugly truth is that when it counted this year, our guys didn't show up.

We can try blaming the league, the coaches, the fires, whatever. The bottom line is, when it was time to step up and show our stuff, we wussed out.

So I'm depressed. And I hate the freaking galactofilth. (Could you believe the nerve of that F###ing weasel that said we should be upset by "parity?" I've got your parity right here scum-bug!) But the fact is, when it counted most, our guys didn't step up and play like champs.

Yes they could somehow miraculously pull it out. They are certainly capable of walloping the stinking, evil filth three or four to nil. But it's going to be really tough.

GO QUAKES!!

- Mark

 

Another good example of how to have both a meaningful regular season and playoffs. The only thing I don't like about this one is the single game playoffs. That leaves a lot to chance. The shorter the playing time, the greater the chance that the inferior team will win due to some lucky play.

 

That's why I like the Australian system of giving the higher seeds a guaranteed "double chance".

Classic example, Brisbane Lions finished 3rd in the regular season table, lost to #2 Collingwood in the opening round, worked their way back through the lower bracket and ended up beating Collingwood in the final. In a single-elimination format, the best team in Australia would have been gone in the first round, but the "double-chance" allowed them to work back to the final and win (for the 3rd straight year).

 

Well supposedly the big reason there are less playoff games this season is because they tend to draw poorly.

So instead of this hybrid (first round home and away, then single elimination), it should've been simply single elimination the whole way to the Cup, with the top seeded team hosting the game.

Simple, isn't it? L.A. at San Jose. Next?

 

P.S.

Said format would've gone a long way toward combatting MetroStars Playoff Fever.

 

Yup. The question is, how do you increase revenue, or prestige? The Champions Cup is not a priority for most or all MLS teams or Mexican teams. Why? MLS team are more concerned with winning the following: MLS Cup, Open Cup, Supporters Shield and Conference title.

Possibly the lynchpin of an effort to raise the profile of the Champions Cup is the prize money. What do you get for winning the Championship? Is it competitive with other prize money/incentives. Increased prize money = increased desire by the clubs = increased advertising money. Maybe.

There is also the point that at least for the US, the depth at the club level isn't there. There's enough potential talent, but the realized talent is another thing.

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Also BM, without intending to completely hijack the thread, I don't believe that soccer at any level (except USMNT/World Cup) will ever generate significant tv exposure/revenue.

 

Just saw the game for the first time last night. A few comments:

Oh, man, Roner was bad. Very bad.

When I listened to the game on the radio, I distinctly heard that Faria was put into the game. I never saw him on TV. Well, outside the header that the announcers described as "muy malo".

WIE. Walker Is Excitement. I'm going to get a T-shirt with that slogan printed on it.

Cobi sucks. His main attribute was speed, and he doesn't have it now. Walker has better dribbling and passing ability than Jones already. Jones is a still a good crosser, though.

What I like about Mulrooney is that he puts a nifty spin on his arcing passes to get the ball to slow down once they reach earth again. This is why his long passes connect while Ekelund's go out to touch. I have noticed this for his medium and long passes this season, but in this game he had a short little pass to Donovan at the end of the game where he used this as well. But in the short grass, the ball just skidded and didn't slow down, so it just was out of Donovan's reach. In Spartan, that would have been a goal for sure.

Bo knows long passes.

 

KC v CO at Invesco last night: Attendance: 6,434

granted it was a Tuesday night....