The Hierro / del bosque / makelele situations were the only ones where we were heartless. Maybe Redondo and Mcmanaman too. Raul would have been gone a couple of seasons before he actually left had he been anyone else. We had better players across the pitch and we used him anyway, shunting him on the left or in midfield to try and see if he would recover form. Compare with, for example, Barca and their Abidal / Etoo / Ronaldinho / Rivaldo / Deco / Yaya Toure / Chigrinski / Ibrahimovic shenanigans and we look like a charity in comparison.
Lulz at the back tracking and strawmaning. You started off with this... Got embarrassed and ran from that to, "YS you insinuated!" got embarrassed again and now you're talking about Cristiano which was never mentioned in your initial post. Soon you will bring up Maradona or Di Stefano. Seriously, anybody who knows Oscar or has discussed/argued with him knows that is what he does. If he's wrong he spins or loses it and goes complete strawman. I think this is hilarious, because dude could have just let it die because he said the wrong shit; instead he just continues to dig and dig deeper. The irony that your first post is literally an example of your posting style is also hilarious. Now continue to give me strawmen or in your words "reasons".
Do these players play for the club or is the club the one subordinate to them? This concept where the club must be slave to certain players just because of history is bamboozling.
Hierro was playing three times worse than Iker currently is. His contract run out and we correctly decided not to extend. Sure there was some bad blood between him and Perez but the decision to let him go was the correct one.
Except the new contract was agreed to, and he was all set to stay. His performances weren't why we let him go. It was his refusal to go out for the extra lap, and defying the orders of the President.
Since you like semantics so much that you keep on jammering about this for post after post pretending you didn't say dumbness: where did I say exactly word for word that YOU said that? Do you see the word Youngstars in front of it? I could have been talking about my neighbour's dog, probably has an equal IQ to you. Quote please. Yes, two can play that game. After your tirade against insinuating, I would be surprised if you used that as an answer. Why would I do that since it was you who brought up that Cristiano would get more support? But then we both know why you keep on broken recording about that line above, and try to ignore everything else you said. Couldn't find more than 3 people who defended him eh? So basically you were full of it again. What else is new.
I was simply pointing out that we have a knack of keeping players longer than we should by being extremely generous with contract extensions. I love Hierro but i'd be lying if i said i wasn't happy things went sour in the end cause i didn't want to sit through another season of him playing.
Hierro was well past it when the club let him go and the only mistake made was agreeing to extend his stay. The idea that he was let go simply due to not doing an extra round is a bit silly. There were several other reasons. The first being the infamous Monte Carlo incident in which Raul and Hierro confronted Florentino when the news came out that Ronaldo was being signed and that their friend Morientes was would risk losing his spot. Refusing to do an extra lap, attempting to stop the Beckham signing, and confronting Florentino about Del Bosque. El Pais' Santiago Segurola wrote back then (Google translation): Here is an article about it. It is called: La noche de las caras largas / The night of the long faces Anyway, here is an supposed account of what transpired. It matches what was reported by Marca and El Pais back then. It is very interesting read: "Phoned my xxx last night to congratulate him on Madrid winning the Liga and to find out just exactly why Florentino had kicked out Del Bosque and Hierro when it was agreed and accepted up to Sunday night that both would continue; Del Bosque for a year and Hierro for two. The decision not to renew Del Bosques contract was taken during the Board meeting yesterday after a three hour discussion - the original plan was to offer him a year's extension on the same wage as before - 2 million Euros plus bonuses. What effectively turned the Board against Del Bosque was the fact that he had hired an ex-vice president, Juan Onieva, as his lawyer to negotiate a pay rise. Onieva was ousted by Florentino at the time of the arrival of Figo. Onieva is one of the most hated enimies of Florentino. Del Bosque knew this and was playing with fire when he hired the lawyer. The other reason not to continue with del Bosque mentioned in the Board meeting was that he had allowed the players too much leeway. This also ties in with the events post Athletico Bilbao and Hierro. As I told you a couple of months ago Florentino and Hierro had come to a gentleman's agreement that gave the player a further two years at the club and then a testimonial. This is what xxxx told me last night. The celebration of the 29th Liga title cost Hierro his head. Instead of a big party it was a disaster. Long faces, dropped heads and insults were the norm during the after match dinner. According to xxxx, the news of Beckham's arrival in the week that the team had to play the decisive Liga game was the last straw for some of the players, lead by Hierro. Hierro had turned Guti against the club and Beckham according to the xxxx's insiders. Hierro had previously attempted a player's revolution just before the Supercup in Monaco in response to the director's treatment of Morientes. The situation between the players and the Board had also grown tense over the renewals of Guti and Solari, as well as Hierro's own renewal. Up until Sunday evening the relationship had been cold, but correct, on Sunday correctness went out of the window. Everything started when the players refused to do a second lap of honour around the grass in the Bernabeau. The excuse given by the players was that there were too many press reporters and photographers on the pitch. But everything had been prepared beforehand. It was the players manner of protesting against the club. Valdano went down to the dressing room to see what was going on. he asked the players to go back up onto the pitch. Hierro told him in blunt terms what he could do with his celebration. xxxx had placed one of his reporters inside the dressing room with the permission of Florentino. The reporter was dressed as a waterboy/groundsman and was a first hand witness to what went on. Valdano told Hierro to stop being an arsehole and the players then refused to go to the Cibeles fountain to do the traditional celebration and they also refused to go to the celebratory ceremonies held yesterday in the town hall and cathedral. Valdano phoned Florentino, who didn't want to answer the call, because he guessed what was happening in the dressing room. Eventually, he answered and told valdano to tell the players that they had to go to the Cibeles and the club dinner. At the Cibeles fountain, the police refused to let the players "crown" the statue of the Godess, but it seemed as if the players had calmed down by the time they got to the restaurant. In the Mesón Txistu, (the restaurant where they always eat after winning something), with xxxx amongst the limited number of guests, things started to go off the rails. At two in the morning the players started chanting "China, china, china" in reference to the planned pre-season tournament of China and Japan. Hierro as spokesman had voiced their refusal to start their pre-season on the Far East on various occasions. Valdano was forced to call the club capitans, Hierro, Figo and Raul away from the tables and he told them to put their house in order. Time and time again for an hour and a half Hierro and company were told to leave their tables and speak to Valdano, much to the surprise of their wives and girlfriends. The result of these comings and goings was that the players refused point blank to celebrate the Liga title infront of their fans the following day. The motive - the growing distance and coolness in the relations between the president and the Board of directors and the players. Raúl told the other players and Valdano told Florentino of the players decision. Florentino was dumbstruck. It was four in the morning and he decided to take control of the situation. Standing up Florentino spoke to everyone in the restaurant: “Good evening, ladies, gentlemen and children (referring to the players). I ask that tomorrow, although many of you don't want to do it, because of what happened in the Cibeles, we put on your best suits and we go and do our duty with the Institutions, the people and the thousands and thousands of madrileños who will be waiting for us in La Almudena, in the Town Hall and in the Community. To turn this into a scandal between grown ups in the best club of the 20th century does not make any sense. And I also want, each time we win a title, to see happy faces because this is the second title that we have celebrated with expresions and moods that do not fit in with winning the Liga. I ask that you show respect for the millions of our fans and that you act like grown ups once and for all. Finally remember this, take it as you like. In this club I'm the boss, not the players!" At half past four Florentino, valdano and the directors left the restaurant. A little later they were followed by Ronaldo, then Mcmanaman with Robbie Fowler. The players had decided to go to the celebrations after an hour of debating. Florentino had breakfast with on Monday morning at eleven thirty - he said, off the record, that "Hierro has opened his mouth for the last time..." and that "we need someone who can kick them (the players) up the arse from time to time..." As reported in the press the only candidate at the moment is the 2nd coach at Manchester United - that's one of the reasons why Figo was called into the Board meeting - Figo is pals with Carlos Queiroz and the club wanted him to be an intermediary. Figo was also told to buck up and it was made clear that he was not untouchable.
^That is a pretty cool read but sorry, I don't believe it. Maybe am not remembering those times correctly but there wasn't as much controversy as that article claims and if true there is 0 chance Hierro comes back as coach and Raul gets the golden boy treatment till 2010.
Water under the bridge supposedly; remember Florentino extending an olive branch to Del Bosque last season! But most of the above is corroborated by the article. There are few things such as the private conversations (with Florentino and Figo) that cannot be corroborated but rest has been reported by the press and is not new information. The Monte Carlo incidents, Bernabeu and Cibles incidents, the dinner incident, Florentino's speech, Valdano's argument with Hierro and Raul, confrontation with Perez etc.
He also wasn't competing with Barcelona. We can trash their shit values as a club all we want, but they have been a top 2 team for the past ~8 years. Put this Barcelona in the PL for that period and Id bet his trophy haul would be less impressive.
I wish we'd never signed Beckham. I hated the transfer then and hate it even more in retrospect with the benefit of hindsight. Stupid, stupid, pointless transfer. Madrid would have been earning 200me+ more than any other club if we'd signed Ronaldinho and not let Barca win whatever they did with him.
I think the Beckham transfer actually was pretty good for us in retrospect. For 30-ish million opening up markets in Asia/America for Madrid from which we still reap the benefits from today. Because despite the lack of talent (not that Becham was bad, he just wasn't THAT good) he certainly was very popular in certain parts of the world, that Real Madrid suddenly became more known/liked globally. That was a fantastic investment from the club. He might not have directly influenced our prizes won, but indirectly he has helped us by us being able to use a lot more money over the years on players. Not that we would have been poor without him, just that we are even richer than we would have been.
Yup Beckham, good for the profile and finances of the club, rubbish for the pitch where I would have much much much preferred Dinho
Oscar I disagree. I mean Ronaldinho was equally as marketable despite having a face that only a mother can love. By this I mean,everryone knows him and at his peak he was loved by the world. I live in Tanzania and the amount of Dinho shirts circulating on the streets compared to Becks were plentyful. I reckon madrid would have had the same marketing success with dinho in place of beckham. Beckham eould probably only have improved Real Madrid's popularity within women who keep up with posh Becks.
You're wrong. I'm not even sure this is something that can be debated. Beckham was the only celebrity football player (probably is to this day). It's nice and all to see shirts in Tanzania, you see them in countries like Morocco as well, but they are NOTHING compared to for example China where the notion of Beckham got the women wet. Beckham was a huge celebrity which gave the club a huge push in major markets. Ronaldinho was one of a kind, but only with people that actually 'care' about football..
If that is true it speaks a lot about the entitlement players have in the club and how it seems the club is always made the enemy. That's an absolute reversal of what happens in America. In America the athletes are the "enemy" while the teams (especially the owners) are deemed pristine or above reproach.
A lot of poster do not remember that signing Beckham was what propelled us past United to become the richest club in the world back in 2004. When José Angel Sanchez closed the deal with Peter Kenyon and called to inform Florentino of the final price, he famously said: "Peanuts! They're asking peanuts".
Dinho was known, but even the difference in quality between the 2 players does not come close to the difference in marketibility between them (in Beckham's favour) and that even if you compared it at Dinho's hight when he was winning prizes with Barça. Beckham is still raking in money with commercials after he retired for God's sake. As mentioned above by Fifth, I also consider the Beckham purchase as one of the main reasons we're actually topping the 'richest' clubs in the world list. While before that, the status quo was Manchester being there all the time, year after year. Hell, the fact that we even had to choose between Beckham and Ronaldinho shows how it changed us. These days we would have just bought both and spent the difference on pop tarts. (yeah yeah, I know we got Figo and Zidane before him, you know what I mean)
Beckham definitely took the club to a whole different level and the club ran with it and becoming the club it is now. Combination of Flo arriving and his Galacticos turned it around.
I think they are like any other big club.. They do what's best for the team when the situation arises. Also you have to consider that these clubs are multi-million (even billion in net worth). It's a business after all It's amazing how much power the players hold in football. I would even dare to say they are the most pampered and entitled athletes on the planet. Could you imagine how football would be if it was run like the NFL?
Beckham arrived after the cl titles or did he win one? I think u guys won in 98, 2000, 2002? But anyway I think beckham was a brilliant move. He soon became the face of the team in the global market and would blame them