Liar, Liar, Pants on Fire. (Obama's promise to televise health care negotiations)

I almost accidentally clicked on that link. Luckily, I noticed the word "Breitbart" in the URL, thus saving me from accidentally looking at some bullshit.

 

I hate to even dignify this ridiculous thread with something serious. But the health care debate has been so public it can make you sick. Are you suggesting that what Obama promised was that every time two legislators get together to talk about health care reform, it has to be on tv?

 

Bullshit is a good way to describe it alright:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Api4fUziAnI&"]YouTube- obama C span[/ame]

 

What Barack Obama said in this video is exactly what has happened. The debate, the negotiations have all taken place in public, and it is easy to see what the motivations of individual members of congress are. We know how each one feels. This is exactly as it should be, and exactly how Obama described it during the campaign.

Really, vfish, there's plenty in the two bills which you can criticize as a matter of policy. This is the best you and your right wing kook associates can come up with?

 

This individual thing is pretty petty to stand up about. But these things are starting to add up. At what point does it become a big deal?

 

Sure Nancy, whatever u say.

Meanwhile, back in the real world: Obama Reneges on Healthcare Transparency

 

It's kinda funny that a thread about Mr. Hope and Change's dishonesty is described as trolling and that conduct is defended by many on here. If this was Bush, there would have been 4 threads on this subject demanding his impeachment.

 

What the hell?

During the campaign, though, candidate Obama regularly promised something different - to broadcast all such negotiations on C-SPAN, putting the entire process of pounding out health care reform out in the open. (That promise applied to the now-completed processing of forging House and Senate bills, too.)

Yet again, another so-called controversy dialed up, not because people are actually upset over what's going on, but because they reach to find a way to castigate the President, merely because of who and what he is.

 

The thing is, they are really not adding up. In every instance that Obama made a promise about the way his administration would be run, he has lived up to it . . . almost. For example, he has the strictest lobbyist policy of any administration ever. Then he makes exceptions for a couple of key appointees and everyone goes apeshit. Fine. He didn't hit 100% but should we really bitch and moan about 95%?

Probably the biggest legitimate beef was the amount of time the stimulus was posted on the internet before the final bill was signed. Although, I might simply be remembering right wing noise on that. I wasn't terribly bothered as the whole process was open and multiple drafts of the bill were available for review and critique.

This is another chest-thumping example of nothing. This has been incredibly open from the start. Now we are down to meetings between Pelosi, Reed and a few others and people want Obama to use his bully pulpit to force those meetings on tv? Whatever.

Colbert did a great piece last night. Many of the health care meetings that were took place were on cspan and the videos were uploaded. Those videos had viewer hits of 10, 92 etc. Give me a fricking break. If all of the people complaining now had actually clicked on those links to see the real substance debated, those hits would be in the tens of thousands.

This is just more political gamesmanship which is the only thing the republicans have at this point.

 

Hey, why do you always have to bring up Bush?

But seriously, do you really want to do a comparison of this process and say . . . oh, I don't know . . . . the energy policy meetings Cheney held?

 

Odd, I don't recall seeing Mary Landrieu negotiating her “Louisiana Purchase” on C-SPAN. Nor do i remember watching Ben Nelson and Harry Reid haggle over the final details for Nelson’s decisive 60th vote. Nope, none of those backroom shenanigans were on C-SPAN.

And if you don't think people are legitimately upset I suggest you take a look at Arnold's speech from yesterday withdrawing his support.

 

Plus, didn't senators have 48 hours or so to vote on it after receiving a bill well over 1,000 pages? Most Senators didn't even know exactly what was in the bill.

 

Then you're being ridiculous if you honestly expected to see back room dealings in the House being aired on C-SPAN. Which you never did.

The majority of the Republican lawmakers and media mouth pieces have simply been sabotaging the entire effort to get health care reformed, to the detriment of the country.

There is ZERO reason why they should be allowed to participate, or witness these negotiations.

 

This is true to a certain extent. But if we're gonna bring up HW, then people will be just as angry when this bill raises their taxes, or affects them in ways they don't like. Even if it doesn't end up doing that (which I highly doubt), that's the perception right now

Which is one reason popular support for the healthcare bill is not exactly overwhelming.

 

Do you really think this health care bill is good for the country? Really?

 

Yes. Really.

 

Before the conservatives started lying and demonizing the effort? yes. But after they started, nothing that could actually truly reform the way we deliver health care or pay for it could be touched.

 

Talk about being ridiculous, how can you sabotage a process you’re not part of? From the beginning of the administration took the attitude “I won” and don’t need bi-partisan support. The whole debate was simply a matter of getting the Democrat minions in line.

 

"government taking control of your health care!"
"Death panels!"
"Public Option is the devil!"
"Rationing!"
"I don't want the government touching my Medicare!"

 

Maybe you could name the concessions that was made to appease a republican. From what I can see, all the concessions were made to appease democrats and their special interests.

 

Not even, it's more desperation from the right wing fringe that has hijacked the Republican party. This all happened in the open. What they are saying is that every thought, every time two people talk to each other in the senate or house about health care reform, it's gotta be televised. That's a ridiculous stretch of what he said. And the principals -- the reasons he laid out on why it is important to do it in the open -- have been achieved. You know why Ben Nelson voted the way he did, Lieberman, Mary Landrieu. Do what you want with the informtion.

Every member of congress's position is known. Just because some very lazy CBSTV reporter says otherwise doesn't make it so.

 

No single payer system. No universal health care.

 

hamstringing the power of a panel that was supposed to make laws to improve health care delivery based on studies they run (death panels! rationing!)

Not even a hint of a public option (the government is going to take over your health care!!)

Not being able to take away the monopoly waiver for the Health insurance industry (government intrusion in our lives!)

No longer allowed to use your OWN money to buy an abortion when you buy a health exchange offering (the government is funding abortions!!!)

Zero hint of premium control (goverment intruding on our lives!)

If you noticed, and I'm sure you do, every single democrat (other than the Sen. of the Insurance Industry, Leibermann), was from a conservative state, and more than likely feared for their public lives.

The conservatives and tea party folks have played a HUGE role in this effort...to the detriment of our country.