How many of you saw the tackle of Kovalenko on Ronnie O'Brien on Saturday in the DCU v. Dallas game? O'Brien wound up with a broken tibia. What did you guys think? Let me be clear for those that see this post on the home page and come here -- you are in the Referee Forum -- I want to discuss it from a refereeing standpoint, not about whether Dema should banned from the league etc. If you want to do that, go here.
I was sitting in the Mezz level right directly in front of the tackle. I saw it and heard it. O'Brien played the ball and Kovalenko came right in and got his leg. It was a hard tackle and he came in a touch late, but I wouldn't call it a overly vicious tackle that deserved a sending off or anything like that. I've seen worse.
Does anyone have a link to the incident? I'd really like to see a replay of it before offering an opinion.
Saw this on MLS Wrap on Fox Sports World last night. Looked to me like Kovalenko left is feet, one leg extended in an effort to block the shot. When O'Brian made the cross, his leg hit Kovalenko's. I thought Kovalenko leaving his feet was perhaps reckless, but.. he didn't 'go after' O'Brien. Worth maybe(???) a yellow card. But, I saw no red card foul there. The referee and AR seemed to be right there and got a good look at it. I expect that the league will review the tape. But, I don't see any 'punishment' for this. Bad break for sure. Unlucky for O'Brian. Here's hoping for a full recovery and a speedy return to the pitch for O'Brian.
That's pretty much how it looked from my living room as well, although a caution for recklessness would not have surprised me. Kovalenko did appear genuinely concerned for O'Brien after the fact - or maybe he was just concerned about how he was going to be repaid after the restart?
It was at the far end of the field from my location so I didn't see exactly what happened until I watched the tape of the game later. He was obviously in a lot of pain right away. It looked like his follow through ended up hitting Dema who slid in from the side to block the cross. An unfortunate event but I would agree with the decision of no card at all. No foul was called on the play. Of course given the poor job this particular referee did all game at foul recognition that's not especially surprising. I think Dema went in a little harder than even he usually does because he was a little angry about having been fouled immediately before with no call, but I don't think it was so reckless.
The ref did seem to be having a tough time out there. Both teams were pretty upset with him. I had a game like that this weekend, so I know how that feels. As far as Dema's tackle. It looks much worse on slo-mo replay. Because it was Dema on the tackle, people are going to be a little more upset about it. It was an unfortunate play. People get hurt in games sometimes that's the nature of the game. Both players were playing hard. The tackle in and of itself was hard but not a foul or misconduct IMO. I'm sure they'll look at this one on video, so I'll be interested to hear the "official" opinion. At worst, the referee could have determined that Dema was reckless and cautioned him, but to me, that's it. The only reason I think there is an uproar over this one play is the fact that O'Brien was hurt. The end result can't our reason for deciding on a card or it's color.
Having looked at the play from several angles, and from slo-mo and regular speed, I'd have to say this is one of the toughest fouls to recognize, however, all in all, at the end of the day, it should have been a send-off. I say this not because it was Dema, (I'm a metro's fan so have no ill will towards him), but because of the foul. The key here is that he left his feet to tackle the opponent. If I was on the field I probably wouldn't have called it a send-off either, but it will be in the memory bank now for future occurrences. When you leave your feet to commit a tackle, and you make contact, you are playing in a dangerous manner, which is what serious foul play is considered. I can't say that Dema was trying to injure or was just going to block the shot, I hope, and somewhat think that he wasn't trying to do what he did, but that cannot enter into the equation here. It was a dangerous tackle, and he should have been punished for it.
the leaving the feet is the key for me. That is serious foul play in my book, and a sending off would be warranted. I'm curious to know how the AR didn't see the foul.
Good job KidRef. Jumping is a foul. Why? Becasue whe a player loses control of himself then serious injuries result. It serves as a good example of something that doesn't always injure but is likely to lead to a situation where injury occurs. In this case here, we have a case of a player who 'Didn't mean it' but broke a guy's leg. Losing control leads to nasty injuries which is "Serious Foul Play". Clearly he was late and had lost control of himself. In fact he may actually have jumped at the tackle. In any even, it's hard for me to see how a referee couls say such play isn't serous foul play.
I guess my first question was why wasn't ANY foul called. Reserve the yellow/red discussion for later. I thought a "no-call" on this play was horrible. The ref was in good position to see it and it was in the AR's quadrant. I only saw the replay on MLS Wrap but I thought surely O'Brien had won a PK when I first saw it. (Now I can't even remember, but it did happen in the box right?). I thought it was a red card and a PK...but if you ask the coach of the U-15 Challenge boys that I centered on Sunday he'll tell you that I don't know how to recognize either one
I am curious about all the "leave the feet" comments. Explain to me how you can perform a slide tackle without leaving your feet? In my book, I can understand the referee not calling it -- O'Brien got the cross off and so he lets play continue. However, I probably would have come back and carded him (yellow) because of the late contact with the trailing leg. I don't believe this warranted a send-off. He rightly tried to block the cross. O'Brien's leg came in contact Dema's leg on the follow through and unfortunately was broken. However, that part of it wasn't the problem. It was the trailing leg rolling into O'Brien's plant leg that was the misconduct.
"leave your feet" - normally when you attempt to slide or block you have your lead foot in the air and your back foot tucked in below you and you are relatively close to the ground. by Kovalenko jumping into the play he had much more force coming into the play than he would with a normal slide tackle.
Yes, but you leave your feet every time because you extend one leg, pick up the other leg and fall/slide to the ground. And this is exactly what Dema did -- if I have it pictured correctly in my mind from the replays, he tackled with his left leg extended to block the shot. His right leg was tucked under him. It was this leg that made the contact with O'Brien's plant leg. The judgement is on the angles, etc. Did the lead leg which was lifted and cleats showing go into the legs or in front of the legs? Can he make the tackle without taking out the attacker? Those kinds of decisions. The lead leg was clearly in front of O'Brien -- that part is good. Keep in mind that the contact with Dema's lead leg was during the follow through after striking the ball. In other words, Dema got his leg in there and THEN O'Brien struck it. At the same time, there was no way Dema could complete the play without "taking out" the attacker because his trailing (folded under) leg was going to come into O'Brien. So there wasn't clear intent to harm as there would have been had his lead leg initiated the contact with O'Brien. It was a either a careless challenge or a reckless challenge. If careless, it could warrant no call (because the cross got off and was heading into very dangerous area) or it could warrant calling a foul. If reckless, then it would warrant a caution.
Clear intent: I don't think we need intent on this call. Player jumps in to make a block, initiates contact and takes player out with challenge. I'm thinking Serious Foul play as the mere act of jumping into that tackle makes it impossible for O'Brien to avoid contact and the force required to jump is much greater than a slide. Had Kovalenko attempted a sort of hook slide tackle he may have blocked the ball and tripped O'Brien, and we wouldn't be having this discussion.