Wel, these are subjective judgements aren't they... I've always thought that Totti was overrated and that Scholes was underrated. I think Totti is one of those players who, if he was called Smith or Jones, would be thought of as good but not that good. The only thing I can point to is that Scholes was one of the few players in the world who was well regarded by all the players in the Real Madrid dressing room, not just some of them. Schole's form is not as good as 2-3 years ago though. That's certainly true.
what does that have to do with anything? and id disagree as well, totti, no matter what his name is, is a better player. I think if he was english you might be singing a different tune.
Please try and follow a train of thought... it's quite remarkably simple. There is no definitive measurement of how good one player is compared to another. Ergo, when comparing them, one has to use one's judgement. In my judgement Totti has never been as good as Scholes of a couple of years ago. OK? Notwithstanding that I can also point out that, in the opinion of a collection of extremely good players, (at Real Madrid), he was one of the finest midfielders in Europe a few years ago. Two seperate points... both arguable but worth stating nevertheless. Well, fancy. Er, wrong! ...and don't try and tell me what I would think please.
Is this some kind of Mystic good luck number thing? Being an old timer I like to see the numbers 1 to 11 on display, but why are 7 - 10 so good? I take it you see no value in defence and midfield. As for retiring numbers, that's not done in the UK.
He's just takes no value in facts and see's the world thru red gunner glasses...fedwood, can you please give them back to Wenger now? He needs them for Sunday so he can come up with some excuses...
If it was, with the number of years football has been played in Britain, we'd be on about 2-300 with some teams.
the problem is when someone makes a really bad train of thought, i have to make sure i read correctly. You actually based a big part of your argument on how other players felt? thats ridiculous. 1.where is the evidnece of this, and did they compare totti and scholes directly. If not, its even more of a pointless argument in this case. 2.pele showed just because players play well, doesnt mean we should listen to their opinions on other players.
7-10 are the mystical numbers of the (glowing lights and vibratory stimulation commence here) and that is the reason. Don't try to understand it Doc. He's beyond everything. Ask him to spell. I'm sure he's an excellent speller. Challenge him.
me anti english, other than the fact that i support chelsea, my second and third favorite players are lampard and terry, and in the euros i rooted for england, i can see where youre coming from.
But your opinion isn't, I suppose. In any case, if you actually read my 'argument', (as you call it,) I was discussing with Nicephoras as to who was the better player between Scholes and Totti, at which point you found it necessary to stand up on your hind legs and start insulting me by saying that I 'might be singing a different tune' if Totti was English when you have no idea whether that's true or not... (it's not). My SUPPORT for English players doesn't mean I can't accurately discern if some foreign players are better than some English ones. Indeed, as I've already said, young Cole won't get much of a chance for the time being because both Duff, (Irish), and Robben, (Dutch), are probably ahead of him in the 'free role' that he is most comfortable with. Similarly Makelele and Scott Parker. In this respect I am totally unlike some of the support we seem to have picked up lately who seem to think that, if a player isn't Portugese, he can't be any good at all so we MUST play Tiago because he was good a couple of years ago and he might be good again in a year time. Well, that's bullsh$t. IIRC I saw it mentioned in an interview with David Beckham where he was talking about the attitudes of the Madrid dressing room to players throughout Europe. LOL. Who says? You? Pele is just one player though, isn't he. I'm referring to comments of most of the players in the Real Madrid dressing room as reported by David Beckham. In any event YOU'RE the one making a big deal of this point. I said... 'Notwithstanding that I can also point out that, in the opinion of a collection of extremely good players, (at Real Madrid), he was one of the finest midfielders in Europe a few years ago. Two seperate points... both arguable but worth stating nevertheless.' Do you know what the word 'notwithstanding' means? Didn't think so...
you know as much as i want to answer your insult back with another, i dont see thepoint. Youre right i shouldnt have said the whole if he was english thing, my bad. I do have to say the cole comparison to duff and robben doesnt work like a totti-scholes comparison. As the rift in talent between our dynamic duo and joe cole is rather large.
Fair enough. Like I said, at the moment there's no argument that Duffer and Robben are the ones to go for instead of Cole. I don't think it's a question of talent so much as the fact that he can't seem to get his head up and have a look around and so ends up running into trouble. I absolutely agree that, whether he's English or not, if he can't learn that he's no bloody good to us. Oh yeah... sorry if I lauched into you a bit.
FROM THE DAILY MIRROR THIS MORNING: http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/sport...iteid=50143&headline=jol-cole--name_page.html
I really do feel bad for Cole, and moreso for England. He was supposed to be the next boss of the midfield after Scholes a couple of years ago, I suppose its lucky Lampard decided to become worldclass last season. What Cole needs right now is playing time, and that clearly isn't coming at Chelsea. You guys have experienced that with Lampard himself, he wasn't always playing at this high of a level, but he played through the tough times and his game progressed to where it is today. Cole needs a fresh start, and I'd imagine he'll get that this summer. Its a shame he really threw these two years away though. Basically any other team in the country and he would have been an established first teamer by now, a bit ambitious perhaps in his move and a lesson. I'd imagine when Chelsea signs the third winger for their rotation in the summer (early money appears to be on Joaquin, although I imagine Real will have something to say with Figo leaving) it will finally spell the end of Cole's Chelsea days, and hopefully the begining of a new period in his career. Hell, maybe he can eventually become the LM England fans have been dreaming about for the last few years.....
i dont think cole performs that well anywhere except the middle, besides it looks like stuart downing might be that player. As for the 3 winger rotation, I wonder if any of the three would be happy with that.
I seem to remember Duffer complaining when we bought Robben. Quite what he'll make of us buying Joaquin I wouldn't like to say. I've seen Joaquin play well and then be anonymous in another game... much like Cole to be honest.
I think joaquin is a far superior player to cole, see him a few times in la liga, and the spain game against england(1 other), there arent too many RWs better, how many can you name? he also wouldnt nhave a chance to take a game off in our side, hed never play again.
IMHO, the media blew that up into "OMG Duffer is leaving and cranky and look he's all ticked off blah blah.". I just think he was curious how he'd fit into the side, voiced that, and voila.