GOOD NEWS Way off topic but great news for the sporting world. The guy that ran MJ and Phil out is now out himself, he can say he did it his way which ended up being the wrong way.
Re: GOOD NEWS Without getting into too much detail in the wrong forum, all I can say is that you're wrong.
Cheese is good. Wasn't Krause involved in the decision to prevent the Fire from waiting out the SF renovation at Comiskey? Or is that Reinsdorf? And is that spelled wrong? Are they in fact the same guy? Is Krause at all relevant to the Fire?
By a country mile it does. I think after him comes Kenny Williams (Sox), Mike Smith (Hawks), Jerry Angelo (Bears) and Jim Hendry (Cubs). What a great day. I actually starting humming "Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead" when I heard the news flash on AM1000 this morning.
I won't bother sticking up for Krause, I'll only say that the sports talk guys that think MJ should be GM (or should even be contacted about it) are off their rockers.
Re: Re: GOOD NEWS Great Krause Decisions - 1) Phil Jackson 2) Pippen & Grant draft 3) Oakley 4) Rodman Horrible Krause Decisions - 1) Nearly every draft but the Pippen & Grant draft 2) Chasing out Jackson, hiring Floyd 3) Losing the confidence of Jordan, Pippen, Grant 4) Misjudging status of late 1990s free agent market Summary - The hype about SuperSleuth was greatly overdone. Evaluating 15 years of trades & drafts, there is no evidence that Krause is any better or worse at judging talent than is the typical NBA general manager. For every great call he made in the draft, with trades, or with free agents, there are at least as many large mistakes. Which is about par for the course, for an NBA general manager. Combine that with a personality that alienates many, and the result was a below-average GM.
One of the best sports-radio terms ever: The Michael Jordan Asslicking Society. Even greater in number than the Bob Bradley Asslicking Society, in my estimation. But this is all a different discussion for a different place.
Re: Re: Re: GOOD NEWS Exactly. And let's not forget the whole Pippen/Kukoc fiasco. Pippen didn't have to sign the contract but he'd just helped bring in three titles (it could be argued that if there was no Pippen with Jordan, there wouldn't be any of the titles) and Krause was pushing hard for a guy with no NBA experience + throwing much more dough than at his current roster. Actually, remember - Jordan wasn't even in the top ten in payroll in the last title. But that was just "shrewd". Actually, I will take a moment to rant about Phil Jackson. Now, I didn't like Jerry Krause. But I also didn't like Phil Jackson. He didn't really know how to bring out the most in some of his players and he didn't know how to use some of the good players that Kruase did bring in to the Bulls. He shattered Stacey Kings confidence, didn't use Dennis Hopson (although Jordan shattered his confidence as well...) and didn't find a suitable role for Rodney McCray. So not all of his moves were so bad. Rather, Phil Jackson had a tendency to do goofball things - like yanking guys not named Jordan/Pippen when they were hot (like Armstrong).
Son of a bitch! I hate him!!! The bastard ran the greatest coach and greatest player out of Chicago. If it hadn't been for him Mike might still be a Bull. At least Phil would have made the post MJ era a less painfull one. Fat bastard!!! Like a lot of Chicagoans who love the Bulls I feel nothing but violent hatred towrds him. ************er!! Too bad it took an illnes to drive him out. (not that I wish him to die) That other bastard in the front office is probably gonna find another ************ buddy to play with Bulls fans emotions.
I have already posted Krause's obituary over on the NBA Discussion thread so I won't post it here. I do wonder what bopper78 will do for a living, since he won't be able to do Apologist work for Jerry Krause anymore. In short: Krause is a highly overrated GM. For all he did right, he did more wrong, and in the end, was a blight on the NBA GM landscape. Good riddance.
That's pretty much the way I felt. I couldn't stand the guy. Pissed me off - and the thing that people that support him so much don't seem to see is the damage that can't be measured in "hard" terms. For example, his horrible handling of Pippen/Kukoc/Jordan/Jackson etc. did a lot of damage to the image of that ballclub. If I'm a player, would I want to go to Chicago when you're being a hardass about bumping up Scottie Pippen's contract - after he helped bring you three titles! No way. If you're not loyal to the players that are doing it for you, what's the incentive? There's a big big reason why Krause couldn't sign the Duncan's and Hill's when they were healthy and free-agents that is often overlooked. He had to get out of town - and like I said somewhere it is about time.
does anyone like this guy? every bulls fan i have ever met wants this guy to be hung... they hate him.
Krause Here was what was annoying about Krause. He was an inveterate self-promoter. Even as he cultivated this image of the loner -- "the Sleuth" -- he paid enormous attention to his public image. Reporters were constantly writing as to how Krause would freeze them for articles when he decided that they were enemies, then would attempt to snow them for favorable press if he decided that they were friends. This favorable press consisted of various themes of the "misunderstood genius of Jerry Krause, the kid who nobody liked because he was fat & Jewish, the kid who made the Bulls the powerhouse organization that they are." I can't decide what is worse, self pity or self promotion. And Krause was the lord of both. He wasn't that bad of a GM. If he would have just shut up, he wouldn't have been hated. Not loved, not worshipped, but at least tolerated.
I like him more more than MJ "I'll never play for any coach other than Phil Jackson." I'd make an argument MJ was just as responsible as Krause for the breaking up of the Bulls, as MJ is 10x the egomaniac Krause ever was and took an inordinate amount of glee for sabatoging the Bulls upon his exit. As time goes on we're seeing how much of a complete tool Jordan is/was (not implying Krause isn't though) and the hero worship by fans blinded by the image the media painted of MJ has got to stop. Now what Krause has done in the rebuilding process certainly opens him up for getting hung, but I'd trade Elton Brand for Tyson Chandler any day of the week. Brand isn't going to get any better and hasn't taken the Clippers anywhere, and before his injury Fizer was looking almost as good as Brand did. IMO Chandler's going to be a stud (who knows if it will be for the Bulls though). Pippen? Krause could have handled better, but quitting on your team in the last 1.8 seconds of a playoff game because they didn't draw the play up for you kind of takes the incentive away to reward you for anything. In the end Krause gave him a max contract and traded him to the Rockets for nothing, so I would dispute that he wasn't loyal to Pippen.
I'm no bandwagon fan - but Jordan was... Jordan. He was arrogant, but most importantly, he BACKED IT UP. He wasn't a tool at all. Don't forget - what was Jordan's salary compared to the likes of Derrick Colement and co. in the mid/early nineties? He was hardly the most highly paid player in the NBA... not by a long shot! In fact, Hot Rod Williams made more than him. Jordan didnt really make a fuss- it wasn't so well know. I guess that's in his defense - but if you were Krause, wouldn't you have tried to tie the guy up? Especially after bringing in three titles? I do fault Jordan for the whole Phil Jackson BS - but I think that's just what it was - BS. And it was calculated. In that way, he boxed Krause into a corner - Krause said "Okay..." and that was that. And don't forget - that year was a shortened NBA season and Jordan nearly severed off his finger while fooling around with a cigar. He wouldn't have been really ready to play anyway. I think that that particular incident was a culmination of things that boiled over in Pippen, both on the court, off the court and at his home. While it was disgraceful, no doubt, I actually can see why he would be so pissed off that he would give the finger to the organization then. It wasn't just about "the play is for Kukoc", it was waaaaay deeper than that. And in the end Krause did give him a Max contract.... but it was in the end. Six titles later! What took so long? I know these guys get paid enough as it is, but relative to the jokers in the league that aren't doing Sh!t and getting five times what he did, I can honestly admit that I too would ask "WTF? I brought three titles here - I'm one of the best defenders in the game - one of the most versatile players. And now you're after this unknown from Europe - offering him more money, and want me to, really, groom him?" I can see this. He signed a contract and had to honor that. You know what? He did. But if it were me, I certainly would've uped the ante on the guy earlier if for anything, a measure of good faith. It's like I said before - you have to take a step back and actually ask yourself "Hey, if Krause is so great, how come none of the big names wanted to play for Chicago despite all the money he's throwing at them?" Yeah, it's pretty clear to me. If I were Duncan, I'm saying: "Yeah, I don't care much for playing in a stadium Jordan built. And on top of that, what's to make me think Krause'll take care of me if he didn't take care of the guy while he was winning titles for them?" No free agents - hell, you shudder but don't forget how much Krause paid for Ron Mercer. That was a joke! Mercer was thrown into the Rose deal so that the Bulls could get rid of that gaffe of a signing. Krause was the real tool here. Not Jordan, not Pippen, Kukoc or Jackson. An ego the size of his gut.
Don't get me wrong, I agree with most of your points A1. I was done defending Krause when the rebuilding process got stuck in the mud, but I get tired of Krause getting blamed for every single stinkin thing that went wrong in Chicago. Was a lot of it at his feet? Sure, but blaming him was the easy and the "cool" thing to do for a lot of fans. What I do disagree with is that Jordan is clearly a tool. A tool that won in Chicago, but as we can see from his Wizards experience he's not a very good teammate and it can certianly be argued he's not making the Wizards any better, only helping them sell tickets. Sure Krause hasn't won anything without Jordan, but the same can be said that Jordan hasn't won anything without Krause. In the end I'll just say I'd rather have the current Bulls team than the current Wizards team. Does that make Krause a good GM? Not really, just that at this point it says he has the Bulls in a better place than Jordan has the Wizards.