Japanese NT @ AFC Asian Cup 2007 [R]

Discussion in 'Japan' started by SmokingMan, Jul 3, 2007.

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  1. Enclosure

    Enclosure Member

    Dec 19, 2004
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    It is surely about building it up piece by piece. Obviously more steps are needed, I'm not saying we're complete. But think of it the other way - the way everything had come down on Japan's head last worldcup, it's not possible to fashion a perfect side (even in Asian terms) over such a short period, with just a training here and there. So this sort of outcome seems pretty natural to me and it would happen. Therefore, what matters is what we can identify in them while winning and losing. I'm not upset because there are good signs and direction to the way the team has been being built. I said this some weeks ago, but my mindset going into this cup was to see if we're going in the right direction. That was so much more central for me than the outcome of each game.

    So yes, it may be that Osim might try other members in the future, but those pieces will come to build on the system which's been in place.
     
  2. goki154-redded

    goki154-redded Red Card

    May 28, 2007
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Saudi Arabia was simply superior to us. :D
    I still trust Osim but some players need to be replaced....

    OUT
    Endo or S. Nakamura
    K. Nakamura
    Abe (as a centre defender)
    Yamagishi
    Hashimoto
    Yano

    IN
    Okubo
    Matsui
    Hasebe
    Maeda
    Inamoto
    Yamase
    Umesaki
     
  3. Enclosure

    Enclosure Member

    Dec 19, 2004
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Yeah goki I too hope Osim will try various combinations. And I agree Saudis were better in the end, I think overall it was a clean game and won/lost in a straight forward manner. Damn close though, if you ask me.

    Once Osim & NT is done revising the problems which cropped up during the cup, the next step is to build on the passing, simple game and merge with individual strength so the style becomes a perfect harmony of individuals and a team. But for that, we need a solid foundation of team and I think we saw that develop in this tournament.
     
  4. rougou

    rougou Member+

    Dec 7, 2003
    Hyogo
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    A lot of people are complaining about a lack of goals, and it is true Japan should have scored more with the possession they had, but if you let the other team score 3, more often than not you are going to lose.

    I was worried about Abe going into the match, and while he scored a great goal for Japan, I can't help but to wonder if Saudi would have scored 3 if we had Tsuboi in there instead of Abe. Abe got faked to the ground way too easily and often, especially on the 3rd goal where he got faked down to his left even though he had Nakazawa covering him on his left.
    I like Abe as a player but if he doesn't fit into the midfield, he shouldn't be forced out there, unless he starts playing center back regularly at Urawa.

    and Kaji, I don't even want to talk about. There is a clear stop in the flow of play every time he gets the ball. Its like Japan was playing with 10 men. And when he found himself with acres of space to cross, he still can't get the cross over the first defender. Also, notice Komano can get all the way to the endline to cross (despite the fact that he is a right-sided player), while Kaji always gets stopped halfway there, passes it back, or puts in some useless cross to the first line of defense. Add to that he got beat on the first goal as well.
     
  5. hallelujah_united

    Oct 21, 2006
    Club:
    Urawa RD
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    I can totally understand why Osim has stuck with the same personnel throughout this campaign, after all this is the team that got them qualified in the first place and have done very well in the tournament. It's not the smartest thing to upset the balance of the team in the midst of a tournament.

    But like many of you here, I hope to see more new faces being tried out and giving starting roles in the upcoming fixtures. Some of the players are probably not going to make it to 2010 in peak condition, some of the players are just not good enough for the international level. Whatever the reasons may be, there are definitely more than a few players left out who could very well be up to the game plan that Osim has for Japan.
     
  6. nipponbasse83

    nipponbasse83 Member+

    Jun 17, 2007
    Ichikawa, Chiba, Japan
    Club:
    Consadole Sapporo
    Nat'l Team:
    Norway
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    I partially agree with you. In with Okubo for Maki, Matsui for either Endo or Kengo. I think the midfield would be perfect with Matsui instead of Kengo or Endo, as Matsui is a more offensive player, and got the ability to run past defenders.
    Shunsuke deserves the spot, he wasn't as good as expected, but he showed great skills on occasions. Once he gets used to Osim more, he will be on fire. Keita does a brilliant job as the defensive a anchor.

    Takahara and Okubo up front sounds good in my ears. Maki works hard, but can't score goals. Sato is a prolific goalscorer, but seems to light to succeed at world stage. Bando in form might be the best solution, but he hasn't been that good this year ( much to the cause he's being benched in Gamba). Yano...hmm i dunno...can't say i know that much about him, but he should earn a starting role instead of only 10 minutes each game, so we could see what he got. I like Ganaha, and if we need a tall striker, exchange him with Maki. Ganaha is a much better finisher, and overall a better striker. Not sure if he can make it on the world stage though. Okubo have already proven his worth in Spain. It wasn't for his lack of skills that got him booted, more his personality and injuries. He looks great in Kyoto now, and deserves a 2nd chance.

    In defence, things will get better once Tulio returns. Komano should be placed on the right. with perhaps Murai on the left. Konno is too slow. Or what about Ienaga in Gamba? or for that matter Yasuda? are they good enough?oh, and Yamada in Urawa! but when i come to think about it, he's right-footed too i guess...he's great though..
     
  7. watashi-redded

    watashi-redded Red Card

    Jul 8, 2007
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    It hurts me that Japan missed next Confederations Cup.
    Oh well. I think Japan showed better performance than we expected considering their terrible preparation and Tulio's absence.
    But I hate to see the Japanese attackers prefer passing ball to scoring goals. :rolleyes:
     
  8. Ishikawa18

    Ishikawa18 New Member

    Oct 1, 2005
    Germany
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    replace Endo? are you serious? :mad:
     
  9. watashi-redded

    watashi-redded Red Card

    Jul 8, 2007
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Endo is one of the most ineffective players in the squad.
    Matsui and Shunsuke duo is the best imo.
     
  10. seolseol

    seolseol Member+

    Apr 26, 2003
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    What a game last night. One of the best games i've ever seen. Great display from both teams, Japan and Saudi Arabia is technically superior too any other teams in Asia. Such a pleasure to watch. To bad the game didn't have the outcome that i wanted.

    I also think S.Nakamura and Takahara could've stepped up and played a little bit better then they did.

    I see some of you want Endo out of the team, i don't agree at all, he is a damn great player, i didn't like him before but he is great. And i don't think we will have to wait to long before Umesaki from the U20 team joins the NT, he is a damn great player.

    Do you guys take the third place against Korea seriously, i hope we will see a great game, and i think Japan will win it. They're so much better at the moment.
     
  11. hallelujah_united

    Oct 21, 2006
    Club:
    Urawa RD
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    The feeling most of us get in here is that Endo is a great player technically (perhaps the best in J-League), but when it comes to tactical and mental attributes, he is just too slow for the Osim game. More often than not, he has to take one touch too many to figure out where to pass the ball to. You can't pass the ball even with all the technique in the world if you get closed down.

    I think left-back is a really interesting spot on the team. We all know Komano does his best work on the right, and Kaji is no longer meriting his place on the starting line-up. So far Konno's been pretty okay at left-back, but if we had to see "new" faces being tried out, I'd like to see Murai or Soma being featured. Murai showed what he could do in the run-up to the WC (and is delivering the goods again for Jubilo), and Soma is playing pretty solid football at Urawa these days with Alex gone.

    I wonder how Iwamasa would figure in the setup as well? He's been huge this season, and there were calls for his inclusion into the squad I think.

    Up front, it's been a while since Ganaha had a good run of games with the ban and all, so he might have to work his way back a bit yet. Bando's been benched too much for this season as well. Okubo HAS been performing well, but maybe Osim thinks his personality is too volatile for the team? Plus, he's been playing primarily from a midfield position this year as well.

    Yamase seems like an interesting option too. He's been pretty good this year, and does know how to penetrate defences effectively albeit at J-League level.
     
  12. nolando

    nolando New Member

    Sep 9, 2006
    Vancouver
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    I actually think that Komano finally looked like a keeper, after years of being my least favorite of any Japan starting 11. Size and strength were major problems in this latest campaign. Look at Kengo - I mean give him a sandwich or two. If he isn't strong enough and/or mentally focused enough to get past mediocre Asian opponents then he has no future will the National Team on any bigger stage. And who was that guy who looks like an U-13 player. Hanyu, was it? Great one-off shot but come on, unless you're playing Vietnam or a similar amateur-level side then this guy will get stomped out there. He is literally half the size of some of the opponents. Takahara desperately needs a partner out there. How many more Japan coaches are going to give Maki a chance - I mean really!?!

    I am not one of those who thinks that gus who play/played in Europe like Ono are automatically better choices than the perrenial J-Leaguers, but are there not more than two players abroad (or who have played abraod) who could make a decent contribution to this side? Okubo? Matsui? I'll take Miyamoto back with how bad the defense (especially Abe) looks. And whatever happened to Oguro?

    The side looked like a bunch of J-Leaguers put together for an all-star series. Too many of them are stars at the J-League side but don't work when put together into a more professional system and aginst the kind of unpredictable styles and sizes that the international game brings. Endo is a perfect example - and this coming from a guy who lives in Kagoshima and who loves his hustle.

    Shunnsuke is also perhaps half the midfield general that Hide was (if that) - too bad a few more of the J-League stars didn't show more ambition and truly listen to him and emulate him when he was around (instead of sulking).

    I truly believe that Osim is a vastly superior manager to Zico but this side may struggle to qualify for the next World Cup. It certainly has the makings of a much poorer side and offers much less to get excited about.
     
  13. samuraiblues2006

    May 9, 2006
    So Cal
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    The 3rd place match against S. Korea is on. Go Nippon!!

    I was little worried ever since I read an article on yahoo japan about the flight delay (to get to Indonesia) and the lack of sleep/ training the team got. Hopefully Abe's injury is minimum.
     
  14. seolseol

    seolseol Member+

    Apr 26, 2003
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    What do you say?
     
  15. hallelujah_united

    Oct 21, 2006
    Club:
    Urawa RD
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    I say someone inject into the team a copious amount of testosterone.
     
  16. Kigai

    Kigai Member

    Jul 18, 2006
    Tokyo, Japan
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Wow...that was a terrible game. Why do we have so many problems scoring against a 10 men teams? The minute I saw Hanyu step up to the penalty spot, I knew he was gong to miss. :(
     
  17. Enclosure

    Enclosure Member

    Dec 19, 2004
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Jesus. What a waste of time that was. In all honesty I saw good in all other games (as I wrote at length), but this game vs Korea was more of the same as the last one. To be fair an energetic play came in waves here and there so there was more ambition I suppose, but still far too little. I don't even have the will to write about the details of the game.

    The whole game was a waste for them, and it was a waste of time for me to watch. The only positive that I can think of is that Osim Japan lost to a 10 man side who have had a poor campaign, surely the stupidest of the J players would be forced to sit and think hard about what the bloody hell happened.
     
  18. samuraiblues2006

    May 9, 2006
    So Cal
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Exactly, we either do really well (win the cup) or not finish in the top 3, after Sato's yet another attempt to score in the stoppage I knew we won't score in the OT and it was going to the PK's. I'm not going to blame Hanyu, our team had a PLENTY of time and a PLENTY of opportunities to score and end the game right then and there. It just sucked.
     
  19. Enclosure

    Enclosure Member

    Dec 19, 2004
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Well, a several hours have gone past and dust has settled a bit, I've been pondering deeper. Korea game was really the only one that had close to no benefit in terms of seeing Osim's way. Substitution looked odd both in timing and choice, he must have hesitated a bit. The rest must have been an experiment :cool:

    So it's down to what Osim does next. Let's wait and see how Osim takes this JNT. I appreciate the fact that Osim took this JNT into the cup incomplete and he was gambling a bit, and overall not changing starting line up is logical from that standpoint - in competitive games it's dangerous to change the team's chemistry. But there were failures too so let's see how Osim responds to it in the next few games.

    As for Hanyu, samuraiblues2006, don't get me started :D (not on PK but even in-game).
     
  20. samuraiblues2006

    May 9, 2006
    So Cal
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    I won't get started on Hanyu, trust me :)

    I must admit that I was mildly entertained how everyone mispronounced his name (I was watching star sports). I guess it's a hard name to pronounce.. :cool:
     
  21. Fuzzums

    Fuzzums New Member

    May 11, 2006
    North Carolina
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Just a question, is Hanyu of Korean descent (Zainichi)? The Hanyu name sounds like it could have Korean origins.
     
  22. samuraiblues2006

    May 9, 2006
    So Cal
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    hmm.. I don't think so. "Hanyu" sounds like a Korean name I agree, but it is pronounced "Ha-nyu" (like "ha, new") not "Han-yu" ("hun, you").
     
  23. Fuzzums

    Fuzzums New Member

    May 11, 2006
    North Carolina
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    Ah, I see. In our script we could easily translate his name into 한유 (it would be pronounce Han-Yoo). There was just something about his name that intrigued me. Well, good game none the less guys.
     
  24. rougou

    rougou Member+

    Dec 7, 2003
    Hyogo
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    If you didn't notice by his eyes, Hanyu is from outer-space. ;)
     
  25. hallelujah_united

    Oct 21, 2006
    Club:
    Urawa RD
    Re: Japan NT @ Asian Cup 2007 [R]

    It's not just the eyes mind you, but the entire face as well!
     

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