James Sands at Rangers (olf NYCFC)

Discussion in 'Yanks Abroad' started by autobus39, Nov 26, 2019.

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  1. twoolley

    twoolley Member+

    Jan 3, 2008
    Yeah maybe he hopes it’ll be a higher quality path to the premier league playing on one of best teams in Scotland vs trying to be in a championship battle?
     
  2. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Have Atlanta and Rangers take note. Maybe Rangers today finally making a significant sale for the first time in years is what Sands needed to see sign himself, knowing there is a potential for a future in greener pastures.

    There's tremendous potential for Celtic and Rangers to be conduits for Americans who have aspirations to play at Europe's highest levels but want an in-between step first. But they have to play their cards right by being fair to them in providing opportunity when they're there, and moving them in reasonable time if they succeed.
     
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  3. Ironbound

    Ironbound Member+

    Jul 1, 2009
    Hey, Rangers has a two-legged Europa league tie with Dortmund coming up in Feb. Sands vs. Reyna with any luck.
     
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  4. Regis Prograis

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Feb 8, 2020
    To be fair to Rangers, they literally collapsed and had to basically reform the club in 2012, working their way back to the SPL from the bottom of the Scottish 4th Division. So there hasn't really been to much opportunity to sell players for significant money or to big leagues in that time (they had prized assets like Billy Gilmour leave as a youth for virtually free). Having said that they just sold Nathan Patterson to Everton for around $15 million.

    Now they are back to Europe on a consistent basis and boosting Scotland's UEFA Coefficient (after 6 year gap from 2012) and most likely UCL next season, you should start to see a slow trickle of players make moves, like Celtic have done in recent years with Édouard, Tierney, Dembele, Frimpong and Ajer.
     
  5. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #30 adam tash, Jan 5, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2022
    reasons i like this move:
    • playing time seems a sure bet
    • short span of deal leaves options open
    • will likely be in a "big" role in the team....too many americans in europe are kinda on the outside looking in even if they are playing
    • chance to learn and expand his game - specifically - he can be passive and deferential on the field - as most MLS players are...this move can help him become a commanding force in midfield...so, in that way, its a perfect fit....as if he went to a higher level club mght just be stuck in a support role
    • the usmnt fan in me loves any yank leaving mls to go to europe....plus opens a spot in nycfc for another american player to come through
    Reasons i dont like this move:
    • if he had german interest, curious why he wouldnt go there
    • questionable as to what is next....hopefully it leads to greener pastures
     
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  6. twoolley

    twoolley Member+

    Jan 3, 2008
    What leads us to think playing time is a sure bet and that he will be a big part of the team? Because it’s Scotland? Sorry just wondering if I missed some transfer details that give more confidence about that
     
  7. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    He's good, young, and the guy who has been playing CB for them recently (Calvin Bassey) is more of a left back than a centerback.
     
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  8. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Deal done:

     
  9. kruck

    kruck Member+

    Jan 12, 2008
    Houston, TX
    Club:
    SV Werder Bremen
    Hard to understand this deal. Why would NYCFC want to send a young and talented starter to another team for 1 and 1/2 seasons without any compensation..
     
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  10. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    well i guess theres not a gaurantee but the structure of the deal makes it pretty likely...I'd be very surprised if he doesnt play a ton for them...but stranger things have happened
     
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  11. m vann

    m vann Moderator
    Staff Member

    Colorado Rapids, Celtic FC, & Louisville City
    Sep 10, 2002
    Denver, CO
    Club:
    Celtic FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Gross. Just very gross. Every time a Yanks goes to Rangers - and there have been many - it kills me. God, I hate those bastards. I’ll root for the American player individually - because that’s the kinda guy I am - but I hope Rangers fails miserably.

    Hatred aside….. I wonder where GVB is planning to use Sands? GVB mentioned his Sands’ versatility was a huge attraction. With that said, it’s going to be very tough to break into their midfield trio of Aribo, Kamara and Arfield. That’s the best central midfield trio in the SPL. Calvin Bassey and Conor Goldson is the preferred partnership at CB. Bassey is the weaker of the two but still a pretty good young CB.
     
  12. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I'd bet that the "option" is structured a lot like McKennie's at Juve, where it became an obligation by like...not getting relegated or whatever that was.
     
  13. ielag

    ielag Member+

    Jul 20, 2010
    Let's wait until we hear the actually terms of the deal, there's going to be a loan fee.

    As for NYCFC, it shows kids in one of the biggest metropolitan regions on the planet that they're willing to move you to Europe. Same went for the Scally deal. And, Sands had signed a big extension before the 2021 season and NYCFC still worked with him to end up in Europe despite having James locked up long term. Potential HG players, their parents, and agents will love to see that.
     
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  14. KenC

    KenC Member+

    Jun 11, 2003
    Huh? Do we know the terms, yet? Who says there's no loan fee? McKennie's loan to Juve had a loan fee, was it $5M? Dike's deal was originally rumored to be a loan, and it also was supposed to include a good-sized fee.

    Loans involving, in-demand players, seem more likely to include a fee; while loans involving players a team is trying to get rid of, more often, usually don't. Like Aaron Ramsey. I don't think any rumored EPL team wants to pay a loan fee. They probably want Juve to pay a part of Ramsey's wages.
     
  15. kruck

    kruck Member+

    Jan 12, 2008
    Houston, TX
    Club:
    SV Werder Bremen
    #40 kruck, Jan 5, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2022
    Good point. There might be a loan fee.

    The huh? And follow up questions is annoying. You could have just said, “Maybe there’s a loan fee?” That would come across better. The way you did it comes across as obnoxious.

    McKennie had a loan fee and obligation to buy. That’s clearly different.

    I’ll be interested to see if there is a loan fee or not. Don’t know if there is. I didn’t see one reported when the deal was announced. We know the terms as to length and option to buy. When should we expect to learn the terms as to fee?

    I don’t typically see in demand young players loaned for 18 months without an obligation to buy. It strikes me as odd and unusual.
     
  16. golazo68

    golazo68 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 21, 2004
    Brazil
    And Giovanni (Reyna) will be playing against his namesake (GVB*) coaching Rangers!

    *if you don't know, GVB played with Claudio and they were good friends,
    so Claudio's son got his name.

    Ah.....the SANDS of time!
     
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  17. KenC

    KenC Member+

    Jun 11, 2003
    Annoying? The questions were meant in a totally harmless way. I haven't followed the thread closely so I was legitimately asking, because you may have heard something I had not.

    The problem with these contracts is that the details are usually not at all ever clear; presumably to the benefit of the agents.
     
  18. nycfc919

    nycfc919 Member+

    Aug 17, 2015
    It’s extremely obvious there’s a 7 figure loan fee.
     
  19. winster

    winster Member

    Jul 7, 2008
    Club:
    Besiktas JK
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    His base salary last season was $150,000, and his total compensation was supposedly $200,000. Unless NYCFC has something special coming up their youth pipeline, they won't find an equivalent player for any cheaper than that.
     
  20. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    Like Sands through the hour-glass...
     
  21. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    Because it's Rangers!

    Though if past performance were any indication of future returns, the USMNT Players that have gone through Glasgow -
    Reyna
    Bocanegra
    Edu
    Bedoya
    RunDMB
    to name a few

    Have not done terribly in their careers. It might not be Dortmund, but it's also not Sunderland. Gers have a direct line to the Champs/EPL for players that perform. He'll win some hardware, and get eyes on him every week if he cracks the starting line-up.

    Also, Gio.

    https://www.scotsman.com/sport/foot...ked-as-new-epl-club-circles-joe-aribo-3513017
     
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  22. bshredder

    bshredder BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 23, 1999
    Club:
    Millwall FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Who can forget Matt Polster and Gedion Zelalem's tenure at Ibrox?

    Emerson Hyndman did well on loan, Rangers wanted to keep him but couldn't meet the asking price.

    Not including players who were in Scotland on loan (Weah), not many Americans have used the league to make a successful jump higher.

    Edu's move to Stoke didn't work out. Bedoya had to go to go back to Sweden to get to Ligue 1.
     
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  23. golazo68

    golazo68 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 21, 2004
    Brazil
    How does that work, Brian, if Rangers want to convert to keeping Sands permanently?

    Do they have to honor his recent 5 year deal Sands with NYCFC or do they have to re-negotiate a new deal with Sands? (the latter I'd think more likely)

    If the latter, wouldn't James have an 'out' and not agree to terms with Rangers, limiting his time to 18 months max.

    If limited to 18 months- I could see how the playing experience could help Sands. But if Rangers try to convert the loan to a buy in 1 year or 18 months....and THEN want another 3-4 year contract from Sands...essentially making it 5 year commitment to Rangers from Sands....yeah, I think that would be foolish by Sands and his team of advisors.

    But then if Sands basically 'turns down' Rangers at the end of 12-18 months...what leverage does he possess to get NYCFC to let him pursue a better club in Europe (since he would still have 3-3 1/2 years left on his NYCFC deal)

    Appreciate your comments.
     
  24. Regis Prograis

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Feb 8, 2020
    That may well be true, although you could probably ask the same of other similar size leagues like Belgium, Switzerland and Austria in the last decade. (Reyna went to Sunderland in the EPL if you consider that step up, but the Spl was much more a destination league then, than it is now), both Reyna and Bocanegra captain the US while at Rangers and won trophies so they didn’t do too badly.

    The situation at Rangers is quite a lot different now than it was pre 2012, and especially in the past 3-4 years. Rangers and Celtic have both made record sales to the Premier League in the past 2 years Tierney and Patterson (Scottish) and Edouard and Dembele from Celtic (French). The likes of Aribo (Nigerian) Kent (English), Morelos (Colombian) and Kamara (Finnish) are all likely to sold by Rangers in the next couple of transfer windows, and move on to clubs in bigger leagues. Ultimately if Sands performs well, there no reason an American can’t join that list.
     
  25. ielag

    ielag Member+

    Jul 20, 2010
    Personal terms between Sands and Rangers are agreed to, and I doubt he’s taking less money than his new NYCFC contract was going to pay him.

    With an 18 month loan, the option to buy is probably automatically triggered by the amount of appearances during the 18 month loan.
     

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