A friend of mine told me about a Long Island U-15G game yesterday that got chippy. Eventually the CR red cards two players (for hair pull and retaliation punch that cold cocks the hair puller). The center apparently perceived that the game was out of hand, so he then issued yellow cards to every player, including players not on the field, as a way of commmunicating that he would not put up with any more chippy play. Before the game ends, he gives out 3 more YCs, so the game ends 9 v 8. So his total for the day is about 35 YCs and 5 RCs (including the RCs for 2 YCs). A total of approximately 40 cards. I would guess that this might be a record for youth girl cards in one game, maybe even for boys, where there was not a riot? I wasn't there, so I cannot vouch for the story, but it sure sounded like a bad one.
I would not want to do the paper work. It also seems more than a little excessive on CR. Maybe the game was more than the CR could handle/ready for and tried to deal with it the only way he knew how, which I believe is the wrong way. I believe the CR needs to work on Game Management and Player Management. Then again I wasn't there.
I know a grade 5 that issued 22 cautions and 4 ejections in a men's college match and swears he didn't lose control.......
Just tell them that you lost your yellow card, so all misconduct will be red. They tried a rule in our adult league a couple of years ago. After three cautions are awarded to one team during one match, any further misconduct commited by that team would result in expulsion.
I did that once, had a team that wouldn't respect a yellow. Gave 2 for disent in quick succesion, and a third kid bitched and moaned and said something about giving everyone a yellow. So I just gave him a straight red for abusive language, which was well deserved, and notified both benches that any further cards would only be red. Well the offending team decided to test me, rough foul, and out comes the red. As I escort him to the bench, I actually took out my yellow, tossed it on the grond, and made sure I was understood. That game ended with 14 cards, 12 to one team, 8 for disent/abusive language. I'm not sure I lost control, but the players had no respect for anything. Interestingly enough, I never got assigned there again for the next 2 years. As a side note, this was a nonconfrence game the offending team was supposed to win handily, and all the trouble started when they went down 2-1.
At some point, the ref can't control a team (or 2 teams) that are unwilling to be controlled or play by the rules. That's what I saw happening in the infamous Portugal/Holland WC game where so many cards were deservedly given. The players weren't interested in playing by the rules.
Todler....I wasn't there so I am not judging you at all, but the description of your actions in that match including throwing the yellow card away is not something I would advise you to repeat ever again in the future. I know we would have had to be there to see what you were up against, but that many cards and that many problems?
This thread has generated some interesting points. One has to do with whether a referee gave too many cards in one match, and another has to do with what we, as individual referees, do to handle these situations. The referee who gave approximately 35 cards in one game sounds like he may have been in a little (or a lot) over his head, and that he also created some of the problem for himself. Most of us have had matches where we wore out our cards, but those should be few and far between. There was probably more going on in this match that the referee didn't notice. When those things weren't handled to the players' satisfatcion, out came the fisticuffs. It is unusual that 14 year-old girls throw down in the middle of the field. Once that issue was dealt with (I'm going from the initial story here), the referee then made a difficult situation nearly impossible to manage. Most players don't know the laws all that well, especially at the youth level, but what they do know is that, with the exception of some technical reasons (i.e. entering or leaving the field without permission, changing places with the GK w/out notifying the referee), the players know what cards are legitimate, and which ones are suspect, if not bogus. When the referee gives everyone on the field and in the technical area a caution for doing nothing, he or she is not showing that they won't put up with anymore misconduct, he or she is showing that they cannot control the match. The players pick up on this, and the referees lack of knowledge of the laws that he can't just start brandishing cards at anyone because he or she feels like it. I do my best to get through an entire SEASON of girls soccer without issuing a single card, and so far, this year I have succeeded; the finals are this saturday. There are times when something happens and you have no choice, but everyone on this message board should be able to get through a U-15 girls game without their cards. In youth soccer, if a game gets like this, if the coaches don't do it first for the safety of their players, the referee should abandon the match. We abandon matches due to dangerous weather, we should be willing to do so, albeit rarely if ever, because of dangerous conduct, and protect the players. I have only had 1 match where I had to use the "the next one is red" strategy. Every once in a while the players come to beat each other into submission. When I was 15 minutes into the 1st half and I was on my 5th occurrence of what might be considered 100% misconduct, at a stoppage I said to the captains loudly enough for everyone to hear it "the next one is red". About 3 minutes later was the next one, and out came the red. It was the last hard foul, or problem of any sort in the match (this league fines players $50 for a red card). WE have to decide when the match is being ruined, or the players are in danger from the conduct of the players, and do our part to mete out some semblence of justice. To the referee who threw his yellow card on the ground, to me this tells the players "you are going to listen to me and do things my way by hell or high water". Anyone who has kids knows that it doesn't usually work well that way. We are there for the players, not vice versa. If you can let the players know, through action or words, that you are there for THEM, and you are doing these things to make the game more enjoyable or safer for THEM, then the problem should work itself out.
Reminds me of the worst game I was ever involved in. I am the 4th official in some regional game, the referee was a national, the AR's were state and I was state. U-17 Boys, first half very chippy about 6 cards. Half time, referee warns us that this may get out of hand since all his strategies to control the players are not working. Long story short, end of game its 7v7 with about 25 cautions, both head coaches sent away. Try recording all of that! Anyway, the CR did everything right, and even predicted what was to happen. The kids just stopped playing, they didn't care. To make matters worse the coaches egged on the kids (reason I sent both off). The crew passed our assessment from a national assessor. Just because a ton of cards are issued, does not mean game control was lost.
It wasn't my smartest move, and I'm not happy about making it, but it did the job. That was one of the worst teams I've ever seen for disent. I actually had to card one kid after awarding him the foul, he came up and screamed at me, wondering if I was blind. I pulled the yellow and gave the foul in his direction, didn't even phase him. Don't get me wrong, the red was pretty reckless, and was a very hard yellow, but at that point, I didn't need the team behaving to start in as well. Refmedic, normally I agree, but in this instance, there was no reasoning, no cajoling, no action other than drastic, that was working for one team in this game. That was the worst part. The other team was playing decent soccer, behaving, and not getting mixed up in the BS, my habbitual offenders, thought they should have been on the american football team. In retrospect, I should have kept the yellow with me, but at the time, I was trying to get the team to settle down and not hurt someone. Sometimes, I think you just end up with one of thosee games where some of the players don't want to play, and you just have to get by with out anyone getting hurt.
Pretty sure most of us have had a game they felt slipping away. Something we did at the start that we regret or caused us to lose respect in the FOP. So many things to try and get it back just do not work. Taking the "air out of the ball" and hitting the whistle every little foul might slow it down or wind them up. You may be dealing with a game that was out of control the last time they met and still has bad blood. A coach abandons his club for a higher paid club and the kids are out to "prove" something. The list is endless. And while I will put every second of stoppage on for a tied game, the amount of seconds become very limited if the game is out of reach for one team. ThenI find a goal kick or goalie kick and loudly begin saying "easy...easy...." and they begin to all look at me and I hit the whistle, while they are standing and looking at me.
The club I coach at has penalties for accumulated caution points. If a ref yellow carded every player on my team I would have to forfeit the next 3 games. Perhaps not the best solution.
I do not believe that just a card count means that the Referee has lost controll. I truly feel that some games, it doesn't matter who is in the middle, the game will be like that. Having been in the middle for a 17 Yellow, 4 Red Junior College match, with 2 quality experienced AR's, my 2 teams were there to just beat the shit out of each other. As the Referee, we can only issue the appropriate card when something happens. We can't stop the foul from occurring. We can keep that player from doing it again, with a yellow or red, but if a player is hell bent on committing a foul, they are going to do it. My record of 17 was surpassed the next night when another chapter official had 18 Yellow and 4 Reds for an men's NAIA match. So much for holding a record.
Card counts certainly do not indicate that a referee has failed; it is, occassionally, the players who do not step up, and if all man management techniques are to no avail, referees cannot ignore 100% misconduct fouls simply to keep their card count down. As for the original issue of 35 yellow cards, that sounds more like evidence of cluelessness than failing. Arbitrarily carding players will not earn their respect, nor is it permitted under the LOTG. If things are that out of hand, terminate the match and file full details in your game report (I'd also make a point to personally call the league administrator). Ohh, and my personal "record?" 9 yellows, 2 reds (1 straight, 1 double yellow), and 1 coach ejected in a U16 boys Super Y game
My own personal record is 14 yellows, 4 reds...and I truly believe that through the use of those cards I regained control...from about the 70th minute on, I recognized that players backed off from challenges from behind and I appreciated that...just hated the fact that it took that long to make them recognize how dangerous their previous challenges were! I was SO happy (and pretty chuffed with myself!!!) that for the last 15-20 minutes, players that were challenging from behind actually BACKED OFF from dangerous challenges instead of continuing dangerous attempts at the ball! Writing up that match report still sucked, though!!!
I've definitely seen some situations similar to those mentioned, but I can't say I've ever been in the middle of one. My favorite story is one of our very experienced State 5 (former Nat'l candidate) during our Open tournament... U19 boys Division 3 garbage soccer. The game went fine until halfway through the second half, at which point he turned around and saw two kids pounding on each other for no apparent reason. Both teams were shocked, but after about ten seconds of watching it, both benches cleared and a brawl ensued. Having watched the game, I can say for certain that nothing could have possibly been done to have prevented that situation, aside from wearing one of those spy ears to keep track of all 22 players' idle chit chat. After the brawl settled down, the coaches asked what would happen next. In classic form, my friend answered, "What do you mean what's next? I'm going to the ref tent. I came to referee soccer, and this is simply a waste of my time." As far as my personal experiences have gone, I've had some rough games, but I can't say I've ever had one of those "just make it out alive" situations. I had a U17 girls game (assessment) in which two girls threw each other to the ground simultaneously. Two red cards later everybody is happy again. I had a U16 boys game that I got to halftime in. Competitive, physical, clean, and intelligent soccer. A few minutes into the second half I twisted my ankle and was relieved by a slightly less experienced referee. 20 minutes later 2 VC red cards and a scuffle that the AR had to break up. The players from both teams came over to see how my ankle was after the game, and told me that they wished I would have stayed there. My personal record is 5 yellows and 1 red (SFP). I have no problem using cards if the behavior deems them necessary, but if there is any other way around paperwork and less than 22 players on the field at the end of the game, I will always try to utilize it before showing a card.
True. But any different from the story that started the thread where the CR shows a yellow to every player on and off the field for no reason? Interesting to me that there has been less discussion of that on this thread. All of these are examples of games that have gotten or at least feel like they are heading out of control, and these are clearly last ditch efforts to rein them back in. I can't say that I've ever been faced with this kind of test, which makes it all the more beneficial to think through beforehand what techniques you might fall back in if confronted with a true emergency. As a general reaction, I would think that overtly doing anything that says that I, the ref, am not going to abide by the laws is only asking to get myself into trouble. Sure, there are serious fouls that could be yellow or red and the ref has the discretion to go one way or the other, and can take any number of factors into consideration in making the decision. But if I've announced that it will be red before it happens, I've just opened myself up to attack and made it more difficult to say that it was on the wrong side of the line. And, to walk around the field showing a yellow to every player, including players on the bench, some of whom may not yet have played a minute or said a thing? I might be able to get some sympathy form a fellow ref that this was a very bad situation that called for something drastic, but how do I even write that up with a straight face? And, worth keeping in mind when "counting" cards that these weren't real cards when comparing it to some of the other card counts that have been noted above. Again, I haven't had to deal with it, but I'm not following how the players' refusal to abide by the laws would justify my decision as the ref to abandon them as well.
Great post, Blech. One minor correction: I don't know that the CR who gave a YC to every player actually showed the card to each individually. I was not there. Possibly he used a 360 degree spin move, or flashed each bench with an announcement that it applied to all players. Not sure we need to explore the merits of each technique though.
Most of the issues that generate a lot of discussion here are those where something was controversial. I think, and I'm not speaking for anyone but myself here, that we can all agree that what this referee did was not only inappropriate and not in accordance with the LOTG, but it was completely absurd. A much wiser man than I would put this into the category of "another case of inventive refereeing". I don't think that there is anything controversial about what that referee did, it was just incorrect. The original story, though, has generated some excellent discussion on how to handle similar situations, and some tricks of the trade. Discussing a 35-40 card performance on the merits seems like a futile exercise.
I was just about to make the same point as refmedic. Throwing your yellow away is not something I would ever imagine doing, although I suppose it would make a good excuse to finally use your spare card. I think a better discussion would focus on the signs that a match is going to or is getting out of hand, and how to correct it. For me, the most cards I've pulled were during a tournament final on a 100 degree day. Both teams had played four games that day and six over the course of a weekend. As a result, tired players were continually coming in late; it wasn't malicious, players simply lacked the energy to pull out of dangerous tackles. As a result, I've come to recognize hot days and tournament situations as harbingers of trouble, and raise my intensity level accordingly, overreacting to an early foul if at all possible.