Is it time to fire Sigi?

Discussion in 'Columbus Crew SC' started by DGA57, Sep 2, 2007.

  1. kaiser kraut

    kaiser kraut New Member

    Jun 26, 2001
    Indianapolis
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Also, let's not forget that I think a lot of us (myself included) put a little too much into our preseason pasting of Dallas for the Pioneer Cup. I mean, we just dominated and looked like world beaters. Before that game I think we had mostly logic-driven reasonable expectations for the season. After that game there was a big welling spring of hope that gushed forward and we got carried away with it, IMO. If we're reminded of honestly what we thought back in Feb. or so, then you would not be too disappointed with the progress we've made since last year (although we could also throw in the argument that injuries make last year a non-comparable season).
     
  2. west ham sandwich

    Feb 26, 2007
    C-bus
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I know earlier in the season when there were a bunch of people up in arms saying Sigi needed to go, I said something similar to what you're saying here. That we knew we weren't going to be one of the top two teams. And we were about where we were expecting to be going into the season, which was fighting for playoff positioning. The only difference was we were fighting with DC, chicago, and NE (at this point KC and NYRB were running away with the east) and not chicago, KC and NY.

    But the key phrase there is playoff positioning. Barely making the 8th playoff spot, especially if it is as the 5th place east team, is not good enough. Because any other year that leaves us out of the playoff.

    As much as I don't want to blow up the team and start over, Sigi hasn't gotten the job done. He came in saying that turnarounds in MLS could happen in one offseason and we would compete for the cup last year. We, and he, found out it wasn't that easy anymore, MLS had improved imensely, especially in the last few years. Well here we are 2 years in and we're back on the outside looking in if the season ended today, and maybe I'm expecting too much too soon (which honestly wasn't that much from most of them), but I don't see our young guys -including our two 1st round draft picks from a year ago- becoming even above average starters in this league.

    But you know what, if we sneak into that 8th playoff spot and show well against Dallas or Houston, I'm open to McC making a complete evaluation and deciding either way. Anything less, Sigi should be out. Anything more, 4th in the east and/or winning a first round playoff series, Sigi should get another year.
     
  3. myshap

    myshap Member

    Jun 19, 2002
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Grabs, Gaven, and O'Rourke for one. That's going to be the backbone of a very good midfield one day. Sigi kept Marshall here, completely stripped him down as a player and built him back into a better central defender. If Chad can get past his concussion
    problem, Sigi has him poised to take the next step as a back. Miglioranzi was a good acquisition that really needs an offseason to fully learn the left back spot. You mentioned Hesmer, but Gruenebaum is a player that can challenge for minutes as well. So that pretty much covers the midfield and defense that Sigi brought in or made the decision to keep around, so as you say, we just need better forwards.

    And going into an area that you said I couldn't, just to say ******** you. I think Kamara is going to be a damn fine forward, Robbie Rogers is going to be very good, Zayner is going to be very good. None of them are 24 either.
     
  4. Hector & Jane

    Hector & Jane New Member

    May 30, 2005
    Sigi should stay. There isn't any point in lumping '07 pre-GBS together with the post-GBS team and arguing that overall the team hasn't been good enough. The start to this season was so bad that playoff hopes were comatose if not already dead when Guille arrived. Since Guille's arrival we've been competitive. Sigi formed the post-Guille team and deserves a chance to see if he can make more of it next year.
     
  5. JohnJohn

    JohnJohn New Member

    Dec 11, 2003
    Chino
    It would be really dumb to fire Sigi at this time. However, I would like to see him get Herron and Rogers in the game. We are getting worn out in the last 10 minutes of each game because we don't have any pacey attacking players keeping the dogs at bay. Also, if Garey is hot right now use him and sit Moreno. Moreno is a very hard worker but at this point we need goals.
     
  6. TrueCrew

    TrueCrew Member+

    Dec 22, 2003
    Columbus, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    First off, it would be dumb to fire Sigi now, let him have the chance to finish the season.

    That being said:
    1) He's given away points in two games recently with Anclueless type tactics. The Dallas game (hot game, in the heat, sitting on subs, even when up a man). Ditto last week vs. Colorado. Plus you could see in each game the field was tilted. There is just no excuse for consistently not making the 3rd sub. Especially in the heat, when the field is tilted against you, and you desperately need all the points.

    2) He's a liar. He said he was going to bring attacking footy and he hasn't. A lone forward and two d-mids all year. Yawn. Moreover, this system prevented Ngwenya from being close to goal (he's always out wide), and prevents our main pre-season acquisition (Herron) from playing any games. Even if Andy was fit, he's ill-suited to be alone up front (almost any striker is). Plus, it prevents Garey and Kamara from ever getting in a game.

    3) The moves. They haven't been bad at all. Jar-Jar for Moreno = even. Schelotto = brilliant. Gaven for Buddle = good. Grabavoy for Martino = stealing. We gave up too much for Hesmer, but he's decent. Seems like Burch can play left back for D.C., that was boneheaded. We still don't have a goalscorer after 2 years. We have a ton of wingers and no defensive depth (especially on the left, yet Kotschau and Burch are shown the door), and what depth we have is past its sell date. Still, not using the DP as we miss the playoffs (again) is unforgiveable.

    4) Summary. This is his team. Let his see it through. If he makes the playoffs, he can stay. But I prefer Warzycha, he had a better record than Sigi playing with the likes of Knox Cameron, Sutton, Vasquez, and Storey. And we were aggressive doing it, not boring.
    Also, Sigi is McCullers' man. If Sigi goes, Mark should follow him. His tightwad ways must go. As others have noted, RSL, Dallas, Chicago, and others have all found late season help, but we can't find any? Our DP slot sits unused. Gee, glad we didn't use it on the wrong guy. It's only good for three years, and now one is gone. It smells to me. By bye Mark.

    Prediction: we finish 10th. And deservedly so.
     
  7. AuntLoosey

    AuntLoosey New Member

    Jun 21, 2007
    Buy one good fuching forward! End of problem. Playoff bound.
    Key word being BUY!!
    But that ain't gonna happen, unless MM uses his own golf earnings.
    Whay didn't he play Arena for a forward instead of cash?
    And, oh yea, we are going to need someone with experience to replace Slowloto soon.
     
  8. west ham sandwich

    Feb 26, 2007
    C-bus
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Guille signed on 4/19. Played his first game 3 weeks later. I'll count his first game as part of the pre-guille record (they lost so I'm being conservative here - but I'll grant it takes some time to work him in).

    The crew's record sin Guille: 1-1-3 T-T-T-L-W-L
    1pts/game

    The Crew's record con Guille
    T-L-T-L-L-T-W-W-W-T-W-L-W-T-L-L-T-T
    1.22 pts/game

    Home games in bold.

    If I count Guilles first game in the con Guille it becomes:
    Sin Guille 1.2 pts/game
    Con Guille 1.15 pts/game

    Big difference there. How many games are there? 30? At that rate, a full season of Guille gives the crew 37 pts.

    Fact of the matter is, as of this point in the season, the crew have one hot streak of 5 to 7 games.

    6 more games to show that hot streak wasn't an anomoly. I don't have much confidence in that happening - hope I'm wrong though.


    Look, all the credit in the world for signing Guille. But he's a 2 year, 3 at most, hired gun and every other team in the league has made more moves this season. Where's the help for GBS for his limited time here?
     
  9. Foosinho

    Foosinho New Member

    Jan 11, 1999
    New Albany, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, you're half-right here. I don't know what you expect a three-forward lineup to look like, but I'll tell you right now it doesn't usually involve three guys standing around in the center channel. Spread those guys out, and they become "old-school" wingers. Which are very different from outside midfielders in a 4-5-1.
     
  10. Dave Brull

    Dave Brull Member

    Mar 9, 2001
    Mayfield Hts, Ohio
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Um, Sigi formed the pre-Guille team as well that led to the coma. He hasn't also made any significant changes to his post-Guille team that would exploit the advantage of having Guille on the field in the first place.

    Hunt has shown his willingness to cough up some dough to sign players so I do not know if he is the problem.

    Give it to me straight. What has Sigi done, as a coach, that makes you want him to stay (directed to the general populace)
     
  11. PVancouver

    PVancouver Member

    Apr 1, 1999
    Moreno and Miglioranzi got their first Crew starts the same day as Schelotto, Virtuoso and Kamara were relegated to the bench.
     
  12. eboe

    eboe Member+

    Columbus Crew
    United States
    May 23, 2006
    Columbus, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    it's time to revive this thread. Posting the picture of the day:

    [​IMG]

    If CHunt, McCullers, and Sigi won't pony up for a finisher, then they all 3 need to go. Mark can talk all he wants but it never seems to materialize. This team is losing it's fanbase, and 2 seasons of not making the playoffs after you were hired to rebuild after another season of missing the playoffs? YER OUT!
     
  13. Bill Archer

    Bill Archer BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 19, 2002
    Washington, NC
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'll skip the rest and just ask this:

    What could possibly make you think that Zayner "is going to be very good"?

    His senior year in college, which was two years ago? That's the last time most anyone has see him play in a meaningful match.

    BTW: I notice Soumare looked pretty decent last night. He is, of course, the guy Chicago picked up with second pick in the draft which we gave them for the forward who is apparently so bad that a team desperate for a forward (ie. us) won't play him.

    You have to admit - it simply cannot be denied, even by you - that Sigi's use of draft picks has been a disaster.

    There is NOT ONE Sigi Schmid draft choice starting for this team. In the last two drafts combined, we've had two of the top five picks (#2 in 2007, #3 in 2006) and have gotten exactly squat. Zip. Nothing. Goose egg.

    So go ahead: tell me what that says about the guy. Zayner? Bust. Garey? First round bust. Herron: wasted pick if Sigi won't play him. Kamara: not a bad looking kid, but he's not playing. Who else? Moss? Please. Duke Hashimoto? Give me a break.Remember our first pick this year, Brad Evans? Nobody else does either. How's Aaron Chandler doing.

    Bottom line, myshap, you cannot get NO production from two full drafts, let alone two drafts stuff full of high picks because you've sucked so bad.

    That alone is enough for me to fire the guy.
     
  14. myshap

    myshap Member

    Jun 19, 2002
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Well I said picking up Garey was a mistake from the minute he was drafted. Kljestan was so clearly the better soccer player it was sickening. A certain someone with BA initials called me obtuse last year every time I pointed out he just wasn't good enough for this level, however.

    As for Zayner, just wishful thinking of the kind I've allowed myself to partake in with this bunch. Everything I said in this thread was wrong.

    ******** this team. After standing in that rain last night, I could care less if this team is contracted and Hunt Park is used for cow judging events.
     
  15. PVancouver

    PVancouver Member

    Apr 1, 1999
    Bill, are you talking about the same Sigi Schmid that...

    traded Matt Reis to New England in 2003 (for Alex Pineda Chacon and a conditional pick)?
    traded Simon Elliott to Columbus in 2004 (for the first round pick used to acquire Troy Roberts)?
    traded Brian Mullan to San Jose in 2003?
    traded Robin Fraser to Colorado in 2001 (for three second round picks)?
    traded Ezra Hendrickson to Dallas in 2003?
    traded Daniel Hernandez to New England in 1999?
    waived Craig Waibel in 2003?
    waived Brian Ching in 2002?
    signed Luis Hernandez in 2000?
    signed Hong Myung-Bo in 2003?
    signed Diego Serna in 2003?
    signed Jovan Kirovski in 2004?
    signed Andreas Herzog in 2004?
    drafted Memo Gonzalez #8 in 2003?
    drafted Josh Gardner #13 in 2004?
    drafted Hemir Neibles #12 in 2002?
    drafted Isaias Bardales #11 in 2001?
    drafted Troy Roberts #8 in 2005?
    used top 25 picks to draft Robert Russell, Bryheem Hancock, Gavin Glinton, Arturo Torres, Scot Thompson, Ricky Lewis, Guillermo Arzate, and Michael Enfield?

    That Sigi Schmid?

    He did draft Danny Califf (#8), Sasha Victorine (#11), Peter Vagenas (#23), Brian Ching (#11), Alejandro Moreno (#27), Joseph Ngwenya (#3), and Ned Grabavoy (#14).

    He brought in Carlos Ruiz and Landon Donovan, but also Michael Umana, Eduardo de Conceicao, Guillermo Ramirez, Pablo Nagamura, Marcelo Saragosa, Sebastian Vorbe, and Thomas Serna.
     
  16. PVancouver

    PVancouver Member

    Apr 1, 1999
    Should I mention that Garey (#3), Kamara (#9), and Zayner (#13) might not actually be better than Jozy Altidore (#17) or Jonathan Bornstein (#37) (who went to UCLA of all places).
     
  17. electrickeeper

    electrickeeper mido hearter
    Staff Member

    Oct 14, 2002
    Columbus, OH
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What an impressive roster move history. :rolleyes:
     
  18. Bill Archer

    Bill Archer BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 19, 2002
    Washington, NC
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Gag me with a spoon.

    And you left out my favorite: traded the Columbus Crew a second round pick for the rights to McKinley Tennyson, who was at that time playing in Sweden and went on to have a distinguished career of about six months with the Portland Timbers.
     
  19. jcrocker

    jcrocker Member

    Jun 1, 1999
    Springboro, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If Sigi refuses to make changes to a team that hasnt won in 8 games then fire him.

    This team should be:
    Kei Herron
    Virtuoso Grabs Duncan GBS
    Migs Gonzo ? Hejduk
    Hesmer

    Rogers, Gaven, Ward/Zayner off the bench.

    Trade some youth: Garey, Chandler, Evans, for a center back. That should be easy enough and make a run.

    Can you imagine GBS playing balls in behind defenses to the speed of Herron and Kei? or Frankie overlapping GBS? Damn this team has potential and it is wasting away on the bench.
     
  20. Goalden

    Goalden New Member

    Aug 4, 2003
    Bottoms
    Nice post.
    Nothing like a few facts to make you reconsider your opinions.
    Could it be that the owners and McCullers put it all in Sigis hands, including the purse strings and this is all he could come up with?
    Could this all be Sigis fault?
    Or Does he need just one more year to shake up the dice some more and see what rolls out?
    It seems he's created a mess, I don't know if he can clean it up next year. It seems obvious that we need to bring in a higher quality of player. He must not have the contacts we thought he had. If it really is all on him then he's gone.

    So, if he's California Dreamin,then we probably get Bob, which I'm resigned to. But that isn't going to help our finding the players we need. So we get Bob, who will do fine as a coach eventually, and we need a system to bring in the players we need like everybody else did this year.
    At least that can be done and offers some hope, as compared to having owners who won't spend the money.
     
  21. Foosinho

    Foosinho New Member

    Jan 11, 1999
    New Albany, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Nobody expected Bornstein to turn out the way he has. Nobody.
     
  22. PVancouver

    PVancouver Member

    Apr 1, 1999
    Are you certain it wasn't a second round supplemental draft pick? In 2002 the Crew had a natural second round draft pick and one acquired from Dallas for Tenywa Bonseu.

    Kei was tied with Brian Ching for leading point getter late in the 2002 A-League season.
     
  23. Bill Archer

    Bill Archer BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 19, 2002
    Washington, NC
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You know I'm not one to look much up, but as I recall it, there were three guys in the draft who were sure-fire first rounders but who everybody knew were planning on going overseas if they could swing a deal: Robbie Russell, Brent Rahim and McKinley Tennyson.

    Sigi went ahead and wasted his second rounder on Russell, who never went near the Gals. The other two guys lasted until the fourth round (Superdraft) when Columbus took a flyer on Tennyson and Sigi stepped up and grabbed Rahim.

    Rahim is a native of T & T and chose to sign with Joe Public to increase his chances of playing for their national team in the runup to WC02. He later played some in Europe (QPR sticks in my mind) but never played a minute for the Galaxy.

    Russell banged around Scandinavia for a while. DNK where he is now but he too never played for the Gals.

    Tennyson (as we all know, I'm the world's leading expert on Lord Tenny) bounced around the continent for awhile got turned down at places like St Pauli, and finally ended up playing a season with a Swedish side to no particular distinction.

    Columbus traded his rights to Sigi, and he came in, I believe, at the very end of the 2001 season and was on the bench when the Quakes beat LA 2-1 in CCS for the MLS Cup. Only time I ever saw the guy.

    I would have sworn that we got a natural second rounder for him, but I could obviously be mistaken. The guy was clearly not cutting it in Sweden, he was a UCLA guy (one of Sigi's own) and I recall laughing at Sigi wasting a perfectly good pick on the guy and thinking that we'd really fleeced him.

    But that was six years ago and I won't swear to it.
     
  24. PVancouver

    PVancouver Member

    Apr 1, 1999
    Your memory is better than mine, but I don't recall getting anything for Tennyson.
     
  25. myshap

    myshap Member

    Jun 19, 2002
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    While I no longer believe that Sigi hasn't screwed the pooch here, the problem I have with said list is that you can go through just about every single manager in this league and come up with a very similar looking list. Fact is 80 to 90 percent of personnel moves teams make are failures. It's just the nature of the beast. Which is fine because most teams only need a select few to work out to improve/build on the roster they already have.

    With the Crew, however, Sigi came in and just blew up the roster. And I don't know if anyone can ever convince me that didn't need to be done here. A couple players here and there I wouldn't mind having back, but for the most part it was neccassary. So the question as I see it is has Sigi failed because he's brought no talent here(where I see a lot of people going) or has he failed because he has brought talent here, but just not at the rate he needed to given that he started from basically nothing?

    My heart wants to believe the latter because that at least gives us some hope for the future.
     

Share This Page