Incredible news, if true

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by superdave, Sep 23, 2003.

  1. Demosthenes

    Demosthenes Member+

    May 12, 2003
    Berkeley, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I can't speak for others who are against the war or upset with Bush, but I am angry that we did it at all.

    The fact that Bush misled the public about the reasons for the war only intensifies my feeling of frustration.

    I wanted to see Saddam go, but I never thought an invasion would be worth the consequences. Now that it is done, I don't believe it was. Again, I reiterate, I think Saddam was a bad, bad, nasty man. But I still do not think the U.S. should have invaded Iraq.

    I'm sure you're having difficulty reconciling those two sentiments. Someday you'll come to understand that life and politics are not really made up of either/or scenarios.
     
  2. SoFla Metro

    SoFla Metro Member

    Jul 21, 2000
    Ft. Lauderdale, FL
    ;)

    Why do you continue to defend Saddam Hussein?
     
  3. Malaga CF fan

    Malaga CF fan Member

    Apr 19, 2000
    Fairfax, VA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, I guess I have no hope but to move to France!!! ;)
     
  4. Richth76

    Richth76 New Member

    Jul 22, 1999
    Washington, D.C.
    Exactly. In which reality does the sentence, "I believe President Bush is a liar", equate to, "Jeez, I sure do miss Saddam Hussein, I wish he was my president". Oh yeah, in the warped mind of our very own MannyFreshStunna.
     
  5. Mel Brennan

    Mel Brennan PLANITARCHIS' BANE

    Paris Saint Germain
    United States
    Apr 8, 2002
    Baltimore
    Club:
    Paris Saint Germain FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Except that every now and then, both life and politics are. Such as "Either America gets rid of Bush in 2004, or it signifies to the world:

    'We were lied to, and the working class/middle class lost many of its children, murdered in the sand, but that's what we want and deserve, 'cause we think so little of ourselves, 'cause we're off chasing the American Dream, no time for reflection or meaningful participation, FRIENDS is on'..."

    Yes, some things are indeed "either/or"...
     
  6. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002
    I might support a war to free Tibet if we got to fight the Iraqis instead of the Chinese.
     
  7. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Memo to Karl Keller:
    Is this what you mean by "putting words into people's mouths?"
     
  8. obie

    obie New Member

    Nov 18, 1998
    NY, NY
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's like saying you wouldn't mind playing the World Cup final against Martinique.

    But it brings up the fourth possible scenario for this war: We knew we could win, which makes it politically popular. Which, of course, is kinda ironic because while we could defeat the soldiers and destroy the military infrastructure with little effort, that doesn't necessarily count as a win when about a third of the country really despises our occupation and the other two thirds are more than a little suspicious that we will never leave.
     
  9. mannyfreshstunna

    mannyfreshstunna New Member

    Feb 7, 2003
    Naperville, no less
    Ahhh yes. I come back from class and the liberal chorus really "got me" this time. Please, a spelling smack, Chuck D lyrics, and a petty insult?

    This is what I'm talking about. it's never actually about the issue at hand. It's always about something else.

    And obviously since I'm too stupid to spell "crucifixion", whatever i say is just ripped from Coulter or Rush or some other conservative i don't listen to.


    Listen. Does anyone want to talk about positives/negatives here? Cause if you want to keep playing Bush pinata i'll be glad to give you all sticks and blindfolds and let you whoop each other for all eternity.
     
  10. afgrijselijkheid

    Dec 29, 2002
    mokum
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    hey mannys fresh tuna, don't you ever get tired of stinkin' the place up? has your boyfriend ever done anything untoward? grow up republicon... the people in the white house are dirty, dirty byatches PERIOD
     
  11. mannyfreshstunna

    mannyfreshstunna New Member

    Feb 7, 2003
    Naperville, no less
    Wow...wow. i can't believe how much you owned me right there. I mean, you totally showed me.
    Look at that. Ow, my pride hurts. Geez, just look at that;no remorse man. You saw your opportunity and you just cracked open this gem. I'm impressed. I really am. I mean look at the word you came up with. "Republicon." Man. That is soooo clever. I mean, you took the name of the party, and instead of it being "can" you changed it to "con." This implies in a clever way that republicans are really con artists who thieve for a living. What a smart, clever person you must be to take an everyday word out of context like that and give it a whole new meaning.

    That's really a great job man, keep up the good work.
     
  12. afgrijselijkheid

    Dec 29, 2002
    mokum
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    no genius actually by republicon, which btw i've used on this board for ages, refers to the fact that all W apologists/supporters spout the same bullshyte program... a la a robot... republicon... get it... never mind
     
  13. John Galt

    John Galt Member

    Aug 30, 2001
    Atlanta
    Manny,
    In your posts you keep using the word "you" to refer to -- it seems -- a group of people (liberals who post). In your posts you accuse that group (the amorphous "you") of being Saddam Hussein apologists. Your evidence for this is apparently any and all posts criticizing any part of the war, be it the diplomacy, the representations to the public, the military strategy, the post-war planning.

    I'm sure you have rational thoughts on these subjects, but do you understand why people are jumping on that particular post? Just acknowledge it because its become the distraction that killed this thread.
     
  14. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002
    Excactly. And I'd be happy to bet on the USA in that case. You see, it's a very consistent position, which for some bizarre reason gets certain anti-war activitsts apoplectic.

    The very first question I'd want answered before deciding to go to war:

    Can we win?

    If no, the discussion is over.

    If yes, then at what price?

    Only here can we begin to discuss the reasons for going to war and make a determination if it's worth the costs.

    Was the Iraq war worth it? Probably not, but one could easily support it ENTIRELY on humanitarian grounds without supporting a war to liberate Tibet and still be perfectly consistent.
     
  15. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Dude, you gotta admit, the particular misspelling was hilarious.
     
  16. mannyfreshstunna

    mannyfreshstunna New Member

    Feb 7, 2003
    Naperville, no less
    Yes dave, for you, i suppose it was. Now would you care to comment further?
     
  17. dfb547490

    dfb547490 New Member

    Feb 9, 2000
    The Heights
    Powell didn't say Saddam didn't have anything, he said he didn't have anything "significant". Our February 2001 definition of "significant" might be very different from our post-9/11 definition of "significant".

    Powell shouldn't have said that in Cairo. Remember that his remarks were certainly based nearly entirely on Clinton-era intel, and Clinton ordered military strikes on Iraq several times for their refusal to comply with WMD regulations.

    What does that have to do with anything? Rummy wanted to find out if Saddam was involved, he didn't say he was.

    Again, what's your point? The Bushies were still gathering intel at this point.

    The same intel that Clinton used as justification for ordering air strikes against Iraq?

    I made a mistake in saying that because I didn't pay attention to the dates on Powell's quote. If I see proof that the Bush administration did not believe Saddam had significant amounts of WMDs post-9/11, then yeah.
     
  18. DJPoopypants

    DJPoopypants New Member

    Do I have this right?

    (2001, paraphrased) - "Saddam isn't a threat to the US"

    I guess it all depends what your definition of "isn't" is, huh?
     
  19. phats_away

    phats_away Member

    Jul 28, 2001
    Atlanta, Ga
    are they teaching you anything? is my lotto money going to good use? are you going to uga? because that might explain something...
     
  20. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002
    We didn't take bin-Laden all that seriously either before 9-11. Your smoking gun is a water pistol.
     
  21. Richth76

    Richth76 New Member

    Jul 22, 1999
    Washington, D.C.
    But we want to "whup" you.
     
  22. dfb547490

    dfb547490 New Member

    Feb 9, 2000
    The Heights
    Yes, you have it right. As Ben said, prior to 9/11 I wouldn't have said bin Laden posed a major threat to the US mainland either. Sure, he could threaten our allies abroad, and carry out relatively minor attacks like bombing our destroyers and embassies, but he couldn't threaten, say New York City or Washington DC.

    Hmm, does that sound familiar?
     
  23. Scoey

    Scoey Member

    Oct 1, 1999
    Portland
    More gems from Powell on Iraq:

    From http://usembassy-australia.state.gov/hyper/2001/0227/epf202.htm
     
  24. fishbiproduct

    fishbiproduct New Member

    Mar 29, 2002
    Pasadena Ca.
    That would have been incredibly naive, dfb.
    The US knew prior to 9/11 that Al Qaeda could
    and would strike on its territory. It just failed
    massively at acting on it.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/america_under_attack/clues/timeline.html
     
  25. mannyfreshstunna

    mannyfreshstunna New Member

    Feb 7, 2003
    Naperville, no less
    What's that? You won't engage the issue? Ok i just wanted to make sure i heard you right.
     

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