I'm impressed with the Nats in the Gold Cup [R]

Discussion in 'Canada' started by GIO17, Jul 10, 2005.

  1. GIO17

    GIO17 Member

    Nov 29, 1998
    Sorry to see an Own Goal off of your defender become a one goal lead for the US, but I am very impressed by the way Frankie Yallop has gotten your National Team side ready to play and playing very tough defense against my US side. I honestly believed that our match should have been a scoreless draw.

    I work at a Sports News Service and I was able to see the match in english on RSN. I have to tell you that I was very impressed with the coverage. I enjoyed listening to your announcers in the booth, the play-by-play man I think he does interviews for RSN West in Calgary or Vancouver for hockey.

    I really wish Canada would have a Division I side on it's own. Don't get me wrong, happy to hear that Toronto, Montreal & Vancouver are apart of USL here in the states, but if Canada does get a real Division I league going and Rogers Sportsnet makes a TV deal I thik you are all set.

    Once again I was impressed with how Yallop got your side to play strong and I truely believed it should have been a scoreless draw.
  2. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    some notes from an American who occasionally lurks over on the Voyageurs board ....

    1) There's a lot of fire going Frank Yallop's way, but I think you need to give him some credit where it's due. Your team played a tough-tackling, organized defensive game.

    2) Your offensive end needs work, at least with this group of players. It seems the problem was in the attacking midfield. Occean did a decent job of finding space and looking dangerous. Dwayne De Rosario has a lot of skill, but he reminds me a bit of Jeff Cunningham -- likes to dribble too much. You can do that mor easily at the club level than at hte international level, where it just gives the 4 best defenders from another country the opportunity to set up. Then again, part of the probblem is that the tight defensive formation kept yall from having a lot of bodies going forward at times.

    Given that, I think you shoudl consider moving Simpson up to the left midfield position, if feasible. His ball skill and attacking sense seems a little wasted at the back. At least in this game. I didn't see a lot out of Brennan. Peters is awfully young, but shows promise, and stretched out the defense on that side.

    Partr of the offensive problem is unfamiliarity. For instance, I thought your best scoring chance came on the Seroiux shot that hit Occean. If he had picked up Occean's nice piece of vision and slid the ball in front of him, he would have been face to fae with Keller from 10-12 out. He probably scores. Donovan would have made the pass, but SErioux didn't pick up on it.

    3) I think the happiness with Sutton might collapse after a meaningful loss. He's fine, bu seemed to overcommit to Beasley somewhat on the Donovan goal. I don't know why you would not looking at Fernandes more seriously, sooner or later.

    Thought you guys played pretty decently.
  3. Captain Canuck

    Captain Canuck New Member

    May 13, 2002
    Thanks for the comments - a lot nicer than what a lot of the other American's are saying about our team in the US forum, I've noticed! You might want to spread the word to a few of them who are beating their chests over this one that our squad was largely a developmental team for 2010, with just a few experienced first choice players out there. ;)

    A couple of points - it was actually Bernier's arm that blocked Serioux's shot, which is ironic in that it was Bernier's chest that was mistaken for his arm in the previous game by Prendergrast, leaving us in a hole for this game. As for whether Sutton over-committed on the last goal, possibly, but its difficult to say. He still has to guard against the possibility of a shot not a pass. It was a world class goal with that chip pass and header (I could tell it wasn't Noonan on the end of it) so its difficult to be too hard against him. As for Fernandes, we'll have to see if Yallop ever takes a look, I can almost envision him going to young Begovic of Portsmouth first given his love for Jamie Peters at a really young age.
  4. Peretz48

    Peretz48 Member+

    Nov 9, 2003
    Los Angeles
    Speaking of Begovic, I got to see him play on a number of occasions with the U20s. I think this kid can be a real good one. And Yallop must be given time to develop the younger players. If he gets all the organizational things he needs, he should put Canada into a much more competitive situation for '10 qualifying. I don't think a Canadian Div 1 league is economically feasible. However, a Toronto (or other Canadian city) franchise in MLS, with MLS allowing Canadian citizenship exemptions to the current MLS rules would help your program quite a bit.
  5. RedandWhite

    RedandWhite Member

    Jul 5, 2005
    Thanks for the comments GIO17. :) Likes Captain Canuck said, it much better then what they are saying about us in the USA forum.

    I think a Canadian Division I would be great but we don't have the money. But an MLS club in Canada would be great.
  6. Captain Canuck

    Captain Canuck New Member

    May 13, 2002
    Its strange to see how many of them are stating that they "dominated us for the entire match". For 15 minutes of the 2nd half maybe (after the own goal gave the US momentum) but that would be it. They always had an edge in the play, but that's not the same thing as "domination".

    I expected us to get dominated for the entire match with the "developmental" squad we brought - I was pleasantly surprised we weren't. I was also surprised how many times we sliced open the US defense, its just a shame that our final ball was almost always terrible (or when it wasn't a debatable or simply incorrect offside call was given).

    We're overdue for some good fortune against Cuba in more ways than one. I hope its enough to get us into the next round, but a win by any amount of goals might not do it.
  7. Stars&Bars

    Stars&Bars New Member

    Aug 13, 2004
    Since I don't know team Canada who exactly is your A squad or non "developmental" squad? We didn't dominate no, but I think we also played like crap, not to say that you all didn't play well but these two games haven't really been that great for us. Only 4 guys, Donovan, Keller, Mastroeni, and Cherundolo, who started yesterday are actual locks for the US next summer. As much as I don't like using letter grades to describe our side, I would not say this was anywhere near our "A" team.

    Good luck against Cuba.
  8. Joe MacCarthy

    Joe MacCarthy New Member

    Dec 4, 2004
    Our MIAs and reasons for their absences

    Starting with new club
    Paul Stalteri - Tottenham (English Premier League) (1)
    Julian de Guzman - Deportivo La Coruña (Primera Division) (1)
    Mike Klukowski - Club Brugge (Belgian Jupiler League) (1)
    Daniel Imhof - VfL Bochum (German Bundesliga 2) (2)

    Marco Reda - AaB Aalborg (Danish Superligaen) (1) Getting married
    Ante Jazic - SC Kuban Krasnodar (Russian 1st League) (2) Injured?

    Retired from intl play - Rad may continue, De Vos likely will not
    Tomasz Radzinski - Fulham (English Premier League) (1)
    Jason De Vos - Ipswich Town (English The Championship) (2)
  9. Captain Canuck

    Captain Canuck New Member

    May 13, 2002
    Radz will definitely continue, but I doubt we'll see De Vos again. Encouraged by Atiba's play in the back.

    You also left out Tam Nsaliwa, who turned down the invite right before he re-signed with Saarbrucken in the Bundesliga 2. He hasn't been chosen by Yallop in the past year but should have been, and was selected for the Gold Cup. Add McKenna (suspended) & Hume (injured) and you have a whopping 10 A-team players missing from the team for that game (not counting De Vos, nor Lars Hirshfeld).

    Difference between the US & Canada is that the US can more easily replace missing first-choice players, compared to Canada who has Patrick Leduc (who I don't think should even be on our B team) playing in Julian De Guzman's spot. You could get scared of heights looking at that drop. Our depth is improving, but still not where we would like it.
  10. Joe MacCarthy

    Joe MacCarthy New Member

    Dec 4, 2004
    To my mind Tam is another Jazic, the legend is growing more than the player. Until he starts showing up he is nothing special. It's not like he's playing at the highest level. He plays at a good level and hopefully will go higher but we haven't seen him in the red for so long I'm afraid his status has grown to Aguiarian proportions.

    How many guys have the fans called for in the past have gone out and truly impressed. Few. It seems attention usually goes to the player who seems to achieve more than his playing level indicates. ie Sutton, Grande

    I'm not saying he isn't a good player (or someday great) but I don't think he is the saviour some purport him to be. And his commitment to the Leaf lately is questionable. He's had excuses (some legit) but Jimmy B has more of a case to be POed than Tam and he's shown up since his kerfuffle.

    I'm an optimist but Tam's got to show me something soon playing for the red. It's been a long time since Beasley.
  11. Captain Canuck

    Captain Canuck New Member

    May 13, 2002
    I think you're forgetting though that Tam was showing up at all levels for his country virtually all the time from 2000 to 2003, then Yallop came in and didn't call him when we needed him the most. Then he called Tam when we were out and it would have meant Tam would have missed club time to play in a meaningless game after being dropped from the team. Not really comparable to Jazic's early days.
  12. Joe MacCarthy

    Joe MacCarthy New Member

    Dec 4, 2004
    My memory is quite good. Tam was snubbed by Frank because he played a poor game when Frank was watching (injury) and Tam chose to snub playing for Canada for awhile.

    Sounded like they had made up, then Tam decides he has to go to Saarbrucken's camp so he can re-sign with the team. If his position with Saarbrucken is that tenuous...

    Brennan was snubbed while playing in the EPL (as opposed to Bund 2) yet he saw fit to return and play in meaningless games.
  13. beachesl

    beachesl Member

    Oct 21, 2002
    Mendoza, Argentina
    Cmon Joe, buddy, Brennan (who I am a supporter of) hardly "played" in the EPL, as his appearances with the Norwich first squad were few and far between, and he did lousy the few chances he got. Best thing to happen to him was Norwich's instant relegation, as now he might have a chance to crack the first team again. You are right about his being enthusiastic about appearing for Canada.
  14. Joe MacCarthy

    Joe MacCarthy New Member

    Dec 4, 2004
    Brennan was no more than a bit part player as Norwich won the First Division title in 2003/04, after making his debut in a 1-0 win at home to Crewe Alexandra at the end of November.

    The left-back, who can also play in midfield, was beset with injury problems as an abductor muscle injury forced him to miss the beginning of the campaign. And he then found it hard to break into a winning side, making 16 appearances over the remainder of the season.

    I wouldn't call 16 appearances all that bad.

    Frank has said he wants players who want to play for the Leaf. At this point Tam doesn't seem to want to. Not to say that can't change. ie Rad, Jazic
  15. BC_Ref

    BC_Ref New Member

    Jul 18, 2004
    Was lucky enough to be at the game on Saturday - the defense was generally solid (especially given the US pressure) but Canada again lacks that scoring ability. Becoming depressed that Canada seems to be completely unable to score.
  16. Captain Canuck

    Captain Canuck New Member

    May 13, 2002
    Following three years of Tam as regular. And this is all comparable to Jazic's early career for Canada in what sense? :confused:
  17. Joe MacCarthy

    Joe MacCarthy New Member

    Dec 4, 2004
    Uhh... not showing up when asked.

    Because this seems to be going nowhere all I'm saying is this. There were lots of calls for Jazic to play for Canada. When he finally did he turned out to be an unspectacular, serviceable player. Neither great nor bad. I say the same about Tam and hope he proves me wrong.
  18. Captain Canuck

    Captain Canuck New Member

    May 13, 2002
    Well, you could name a whole bunch of players other than Jazic if that's the criteria. ;)
  19. torontosports

    torontosports New Member

    Jan 14, 2005
    Brennan was the biggest piece of crap on the whole pitch for both matches. I can't believe anyone could justify his play he was atrocious at best.
  20. hobbes

    hobbes Member

    Jul 26, 1999
    regina, saskatchewan
    If you think Brennan was worse than Leduc, then I think you've lost the plot. But yeah I felt Brennan looked very out of season. Simpson did too, but to a much lesser extent against the US. Brennan was actually much better after he moved inside when Peters came on, but he didn't stay there long. I chalk a lot of that up to Cherundolo.

    I've been pleased with Gervais in this tourney. Bernier looked good against Costa Rica and showed a few flashes against the US to make me think he has something. Before that Costa Rica game stories involving one million Euro transfer offers from the likes of Besitkas being rejected had me looking for four men on horseback.

    I'm not sold on Braz outside, but he's not bad and he's young. Deserves another look at some point. Serioux has been better than usual, but I don't see him as a possible for even 08 and we might as well get some more youth in there unless we're missing a lot of players.

    I liked Gerba's play more than most and I think more people were big on Occean than I was. DeRosario has been guilty of his bad habits more than usual this tournament and I think giving him the arm band didn't help. Of course not knowing your teammates will encourage him to try to beat four guys on the dribble.

    I don't think Tam is the second coming and I don't think I'd start him. However I'm sold on the fast/skill guy and big hard man central defence pair. We have plenty of the latter (McKenna, Gervais and Reda all seem capable), but I'd rather see Hutchinson at RB or in at right mid than in the centre of defence. Give me Klukowski or Nsaliwa in the middle and I think we have a good backline.

    I agree that if Brennan keeps struggling put Simpson in the midfield. We can use Jazic at LB (or Klukowski with Tam in the middle, if he and Frank ever kiss and make up).

    I think the team is taking shape pretty nicely. We aren't missing that many players at this tournament, but the sheer drop off in quality is what's really striking.

    I like the confidence we're playing with for the most part. At least in the back two-thirds of the field. Granted if Patrick Leduc ever tries to dribble out of his own box after a goal-mouth scramble again I'm going to have a coronory, but generally I like seeing nearly everyone (even Gervais and Hutch as CB) taking guys on and dribbling out of danger.

    We're not hoofing it out of the back as much as we used to, instead we seem to be hoofing it from midfield positions. But I chalk that up to personnel.

    We'll see if our depth really does have what it takes Tuesday. Hopefully Cuba goes gunning for goals and hopefully we pick it up a notch and start a decent midfield and get after it.

  21. Joe MacCarthy

    Joe MacCarthy New Member

    Dec 4, 2004
    Oddly enough our Fifa ranking should rise because we scored two goals on a team (Cuba) ranked 15 places above us.

    I know many of you won't agree with me but I get the feeling we are finally on the right track. Essentially it is our B team that went into Guatemala and won, NI and won ugly with 10 men, and by most accounts is playing some decent looking soccer. They just can't finish, this will come in time. These guys aren't playing in the Big Four but are showing some heart, something we lacked in WCQ.

    For a while I was ready to join the "Fire Yallop" brigade but I've been thinking about it. The team seems to be going in the right direction but the results haven't been as quick as we hope. Firing Yallop will only get us back to square one for a new coach to make the same mistakes.

    The lack of discipline does bother me. The yellows and reds really have to be curtailed. We know the Concacaf refs are crap, we have to accept and shut up about it. Remember the World Hockey Championships in the 70s and 80s. You can't fight City Hall so don't bother. Grit your teeth and move on.

    The other thing that bothers me is the 85+ minute goals, we gave up almost every game. Drives me nuts. I guess against Cuba everyone was playing up but still this is happening it seems almost every game. Frankie really has to nip this in the bud.
  22. Le Zebre

    Le Zebre Member

    May 10, 2005
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    What's funny is that i completely agree. I didn't get many chances to watch the Nats play and with everyone saying how we were sending a B team and that Yallop should be fired i wasn't expecting much but i was pleasently surprised in this tournament and IMO should give Yallop another chance. I don't see how we can blame bad finishing on the coach.
  23. Captain Canuck

    Captain Canuck New Member

    May 13, 2002
    It hasn't been talked about much, but I've never seen a Canadian team so confident at playing there way out of trouble at the back. Against the Yanks & Ticos they would often have hoofed the ball down the field to get it out of trouble, even with a young 2nd string team we passed our way out of danger & up the field. I also liked the number of chances we created with this team. I would have enjoyed better finishing (not just from the strikers) and better officiating of course, but the latter is par for the course, we'll just have to get to be so good that we win in spite of the horrendously bad officiating.
  24. TastySimon

    TastySimon New Member

    Jun 28, 2005
    I agree, I'm very impressed with their effort and performance. I just wonder how things would have turned out without the penalty vs CRC and the own goal vs USA...They could have just tanked after these misfortunes but they fought hard and never gave up.
  25. RedandWhite

    RedandWhite Member

    Jul 5, 2005
    I agree as well. Although we only won one game, we kept up with 24th ranked Costa Rica, 10th ranked USA, and got a win against 70th ranked Cuba. That might not sound like much but this stuff will help us in the long-run.

    Let's hope our efforts get us some points in the World Rankings.

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