If You Were Ferguson...

I say we buy Michael Owen and make him our DM. Hey, if Smudger could do it, why not the vastly more talented Mickey?

 

I think others have put up that list although I did not mean Top defensive central midfield players. I meant that kind of money should be reserved for a player who is undoubtedly one of the five greatest talents on the planet, regardless of position. I used Rooney as the example, because he was the type of player that when he became available you had to sign him at any price. Diarra isn't that type of player. We sure as hell shouldn't be desperate to sign anybody, just be cause they play the position.

I know this sounds like blasphemy, but I would rather finish second in the league to Chelsea for another year if that means we get the perfect player next year. Now, you all want me to tell you who that player is and why he's worth waiting for, and the answer is I don't have an answer. I think its more of a philosophy I'm advocating. Did we know Keane was going to be the type of player to make us forget Brian Robson in 1990 or 1991?

My point is we should concentrate on signing good young English players, or promote through the youth teams until the next Rooney comes along.

 

Young English players are exspensive and just not as good as other young players from say... holland, or argentina.

 

It's all they talk about on Revista de La Liga. Eto'o's ego is not conducive to bench time or compromise and Henry can only play one position. Unless you move Ronaldinho in-field, something will have to give. The fall-out could be huge if you're not careful, I mean, you have the best attacking team in the world, without question...if you overstuff the goose...it's gonna pop!

I've been thinking about hybrid systems for a long time. He's the kind of quality player you plan for after you get him. Also young enough to be moulded a little.

tbh, it's more fanciful thinking then any reality we're going to be presented with.

Perhaps you should wait until we make our signings?

This all just speculation and fanciful musings on a message board to entertain ourselves. Unless Fergie or his suboordinates read BS (.) it barely matters what we think.

I agree and that's why I'm not as hot on Diarra as I was before Lyon mentioned paying more for him then was paid for Essien. £24m+ is a Rijkaard level of DM and Diarra isn't fit to wipe RIjkaard's arse on a bad day. This is what happens when clowns with more money then sense destroy the market-place, unfortnately. Paying what they did, for a player they didn't need and will dump to the bench next season, has set a precedent, one that real clubs, with real budgets, will suffer for. Diarra is a player everyone has a mixed opinion on. For £24m + we shouldn't have doubts about his quality. Every top class player we've bought, especially those in the £20m+ bracket were obviously top end players Rio, Rooney, Veron can anyone honestly say they get that air of grandure from Diarra as they did from the aformentioned?

I'm sure I'm not alone in thinking in the real world if Chelsea did not exist and the market place had not become inflated, Diarra would be no more than a £15m player - he's nothing special - special is the Gerrard's, Makelele's, Xavi's of the world, which is what grates about a fee probably £10m too high for a player who is obviously not in with that calibre of player you would expect to get for that kind of money.

If you look at the comments on Diarra, there is barely a general consensus that he'll come here and be the player he is for Lyon. I just don't know anymore. £25m is not joke or experimental money and it seems ludicrous to even consider it for a player no one can even agree on in terms of ability and fitting in here. Carrick would be no more than £15m (which is a lot easier on the eye than £24m+) plies his trade here already, speaks English and settling in should take no more than a pre-season, Is better technically and has more potential. It just makes more sense to me on every level to go after him then a player who is clearly not in the £25m bracket (in real terms) who noone can definitively say will be the answer for us. I know he's no Djemba, but that experiment has made me a little wary of destroyers from Lique 1. Essien's performances even more so, he hasn't looked anything like the player he was for Lyon and certainly not worth what was paid for him. We can't afford that kind of cock up from a player we're spending the majority of our budget on.

The problem is that the market for 'CM's' is rubbish. You couldn't even get a top ten of defence-first central midfielders that would be agreed upon. There has been a massive decline in the position, because it's being phased out for the most part...you could sit another year waiting for the golden egg that was never even laid let alone hatched. 8yrs ago if you wanted a super CM, they were all over the place... so much so you could have relaxed and not had to panic like we may do this window.

Yes, Roy Keane was wanted by all the best teams in England when he made himself known at Forest under Cloughie. We were desperate to land him and got him at the 11th hour from the Chelsea of the time (Blackburn) who were expecting his signature the next morning... ... we hijacked that and made a British Transfer record to get our man. Unfortunately, there isn't a player for us to go ape to acquire out there.. everything is so much more speculative, apprehensive even. I just hope we don't go for some unknown. That would piss me off, greatly.

Well, we have a few gems waiting for their chances, but they aren't ready yet. (Gibson will take another 2seasons) Pique is a very, very good ball player who may get groomed for CM!! But regardless, we need to get the best we can whilst waiting on those who may or may not make it here. So while we don't want to be spending Rooney money, we must remain seriously competitive and aggressive in pursuit of 1st xi calibre players.

 

Another problem about Aguero, he wants to play for Liverpool or Chelsea.

 

So I am led to belive now that nobody thinks that Ballack would have been a great purchase for ManUtd, is that right.
Can any one tell me how long ago it was we bought our last truly great talented overseas attacking player, in the prime of his career.
You know I cant think of one!!!! Cantona, he was passed on by Leeds as a problem, Bellion no, Veron, no Djemba Djemba, no.

You see what I mean Juventus Real Madrid, Barcelona, Inter Milan, AC Milan, and now Chelsea, are always going to beat us to the draw arnt they.
You know it sickens me to think how Chelsea can keep all there midfield and attacking players happy from one week to the next, there is always 4 or 5 world class players not playing from one week to the next, and now there getting Ballack!. you know it is possible for Rooney Ronaldo and RVN to be all injured at the same time, what then????????????????

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Wouldnt it be great if we beat Chelsea, Blackburn Rovers could be the club to force them to the last match of the season, and Shearer's last Premiership match for Newcastle and his farewell to the club, I wouldnt like to have that fixture as the title decider, ecpecially if there coming of a double defeat losing to Liverpool and then ManUtd, LOL we can dream.

 

FYP..

Agents only want the money for their player. CHelsea will play most, playing time and development is not a concern for most agents.

DS: Who is on this Revista de La Liga? Is it that Guillerme Balague (sp), is he the one saying this "Eto'o will be sold to accomodate Henry?"

 

I was watching an interview he did, when he said that. If his agent told him to say that, then Im pretty sure he is sold on that as well.

 

Veron wasn't an overseas attacking player in the prime of his career?

Yes. Just like they beat us to Rooney. And Ronaldo. And van der Sar. And Vidic. We just can't buy a big name, can we?

We're not like those teams, and quite frankly I have no interest in being anything like them, especially Madrid or Inter.

Yeah, you know having a virtually unlimited money supply can keep a lot of people happy while sitting on the bench. Other teams don't have that luxury, however.

 

Ballack is no longer in the prime of his career.

 

Yes, Balague and their 'men on the streets of Spain' lol They're not saying Eto'o will be sold to accomodate Henry, they're saying Eto'o wont tolerate being a second fiddle. I agree with that, his ego will not accept bench time.

Whoever it is you sacrifice for Henry will cause disruption, be it Eto'o or Deco. I'd expect either one to leave if you get Henry.


and benni, you'd quickly see Aguero change his tune if we were linked. 'it'd be an honour, blah blah' Liverpool have no strike force - logical to hint at a move there...and Chelsea = woohoo I'm rich, but I'm about to throw my playing career away.

 

Not to nitpick.. but Van der Sar and Vidic weren't particularly 'world class big names' when we got them. Also Ronaldo was brought here right when the Mafia took over Chelsea.

 

Interesting stuff DS. I agree with you on the Deco front, but I think we'd be better off pursuing Giuly who can play both on the wing and as a CAM. Giuly adds goals from midfield something that we lack. He's got a good footballing brain and will probably want to leave and shouldn't be that expensive.

I'm not saying no to Deco, I just don't see it happening.

As for Diarra - we agree that he's not near the player he should be for that kind of money but if Carrick/Parker aren't available (I don't see why they should be as Davids is old/may be leaving and Spurs aren't a selling club, Newcastle need more help in CM not less and they'll be looking to spend money post Shearer) don't you think that a stop gap purchase of someone with experience like Vogel, Ambrosini or an iffy player like Makoun or Duscher who wouldn't cost more than 10M would be a wise move?

I mean, if they work out then fine, if they don't then we haven't spent stupid money and we atleast have some depth and we can hold on until a player we have our eye on becomes available or comes of age or we develop our own.

To be honest these are moves that I'd consider...

Saha for Parker. No money involved, Saha will be on a higher wage presumably, Parker is younger - we've got forwards and they need one BADLY

Silvestre+5M for Marquez - I know, highly unlikely, but he'd be a perfect signing. Experienced but not old, can take some freekicks but more importantly will protect the back four adequately and fill in as CB if needed.

Why would Barca go for it? Well, they play Gio and Sylvinho at LB and while they are good going forward, they don't cover well for Ronaldinho who does little tracking back. Also I believe they'd rather play Puyol and Oleguer at CB as Oleguer isn't the best at RB but for political reasons he will always be in the side (he's a decent CB imo). Silvestre still gives them cover at CB and they can sell a LB and purchase some depth at RB as well.

I'd also make an offer for Motta. He's their O'Shea, except with talent and he works harder. He used to play LW iirc and has played CB, DM and possibly LB (chris some help?).


EDIT:

VdS has 100 caps or damn near that and Vidic is a part of one of the most heralded defences in Europe... ok, that's stretching it but they were certainly top players. We also don't need to sign names if the players we do sign perform like Vidic and VdS.

 

Van der Sar has been a pretty big name for a while, but it was surprising that we got him as he'd recently re-signed with Fulham. Vidic was part of that feared S&M (hehe) defense, so he was hardly an unknown quantity. Ronaldo was being tracked by various teams, although most didn't expect him to go to a big club until the following summer.

Still though, its pointless to compare us to the teams neave did because while we buy big names, those clubs build entire teams of big names. We tend to use money to fill the holes that scouting and youth development can't. In this case, it'd be great to get one big name in at CM, but who is really out there? There isn't a Keane sort of situation anywhere, an obvious talent at a team that's going down or in financial straits. We just have to make do with what's out there.

 

I was going to bring up Oshea. Thiago Motta is actually a very talented box to box player. Just had a bad series of injuries. Id love to have him at the club.

Im not exactly sure that any of those players would come in, and do the job we expect, to the level we need to excel. They are role players, not personalities on the pitch. No influencial. Not someone you could call the main man or linchpin or whatever.

 

I'm just excited about the possibilities this summer.. when does the transfer window open? I am just ready to see us buy someone. ..

 

No way. Saha's value is at the very least twice as much as Parker's. We know Saha can play, he fits our formation well, he won't complain if he doesn't start all the time, and whenever he plays he scores. Who is gonna replace him? Ole? Rossi? No, Saha is waaaay too valuable in general (and to us in particular) to let him go for one huge question mark.

VDS stunk when he played for Juventus, and Vidic with his NT played mostly against inferior teams (with the exception of Spain). In Russian league he was not the best central defender last season.

 

Well, that's why they won't cost bookou money. Abronsini is actually quite talented and if we were to land him and one out of Makoun and Vogel I'd be happy. Sure we won't be dominating the midfield like if we have a 29 year old Keane, but we wouldn't get over-run as much as having O'Shea who has no positional sense as a CM and no pace to make up for it, protecting our backline. Abronsini-Jones would be a very nice CM pairing actually. I'd love to see it, but it would never happen.

 

Im not because there isnt a player that could help us, that is available. The other names are good in their current league, but to spend £25 mil on someone that we arent sure will adapt is kind of, no is very risky. (Now that I think about it)

Its hard to stay positive in this situation.

 

Will those players make the difference in us catching Chelsea? Will they make us THAT much better than we already are? They are just minor improvement.

We have to spend a shit load of money.

 

And Louise, yes that's misspelled on purpose, has been a picture of fitness hasn't he? If Newcastle offered that to me I'd have to leave the room and let out the huge grin I'd have been holding back since they proposed it.

VDS didn't stink for Fulham, that's where we bought him from. There's also his international pedigree to consider. Vidic was under the radar, but like I said, he's been performing and that's all we should care about.

 

We've kept pace with Chelsea for long stretches in the past two seasons with Darren Fletcher a major cog in our midfield in season a and with O'Shea/Giggs as our CM pairing in season b. You're damned right I think Jones, Ambrosini, Vogel and Makoun would make a difference.

What would you rather we do? Threaten Gerrard's life and tell him to request a transfer to us? What exactly are our options?

 

I've no idea what u are talking about, and yes I see the smiley but Giuly was CAM before moving to Barca, it was him volleying in everything in a Scholeslike fashion that got Monaco to the finals of the CL. I swear he had like 4 volleyed goals in the CL that year. I know that's neither here nor there, but it was disgusting.