Discussion in 'Coach' started by Benedict XVI, Sep 8, 2002.
They should use baseball-style substitutions, then.
i can top it all!
you ain't heard nothing yet....
In Arizona, state championships that end in ties after overtime end with co-champions! There are no shoot-outs. This is not a misprint. happened to us last year...utterly out of this world decision -making going on in my state.
As for unqualified refs-where do you start?
But, at least we get to play.
That must be another thread....
Re: Re: Re: helmets
I see way too much substitution in most matches. Players need to learn how to play together as a team. You can't do that if every 10 minutes you are subbing players in and out of games. There is no continuity.
Re: i can top it all!
i believe college soccer uses that?
anyone know the rational?
Does anyone know the thought process behind the "no shoot-outs" in championship games?
I would love to get to the bottom of this. Our official answer is that it puts too much pressure on the players, but we have shoot-outs in the quarters and semis, where just as much is at stake.
And, on a philosophical note, what does that teach the players? That there are no losers? Brillant!
Re: anyone know the rational?
Interesting. Are state championships for basketball and football televised in your state? Do they have overtime in case of ties? Just curious, as I suspect playing in a televised game might just be at least as pressure-packed than taking a PK in a shootout might be.
thurd: Most of the college games I've been to don't seem to have that rule in effect. I wonder if it varies depending on the conference.
I had no idea that high school soccer was so screwed up across the country. I realize it's a thrill for adolescents to play for their school, earn a letter, and enjoy some peer support, but I have to believe talented players would be better off seeking adult rec teams to play on or quality u-14, u-16, etc. clubs.
I guess it's best to simply accept it as psuedo-soccer -- meaningless, accept for the exercise it provides.
--- EXCEPT for the exercise it provides. Maybe I shouold find time to audit a few high-school English courses! It's what they do best; they should leave soccer alone.
nope. the NCAA allows players to re-enter the game 1 time each half, and again in OT if the game is tied after regulation.
At least where I am from, clubs run first season, H.S. teams run second, and clubs again for the third season. Most of the successful H.S. teams are basically club teams that have played together almost year round. The talented players that you speak of are getting quality coaching for most of the year, and it shows in the H.S. matches. I wouldn't call it psuedo, or meaningless, just different. My point was that not all H.S soccer is meaningless, but most H.S officiating is sadly lacking, and we have non-soccer playing organizations making decisions that are laughable.
And now, I will get off my soapbox.
Re: Re: Re: Re: helmets
Obviously we will have to agree to disagree, while you see the negatives of unlimited subbing, I see the positives. I think there are enough games in a season to bring about continuity, of course its easy when some areas are not as restricted on the amount of games they can play when compared to other schools/areas.
we play with unlimited subs but we don't make too much subs.
I like High School Soccer
I love all this whining and crying about high school soccer. It's the American version of Euro-snobbery.
I like the following about high school soccer:
1. Their scores get reported in the paper - sometimes there are even stories. Very few, if any, club teams get any coverage at all.
2. They play at night under the lights.
3. They perform before decent ( even large ) crowds.
4. A responsible organization watches out for the well being of the players academically.
Yeah, H.S. soccer is not good everywhere. Neither is club.
I like the idea of co-champions instead of a shootout. No one can convince me that a shootout has anything at all with determining who is the better team. It is no more a part of soccer than a quarterback sack. If two teams are still tied after 120 mins, then maybe there isn't that much difference. I've been on both sides of shootouts and if someone must advance in the tournament, I'd just as soon see a coin toss. To say to posterity that team A is better than team B b/c of PK's is an intolerable cannard.
I also like the idea of having to sub a player on a caution. These are not seasoned pros. I like the idea of some sort of mandatory time out to allow the coach to educate his player about self control.
There are a lot of silly rules peculiar to the H.S. game, but I put up with them for the sake of the kids.
As a working HS Referee, I see compliance with the "signals" thing all over the chart.
Some guys are giving them every call, some only occasionally and some of us (blush, blush) absolutely refuse. The authorities are threatening to suspend anybody they catch not doing it. OK by me, it's just stupid.
The newest one came down this week: they've banned adidas "Fingersave" type gloves. We are supposed to check.
Re: I like High School Soccer
The reason I don't like this rule? Here's the deal. Last season, we were playing in a quarterfinal game that was tied 0-0 with about 3 minutes left. The refs sucked this entire game (not to make excuses but if you saw the game, you would never believe it). Our goalie comes to the top of the box to pick up a through ball. A girl is running onto the ball as the goalie is picking up the ball, so the goalie pulls her arms over her head to get the ball out of reach. The girl continues to run onto the goalie and runs right into the goalie's raised arm, looking like an elbow to the face. The ref issues the goalie a yellow card and points to the penalty spot. Because of the sending-off rule, our amazingly great goalie gets sent off the field, and our young, unexperienced backup gets put in for the penalty kick. The result? They scored, and we lost to a team that was getting tired that we could have beat if the game went into overtime. It sucked.
Re: Re: anyone know the rational?
a conference that my friend plays in uses it......division 3 in new england
i think unlimited subs is ok IF you don't abuse it like 6 guys at once every time. my coach has a starting 11 and plays us till we are dead(all at different times) then subs us out for a minute then puts us right back in. I think this is one of the best ways to build indurance while playing with out abusing the unlimited rule.
Re: Re: I like High School Soccer
The rule is a good one. In my 26 years of involvement with youth and high school soccer, I've seen a lot of strange and incorrect calls. The Rules are not the problem, it's the application.
There are several High School rules I like over the Youth/FIFA rules we use:
- If the team with the ball subs on a throw-in, the other team can also.
- Immediate substitution of cautioned players.
- IFK for team with possesion after stopping for injuries
In Central Iowa, the schools contract with the local soccer officials organization (MISOA), which ensures that officials are USSF, MISOA, and state HS certified. In spring there is no U16 or U19 club soccer, and the club referrees and players do high school. High school soccer gets as much media coverage as any high school sport but football and basketball. Club soccer gets no media coverage.
This pretty much has nothing to do with rules but I was just wondering, when do your boys' and girls' teams play? Fall or spring? Here, in southeast Pennsylvania, both boys and girls play in the spring, but only 30 miles away in Delaware, the boys play in the fall and the girls play in the spring. I know it's off-topic, just wondering...
Iowa plays both in the spring. Girls start a couple of weeks behind the boys and go into June after school finishes. At an officials meeting, I heard that spring is the most common season, with winter common in the south and about equal to fall.
In NC, or atleast in my county, guys are playing now, girls start in Feb. I think.
Northern VA public schools play soccer in the spring, but the private schools play in the fall. DC schools play in the fall. so do Maryland public schools. all very confusing. and to make things even more complicated, club soccer goes year-round for all age groups.
Re: Re: i can top it all!
You got that right. If you're in Vienna next Spring I'd reccoment coming to when Chantilly takes it to Oakton if we play them there.