How many of todays players will make it into the list All-time Hall of Fame?

Dark Savante · May 10, 2003

I think there's quite a few who will be still be revered in 50 years time.

The likes of Zidane, Desailly, Davids, R Carlos, Cafu,Maldini and Ronaldo will nestle in or around the top 10 -30 list others should make it into the top 50.

Who do you think has the potential to make the hall of fame BEFORE hanging up his boots?

At the rate Rauls going he will get there too.

Thoughts?

mackem_ftm · May 10, 2003

Wayne Rooney has the potential, definitely. I won't say too much now though because we've only seen one season's worth of what he can do. Other than that, Zidane definitely, and Maldini. Ronaldo has shown patchy form of late and obviously missed an awfully long time with his injury, but I'd have him in there anyway just for some of the things he has done at the highest level.

lanman · May 10, 2003

Zidane, Maldini and Ronaldo definately.
Raul and Van Nistelrooy if they continue at their current game.
Ronaldinho has all the time to add himself to any list, as does Rooney.

comme · May 10, 2003

Giggs, Keane, Ronaldo, Raul, Zidane, Rivaldo, Maldini, Carlos, Cafu, Schmeichal (still current until 5 tomorrow), Desailly. Possibly some others, but its difficult to know about Rooney etc whether he will live up to the hype, personally I think he will.

Green Tabasco · May 10, 2003

RVN, Raul, Ronaldo, Zidane, Figo, Hierro, Batistuta, Vieri, Totti, Vieira, Maldini......and the man himself Roberto Baggio.

Dark Savante · May 10, 2003

^^ The hall of fame is an extremely elite list and as such i don't think people like Totti, Hierro and Figo will get in. To be there you've got to be simply majestic in your position on the field...i think Figo's a good player by todays standards but if you put him up against legends all of a sudden he's not so spectacular.

Vieri is up there with Riva and Rossi for Italy imo

and Batigol and R Baggio are already there so they're kinda exempt.

I really hope RVN continues how he's started and gets himself the kind of merit people reserve for Van Basten.

Bergkamp is another player i think is gonna go straight in scoring many spectacular goals on massive stages.

comme · May 10, 2003

Let me just check, we're not talking about the official FIFA hall of fame are we, as that only has about 10 members.

Bauser · May 10, 2003

Originally posted by Dark Savante
The likes of Zidane, Desailly, Davids, R Carlos, Cafu,Maldini and Ronaldo will nestle in or around the top 10 -30 list others should make it into the top 50.

The hall of fame is an extremely elite list and as such i don't think people like Totti, Hierro and Figo will get in. To be there you've got to be simply majestic in your position on the field...i think Figo's a good player by todays standards but if you put him up against legends all of a sudden he's not so spectacular.
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Davids better than Figo? Pitbull or not, Edgar Davids would be nowhere near a Hall of Fame place on my list. There are many Dutch players more deserving.

Gilstar10 · May 10, 2003

Where is that hall of Fame ubicated??
I have never heard about it

lanman · May 10, 2003

Originally posted by Dark Savante
^^ The hall of fame is an extremely elite list and as such i don't think people like Totti, Hierro and Figo will get in. To be there you've got to be simply majestic in your position on the field...i think Figo's a good player by todays standards but if you put him up against legends all of a sudden he's not so spectacular.

Vieri is up there with Riva and Rossi for Italy imo

and Batigol and R Baggio are already there so they're kinda exempt.

I really hope RVN continues how he's started and gets himself the kind of merit people reserve for Van Basten.

Bergkamp is another player i think is gonna go straight in scoring many spectacular goals on massive stages.
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I couldn't agree more with your first statement - greatness is thrust upon far too many players these days, and only the very best should be mentioned here, Cafu, Roberto Carlos, Figo, Totti and the like are simply not in the same league as Zidane and Maldini.

Vieri would probably rank alongside Rossi, but he has to do something special (such as win the title for a small team, or carry a team to the Champions League semis) to rank alongside Riva.

Batistuta and Bergkamp would just miss in my book, but Baggio would have an outside chance.

condor11 · May 10, 2003

maldini
thuram
zidane
ronaldo
rivaldo
romario
baggio
figo
raul
bergkamp
batistuta
schmeichael
chilavert

Excape Goat · May 11, 2003

Roberto Carlos is not the first wingback in the history of the game, but he did change the way the position is played. That would be enough for place in the Hall of flame for him.

Raul will break so many scoring records in the La Liga. He will be honored someway.

Ronaldo, Zidane and Maldini will make it..... no decision needed!!!!

Figo: I do not think he will make the top 10. He is probably as important as Zidane, Raul, Roberto Carlos and Ronaldo for Real madrid. Historians are strange. They needed something to write about and to remember with. Zidane won the WC and the European Cup. Roberto Carlos changed the way the game was played. Ronaldo came back from serious injury and won the WC. Raul broke records. Figo is remembered for what.... winning the CL with Zidane, Roberto Carlos..... in 10 to 15 years, the fans who had memories of Figo will forget about him. Many more will have never seen him.

Beckham.... the true fans will forever say he was overrated.

comme · May 11, 2003

Am I the only member of the Ryan Giggs fan club? I'm the only person to mention him in this debate so far. The man has been amazing for over a decade, and has been held back by representing such a small nation as Wales. Hopefully euro 2004 will change this.

Dark Savante · May 11, 2003

Originally posted by Excape Goat

Figo: I do not think he will make the top 10. He is probably as important as Zidane, Raul, Roberto Carlos and Ronaldo for Real madrid. Historians are strange. They needed something to write about and to remember with. Zidane won the WC and the European Cup. Roberto Carlos changed the way the game was played. Ronaldo came back from serious injury and won the WC. Raul broke records. Figo is remembered for what.... winning the CL with Zidane, Roberto Carlos..... in 10 to 15 years, the fans who had memories of Figo will forget about him. Many more will have never seen him.

Beckham.... the true fans will forever say he was overrated.
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100% agreed with Figo. I don't think Beckham will be rembered by anyone past our generaion unless he does something spectacular between now and the end of his career.

Dark Savante · May 11, 2003

Originally posted by comme
Am I the only member of the Ryan Giggs fan club? I'm the only person to mention him in this debate so far. The man has been amazing for over a decade, and has been held back by representing such a small nation as Wales. Hopefully euro 2004 will change this.
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Giggs is a strange one. he's not a hall of famer in the classic sense of the word despite all the things he's done there still is something missing..he's very similar to George Best in that he may never play for his country in a major tourney but unlike Giggs, Best did something truly memorable in a Euro Cup final which went a great way to cementing his reputation.

It really is a shame that when giggs was at his peak Wales were not in Euro 2000 i think he really would have shone then..i really hope that if wales do qualify for '04 that Giggs can still do himself justice.

As it stands right now Giggs will be a EPL and Man U legend but 'not much else' which is pretty tragic

comme · May 11, 2003

I would put Batistuta ahead of Vieri without a doubt on career so far. I would also have Giggs and Keane in, for being huge parts of probably the most dominant English team in domestic competitions in history. Giggs has got 8 titles so far, there are surely more to come and possibly more European glory. Lets not forget that united are the most consistent team in the history of the CL and possibly of Europe period. Giggs has been an inspiration over these years and time will show just how great he has been.

tpmazembe · May 11, 2003

Let's not cheapen the hall of fame (like the Baseball hall has become). Many great players will be remembered, like Giggs and Chilavert, but hall of fame should be reserved for monsters of the game.

Tickets already punched:

Baggio
Romario
Maldini

Need confirmation:

Zidane
Ronaldo

Will probably get a seat continuing at this pace:

Raul
R. Carlos (Excape Goat has it...will become a reference point for the position)

On the bubble:

Desailly (should make it for all the titles, consitency and important role played, but never marketed)
Rivaldo (never marketed, on his day devastating match winner and high on the "awe" factor; may not have won enough for club)

Berkamp, Totti and the like are great in their generation, but haven't put their stamp on the game in my mind (Totti still has time). Goal scorers such as Vieiri and Bati are efficient, but never seemed to make the difference in the end.

Mentioning Rooney is a stretch of strecthes. Many a person's list after WC'98 would have had Owen. Michael is still very young, so I'd place my bets on him before placing it in on Wayne.

Impossible to project all the young cats, but I REALLY like Aimar and Ronaldinho.

comme · May 11, 2003

To give us some sort of idea of how good the players have to be would anyone care to create the current hall of fame? Not including any contemporary players. Because the idea that only a handfull of current players are fit to be all time greats seems ridiculous, are we talking best 50 or a more elite grouping?

Green Tabasco · May 11, 2003

Originally posted by tpmazembe
Let's not cheapen the hall of fame (like the Baseball hall has become). Many great players will be remembered, like Giggs and Chilavert, but hall of fame should be reserved for monsters of the game.

Tickets already punched:

Baggio
Romario
Maldini

Need confirmation:

Zidane
Ronaldo

Will probably get a seat continuing at this pace:

Raul
R. Carlos (Excape Goat has it...will become a reference point for the position)

On the bubble:

Desailly (should make it for all the titles, consitency and important role played, but never marketed)
Rivaldo (never marketed, on his day devastating match winner and high on the "awe" factor; may not have won enough for club)

Berkamp, Totti and the like are great in their generation, but haven't put their stamp on the game in my mind (Totti still has time). Goal scorers such as Vieiri and Bati are efficient, but never seemed to make the difference in the end.

Mentioning Rooney is a stretch of strecthes. Many a person's list after WC'98 would have had Owen. Michael is still very young, so I'd place my bets on him before placing it in on Wayne.

Impossible to project all the young cats, but I REALLY like Aimar and Ronaldinho.
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Thats a really good point. I think it deserves another thread. I'll call it: The Young Guns: Are they destined for greatness.

lanman · May 11, 2003

OK comme, you asked for it.

I've come up with a list of 60 players (not bad for 150 years of football), and the list is not up for argument - I may have missed players out, and you may think others more deserving, but this is only as a guidleine to what my existing Hall of Fame would look like.

In alphabetical order:

Jose Altefani
Gordon Banks
Franz Beckenbauer
George Best
Franz "Bimbo" Binder
Danny Blanchflower
Steve Bloomer
Jozsef Bozsik
Paul Breitner
John Charles
Bobby Charlton
Johan Cruyff
Kenny Dalglish
Dixie Dean
Alfredo Di Stefano
Didi
Eusebio
Giacento Facchetti
Tom Finney
Garrincha
Francisco Gento
Jimmy Greaves
Ruud Gullit
Nandor Hidgekuti
Robert Jonquet
Mario Kempes
Sandor Kocsis
Raymond Kopa
Ladislao Kubala
Sepp Maier
Diego Maradona
Lothar Matthaus
Stanley Matthews
Giuseppe Meazza
Bobby Moore
Gerd Muller
Johan Neeskens
Gunter Netzer
Gunnar Nordahl
Daniel Passarella
Pele
Michel Platini
Ferenc Puskas
Gigi Riva
Gianni Rivera
Karl-Heinz Rummenigge
Jose Santamaria
Nilton Santos
Gyorgy Sarosi
Juan Schiaffino
Omar Sivori
Socrates
Luis Suarez
Marco Van Basten
Fritz Walter
Vivian Woodward
Billy Wright
Lev Yashin
Ricardo Zamora
Zico

Others could be added on a basis of significance to the game rather than ability terms (Alf Common, John Bosman etc)

comme · May 11, 2003

A very good list of which I would agree with the vast majority of the people on it. Really its only when you know, in what context you are selecting people that you can put decide who merits their place.
Seeing the sort of numbers that we are talking about I would stick with the majority of my nominations, I would say we are talking about around ten players when we consider the timespan covered. People are including the likes of Baggio, Maldini and Schmeichal as contemporary (I realise that is because they are still playing) yet they are all equally players of the early 90s. The players in this list almost all cover a timespan of 10-15 years and so there is room for quite a few players.

tpmazembe · May 11, 2003

Yes Ianman a good list, but you can't have "not up for argument" clauses in these discussions.

Socrates does not deserve to be there above people like Leonidas Da Silva, or even his contemporary Falcao.

What about Luis Suarez, Domingo da Guia, Josef Masopust, Ernst Ocwirk, any of La Maquina'a forwards?

But I do agree on your ratio - around 60 players for 15 decades, or roughly 4 per decade (acknowledging the fact that your list has few pre-30s). A hall of fame should have such standards.

Therefore, as excited as we get about our contemporaries, no more than one handful should get in. Every generation produces "world class" players - they get recognized by their club halls and their nations' halls - but international All-Time Great selections should be a definitive cut above. Under that light do Giggs, Bati et al fit the bill?

comme · May 11, 2003

If I was making the list I would simply discount those Pre WW2 and keep the list to about 50. So about 10 ish per decade.
I think what he meant by "not up for arguement" was that it was just a suggestion, and people shouldn't go, so and so is better than someone else.
If we're talking about the best 10 from the 90s and early 00s then i think Giggs does stand up to that test.

tpmazembe · May 11, 2003

Originally posted by comme
If I was making the list I would simply discount those Pre WW2 and keep the list to about 50. So about 10 ish per decade.
I think what he meant by "not up for arguement" was that it was just a suggestion, and people shouldn't go, so and so is better than someone else.
If we're talking about the best 10 from the 90s and early 00s then i think Giggs does stand up to that test.
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Comme, I'll buy your arguement.

Even then, does Giggs make it out of his own team? Over Cantona?

Your original post on this thread had 3 Man U players, was that part of, or before, your 10 per decade idea?

Green Tabasco · May 11, 2003

10 per decade sounds good. How about an all decade team.

50's all decade team
60's all decade team
70's all decade team
80's all decade team
90's all decade team