House of Cards

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by steve-o, Feb 17, 2009.

  1. steve-o

    steve-o New Member

    Nov 14, 2007
    Anyone had a chance to watch this? Conservative or liberal, I think most would agree it's a crock of shit what happened.
     
  2. puttputtfc

    puttputtfc Member+

    Sep 7, 1999
    ??????????????????
     
  3. steve-o

    steve-o New Member

    Nov 14, 2007
    On CNBC, follows the housing bubble from 2001 to present.
     
  4. VFish

    VFish Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Atlanta
  5. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I watched the Frontline piece tonight.

    Here's where I was screaming BULLSHIT at the TV. A schmuck like me knew in summer 2007 that there was going to be a severe correction in the housing market. What I did NOT know about was the series of highly leveraged bets that had been made on mortgage securities. If I had known about that, I would have known the whole system was in dire straits.

    Yet all the supergeniuses had no idea. I didn't get that.
     
  6. Mountainia

    Mountainia Member

    Jun 19, 2002
    Section 207, Row 7
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I hear you.

    I know the other guy's job always seems easier than your own, but I've always believed in the 3 X salary rule-of-thumb when buying a house, and by that measure, by 2007 I could not even afford my own house. That I bought 18 years before.

    I saw 3 BR single family homes outside the beltway going for 550+K, I saw townhouses in Charlestown, WV going for 450K. New, huge single family homes near Leesburg going for 700+K. I was thinking, who's making all this money?

    Now I know. Why the folks in the mortgage business didn't see it, I don't know.
     
  7. steve-o

    steve-o New Member

    Nov 14, 2007
    They knew, they just didn't care.

    In the House of Cards piece they interview some of the lenders and bankers; the players knew they were making a quick buck, and I'm sure that some were getting their palms greased to help the boom along.
     
  8. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    Which is the kind of crap that makes Marx almost look plausible sometimes...

    Like the proverbial last two capitalists arguing over who gets the profit on the sale of the rope...
     
  9. DoyleG

    DoyleG Member+

    CanPL
    Canada
    Jan 11, 2002
    YEG-->YYJ-->YWG-->YYB
    Club:
    FC Edmonton
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    It makes me more pissed that my cable company took CNBC off of regular cable.
     
  10. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This reads like Ginsburg's "Howl."
     
  11. Dr Jay

    Dr Jay BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 7, 1999
    Newton, MA USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Absolutely.

    Just like the middle-men in the Maddoff scheme. They knew there was no way what Maddoff was doing was legal, but they were making their 1 % on the invested money, their clients were happy, and if it all fell apart they could go all Hogan's Heroes - "I know nothing...nothing"
     
  12. bojendyk

    bojendyk New Member

    Jan 4, 2002
    South Loop, Chicago
    House of Cards came up in my macro class last night. Sadly, I missed both it and the the Frontline special.

    For what it's worth, one of the students in my class works with CDOs, and she claims that the market is now irrational in exactly the opposite direction as it was in 2006 and 2007. She noted that some of them are trading at 5 cents on the dollar and that something like 95% of the mortgages covered in such CDOs would have to default for the investor to lose money when the CDO is selling at that kind of discount.

    If they're really trading at such low levels, then I think she's right.
     
  13. MattR

    MattR Member+

    Jun 14, 2003
    Reston
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    95%? Totally plausible.
     
  14. steve-o

    steve-o New Member

    Nov 14, 2007
    So, do you bet on the strength of the American economy, or do you bet on that this recession will drag out for another year or so?
     
  15. VFish

    VFish Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Atlanta
  16. Minnman

    Minnman Member+

    Feb 11, 2000
    Columbus, OH, USA
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  17. bojendyk

    bojendyk New Member

    Jan 4, 2002
    South Loop, Chicago
  18. bojendyk

    bojendyk New Member

    Jan 4, 2002
    South Loop, Chicago
    During the Great Depression, the default rate was, I believe, somewhere in the neighborhood of 48%.
     
  19. KevTheGooner

    KevTheGooner Help that poor man!

    Dec 10, 1999
    THOF
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Andorra
    I DVR'd the Frontline special...I'm reluctant to watch it because almost every Frontline I watch nearly gives me a concussion from repeated:
    [​IMG]
     
  20. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    From today's WaPo Chat with the producer of the Frontline piece

    I guess what he's saying is that the supergeniuses thought that only firms who had bet heavily on these exotic investments would fail, that nobody understood how AIG and the other big financial firms would suffer.
     
  21. MattR

    MattR Member+

    Jun 14, 2003
    Reston
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I know, I was just kidding :)

    The problem is that there has been so much speculation and hiding of the true value of assets is that there just aren't any buyers. If Joe Izuzu said to just trust the value, but we can't even tell you if we still own these mortgages or houses, making the sale is going to be difficult.
     
  22. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's an article on the front page of my paper today about people being foreclosed on asking the bank to "produce the note" and stopping the foreclosure cold. See, the whole industry is so ********ing complicated it takes a company months to prove they hold the mortgage.
     
  23. bojendyk

    bojendyk New Member

    Jan 4, 2002
    South Loop, Chicago
  24. VFish

    VFish Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Yeah, the debate and later second guessing over the decision to let Lehman go under is especially fascinating.
     
  25. bojendyk

    bojendyk New Member

    Jan 4, 2002
    South Loop, Chicago
    I thought so, too, as was the segment about Paulson's hardball plan to avoid moral hazard with Bear Stearns.
     

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