Post-match: Honduras vs. USA

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by ussoccer97531, Sep 5, 2017.

  1. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    LA Galaxy
    United States
    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    You rang?

    Actually, not a "fan" per se because I think Bradley has limited usefulness which is not the same as saying he's bad but it doesn't mean he's good either, in the broadest sense of the word.

    Let's just confine ourselves to the situation we are in - less than a year til WC finals and only two games left in the hex before meaningless friendlies with Nagbe highlights from the marketing suits dominate the cycle to let everybody off the hook. I do not look forward to those optimistic American proclamations of "How the US wins the World Cup in 2026".

    Fundamentally, playing the 6 in front of 2 cb's is hard when the fb's are pushed forward. On paper, it looks vacuous, defensively.. I'm no tactical sage but look at CR's goals against us. Put a 3rd cb in the line and let the 6 push forward a bit more. Plus, think of the trigonometry of passing out of a central, recessed position on the pitch. when possession turns over. There's a reason Bradley always looks like a rhinoceros passing out of the back. At Toronto he dumps it to Delgado or Vazquez.who have a better view of things. One of those two is US eligible.

    Exactly what Bradley's job description would be in that 3cb formation depends on the players around him and his personal strengths. BS posters say we should just play our best players. They look at the latest marketing push from MLS and go with it. Presto, you have Acosta and Nagbe. There appears to be no thought process at all other than Nagbe is supposed to be entertaining - "those runs", "that turn". I wont post an extensive tear down of Acosta's game for fear it would be my last on BS. Neither one makes up for Bradley's deficiencies. I'd say they both reinforce his faults.

    Defensively, I like Justen Glad and EPB. Glad is pretty good as a sweeper type - look at his clearances. EPB is a hybrid dmid/cb. I wouldn't tear my hair out about which position he suits best. . He could move between backline and dmid in a protean tactic.

    So why keep Bradley at all? We don't have anybody with his extensive experience. He's good at some things. He sticks like glue over long spaces to international forwards and wont get red cards or pens when he gets dragged into the box. His aerial pass is still decent. He can defend space in the fullback areas ( a lot of mids get confused there).

    The problem with training up somebody for Bradley's position now is that it's too late. It makes more sense to put the right players around him and modernize our tactical set up.
     
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  2. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Give it a few years, we can have a EPB-McKennie CM partnership. :)

    For now, I think the best solution is Cameron-Bradley. The sooner we get Bradley out of there, the better, but right now there's not a ton of difference between him and other players, he's also the captain, so you don't want to rock the boat by dropping the captain.
     
  3. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    #678 ussoccer97531, Sep 9, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2017
    This has been my recent thinking as well.

    I think EPB is a better CB, but an EPB-McKennie CM combo is so enticing for the NT. That duo will probably eventually be able to boss whoever they come up against, so I think if need be, we can get by with some rotation of Brooks, Glad, CCV, Miazga at CB for next cycle, and if for some reason Besler and Cameron keep up their form at an older age, they can help, as well. Thats not even to mention options like Zimmerman, Hedges, Parker, Hagglund, Redding, Opara, Trusty, Robinson's who could also be options next cycle. If we have more of a weakness at CB than CM though, he can move back to CB, and we can bring someone like Adams, Durkin, Gonzalez, Acosta, Booth, etc into the lineup to play next to McKennie.

    But thats next cycle, right now, Cameron and Bradley is the best pairing in CM, Besler and Brooks (with Miazga as the top alternative to an injured Brooks, and maybe EPB by June) as the top CB pairing.
     
  4. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think everyone is hoping Cameron is that guy right now but center mids usually age out around 32-34. He just came out of his game with a possible hamstring pull or tweak. I think midfield in a tournament is a lot to ask of him.
     
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  5. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It wasn't too much for Jones and Beckerman, who had significantly more mileage than Cameron will have had thanks to Geoff going to college.
     
  6. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    Just saw the highlights by US soccer so they tried to be kind but in a 5 minute vid I saw Zusi beat 5 times and Gonzalez's mistake that led to the goal. If Bruce throws Zusi out there again, we deserve to not qualify. I know Ream was bad on Friday but he has had great games can the same be said for Gonzalez?
     
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  7. smokarz

    smokarz Member+

    Aug 9, 2006
    Hartford, CT




    They both suck
     
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  8. manq360

    manq360 Member+

    Jun 17, 2009
    Portland, OR
    Club:
    Portland Timbers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You make a very good case, especially regarding the last two qualifiers of this round. However, I believe he was once very good at all you give him credit for, but not so much any more. Over the last several years, he has slowed down somewhat, which is natural, but all of the blame for poor play usually gets attached to the players around him. I think BA, or whoever takes us to 2018 WC, should plan on phasing him out immediately following qualifiers. This could be done heavily during winter camp, but it needs to be done before WC. I just do not see us having much of a chance against better teams with MB captaining and running the team. Let someone else shine for a change. He has had a good run.

    I fear that if BA continues as coach to the WC, he will not make the necessary adjustments, even, perhaps regarding Zusi. Hopefully, he cannot be that set in his ways. I would say that we should wait and see, but that is really going to hurt me, and US soccer.
     
  9. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    It sounds as if most are in agreement with this general idea. But do you really think that's going to happen? MB is basically untouchable until after the WC with a new coach. Bruce will play him in the center, he'll be the captain, and it makes zero sense. I respect MB, he always seems like a pretty good guy and a hard worker, but he's killed us the last few years. McKennie just got a few more minutes in Germany. Bring him into the squad ASAP. Bradley is just this virus that we cannot get rid of. Because he is the captain, he can't be dropped? Is he captain for life? Since when did being a NT captain have so much importance? If MB wasn't guaranteed to be captain, I'd argue it'd be easier to move on from him. Rotate the captaincy, use Cameron, MB, Demps, Guzan, even throw Pulisic in. But that's a big part of the problem, imo.
     
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  10. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    You don't want Zusi against fast teams. He was an ok choice versus Costa Rica, but a bad one versus Honduras. And he as RB against Panama could spell disaster.
     
  11. SamsArmySam

    SamsArmySam Member+

    Apr 13, 2001
    Minneapolis, MN
    I don't get where this is coming from. Seems like the simplest read of the situation is that Bradley is in the starting XI because Bruce thinks he's the best option we have right now for the starting XI. He's captain because Bruce thinks he's the best option we've got for captain. If either of those change (meaning Bruce's assessment of him), he won't be either. In no way is he untouchable.

    And fortunately, I think we have someone in MB with the character, self awareness, and love of the shirt that when that time comes, MB himself will make sure the transition is a smooth one.

    Last point... I suspect we are going to miss some of the quality subtleties of Bradley's game when he is gone. Full field grasp of our tactical setup, understanding of tempo, attacking zone vision, taking up the right defensive positions, defending 1v1 when isolated in space, I'm sure there are more... Absolutely he is not a perfect CM. But he may very well still be our best option.
     
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  12. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    Yes, that is definitely the "simplest" read, but we're not looking for the that. Obviously Bruce is going with him because he thinks he's the best option. The point is, that many are starting to realize, is that he's not. Same thing with being captain. Bruce isn't going to drop him (not that I really blame him, specifically at this point), but if we qualify, I hope he start seeing some new options, and QUICK. WC18, assuming we qualify, is going to be nasty if/when we trot out these old guys who are well past their prime.

    And yes, we'll at least miss the backwards passing, dropping directly next to the CBs, zero blame/responsibility, lack of any forward runs or probing passes, or the constant search for any MFer/group of MFers that allows him to play his best (still searching, 10 years later).

    What I'm trying to bring here is discussion of what we should be doing to move this team forward and improve the performances. This website wouldn't exist (or at the least, would be very boring) if it was just for guessing what Bruce will do. "Zusi as RB, Gonzo in the middle, DMB's experience at RB, MB90 is our CM and captain". Yes, we know this stuff, we know what Bruce will do, and we know it's not working. Let's try to go a bit more in depth here...
     

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