Discussion in 'New York Red Bulls' started by Simon Birch, Nov 10, 2004.
New Jersey has wildlife?
I asked about that when I called this AM, but got no response -- he couldn't say anything about the matter; he just knew MFO was working with the City of Harrison on the stadium.
I have to wonder about the definition of 'work' in this case.
Kinda like depending on what "is" means - as in when was that "is" you talkin' about?
Here's what I gather: Codey has inside info and is just passing it along. Harrison does appear to be dead, but a sweeter deal is on the table.
Besides, now being November 2004, I find it hard to believe any stadium of this size can be ready for April 2006.
Is the "sweeter" deal in Harrison, East Rutherford or some other location?
A stadium of this size can def. be ready. Kairaskaki Stadium for Olympiakos of Greece is 30k+ and was ready in 12 months. Plus it is much more hi-tech than anything we are going to build, so I assume it can be done.
I miss my dead gay governor.
I can't believe that some people would even remotely consider staying at the Swamp.
-- AEG wouldn't own it, the NJSEA would.
-- Even if it was "our" mini-stadium next to the NFL monstrosity, we likely still wouldn't have control over booking.
-- AEG would make almost nothing from parking / concessions.
-- The NJSEA would control security.
-- No public transportation from the city.
The idea is not just to get out of GS, it's to get the league some ancillary revenue streams to help make it viable long-term, AND to get our necks out from under the NJSEA jackboot. We shouldn't stay where we are.
is getting to harrison from long island any more or less difficult than getting to giants stadium? will there by public transportation there? giants stadium is effing terrible.
one solution: assasination.
another: call charles kushner and ask him to set codey up on a date.
Yes. PATH is a rail transit system that serves Harrison. It connects NY Penn Station and Ground Zero with the Hoboken and Newark rail stations on the Jersey side of the Hudson. FWIW PATH has already made some upgrades to the station at Harrison in anticipation of the new traffic.
The Meadowlands complex blows.
Harrison is accessible via the PATH Train from NYC.
I think one of two things is behind the governors comments.
1. He has inside info that the votes aren't there and won't be there
2. He made a subjective read on the situation. Harrison and AEG finalize a deal yet HCIA waits and waits. Why are the waiting, likely cause the votes aren't there YET.
Hopefully we'll figure out which of the two is true. Hopefully this will at least spur movement one way or the other instead of a holding pattern. Go look at the construction pictures for Frisco and you'll see how quick these SSS can be built. We just don't have all the details and it's annoying a lot of us. I'm starting to wish there was competition like with Chicago and their 5 candidate suburbs and now with SLC and Murray. I still hopeful for Harrison but if the bonds aren't passed by the new year I don't think 2006 will be much of possibility anymore.
Gay or straight. It doesn't matter. NJ Politicians are all a bunch of F***en jerks.
Here's today's take from the Jersey Journal:
On the up side, it seems that DeGuise (Hudson County Executive) and Harrison are still fighting for the project, on the down side, the HCIA bond deal "as it stands now" IS dead, and the Metros seem to be sucking up to Codey and his swamp plan faster than a hoover vacuum cleaner.
"Like everyone else it took us by surprise," said Lauro, speaking for Harrison Mayor Raymond McDonough, who added that McDonough had arranged a meeting with Codey to discuss new financing two weeks from now. "Obviously, he has a different approach."
Lauro said MetroStars president and GM Nick Sakiewicz reiterated yesterday that Harrison "is his first choice because Harrison is the epicenter of their fan base in New Jersey" and because of its accessible public transportation.
Good work by the Journal on this. This article gives the best synopsis to date: The HCIA is not going to approve the plan, but they've given the town and AEG a chance to bring in new numbers to prove its feasibility or to ask for less money. The deal still hinges on how much in parking revenues the plan can bring in from commuters.
The one positive thing from that article is that DiGise is still listening. But clearly, AEG and the HCIA are a lot further apart on dollar amounts than Nick has been telling us. And for MFO / Chmura to use the term "delighted" to describe Codey's Meadowlands plan is really, really disheartening.
Forget '06, kids, there's no way it's going to happen if the two sides are still this far apart. As for forgetting '07 and beyond, well.... AEG could solve the problem tomorrow by kicking in, say, another $20-30 million. But they've dug their heels in so far on this that it doesn't seem possible for them to budge now.
Don't get too disheartened. I think they're just being politically correct, trying to keep their options open. They also repeatedly stated that Harrison remains their preference.
New Ledger article.
Uh oh. Much more negative than the Journal or Daily News. Sires is against the project, we're already talking to the NJSEA, and Harrison is scrambling for its own sake. If you take these comments as truth, Harrison really is most likely dead.
I love that the state's paper of record misspelled Nick's name, btw.
The bottom line is, at this point there is nothing to make me believe there is going to be a stadium built. Furthermore, I just don't think we go an honest forthcoming assessment from METRO. I suspect they will string hope along, atleast till its time for people to buy their season tickets. It is a pretty dark time for this organization.
NY Times -- barely mentions Metro. "The MetroStars have been negotiating a move to a proposed stadium of their own in Harrison, N.J., but financing for such a project has not been assured."
NorthJersey.com has an article (can't tell if it's from the Record or the Herald News) that says the Giants are deciding on where in the Meadowlands to build -- west of the current stadium, or south. No Metro mention and nothing from Ives.
By being sports friendly (we hope), the new Gov may be trying to create a macho non-gay image. If that is the case, maybe it will help Metros in the event that Harrison fails. But Harrison is the first choice.
When the study is completed, there will be a vote. Until then, quit saying that the deal is dead.
If I am Harrison and the study suggests that there is NOT enough revenue to cover to bond debt, I would talk with AEG and ask them for a 'guarentee payment' to cover the debt.
For example, Harrison puts up 90 mil, the revenue stream covers 85 mil. With the guarentee payment contract, AEG will pay an additional 5 mil at year whatever. Harrison breaks even but it benefits through development and real estate tax/increase in value.
Or AEG could increase its contribution from $30 mil to $40 mil. With Chivas money, expansion fee, Adidas money, I think AEG could spare an additional $10 mil to get this deal done.
Thinking about it AEG is kicking in about 25% of their own money, compared to other projects, is that a high or low #?
Thank you for educating us on politics of New Jersey and on the Harrison project.
Sincerely, Mr Metro.
Depends on the comparison. In LA it was mostly 100% IIRC, though US Soccer and Home Depot contributed. In Chicago it was to be about 1/3, but recently Bridgeview decided 0% (no AEG contribution). In SJ, AEG proposed 1/4-1/3 but that was a nonstarter with San Jose. In DC it's rumored to be 100% AEG for the stadium but DC is hoped to chip in for infrastructure. In Colorado, the stadium is to be 100% MLS, infrastructure to be publicly financed. Comes about 1/2 - 1/2 IIRC. Crew Stadium was 100% MLS. Dallas is about 1/3 MLS though I'm probably a little off.
If AEG believes the public bonds are feasable, they should consider some sort of "private guarantee". They can afford it and it'll be worth it to speed this up and get out of Giants Stadium. I actually like the idea of competition for the Metrostars but am skeptical this is actually the case. I was hoping the state and NJSEA would forget about the Metrostars long enough for Harrison to be finalized.
Awaiting comments by Nick S and Ives. If Nick doesn't comment, I'll sign your petition if you want non-Metrostars support.