Hamas Attacks, Israel Responds

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by Cascarino's Pizzeria, Oct 7, 2023.

Tags:
  1. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    That's what the dude said in the article that's not my view. This is why people should read the article and not be so afraid to leave their definition of how the world works that any new information that challenges that is rejected.
     
    tomásbernal repped this.
  2. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    You should have overpowered Hamas or not voted for them in 07. Somehow it is your fault and doesn't equate to a music festival slaughter.

    Haven't you figured it out yet.
     
  3. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    So what is? It's not like the political route has not been attempted and the two key landmark issues that they wish to have continually get rejected and are told are non-starters. People keep acting like all of this just happened this year and does not been to build up of decades on decades. The demands of right to return and a return to 1967 borders have been constant but everybody's like well that's a non-starter for Israel so then how can you claim you want peace. To me, Israel wants subjugation and unlike Western Europe where they were occupying Powers get far from home Israel is right there so they can occupy these territories and these lands and have no problem constantly having to kill Palestinians every generation for their peace.
     
  4. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Do you or do you not agree with the article. Thats all that really matters. My position in this matter has been consistent.

    It’s very easy for people detached from the conflict to hold opinions but unless you are directly affected by it you’ll never quite get it. There is a lot about how this war has been fought, both ways but I do support Israel’s right to destroy Hamas. It sucks that innocents are affected and it is sad but how do you fight this war? The rules that govern war didn’t take into account that warfare will and has changed. It’s not an excuse, it’s reality.
     
    yasik19 and luftmensch repped this.
  5. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Absolutely nobody in this thread thinks this conflict just started out of nowhere. Maybe finding a compromise and peace would have been closer to happening had Hamas not opted to slaughter the amount of people they did in the fashion they did. Just a thought.
     
    yasik19 repped this.
  6. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    So why didn't we have peace in 2006 before Hamas took control of Gaza?
     
  7. luftmensch

    luftmensch Member+

    .
    United States
    May 4, 2006
    Petaluma
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You’re assuming Hamas wants a political solution beyond “no more Israel.” I was referring specifically to their tactics and not Palestine’s.
     
  8. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    Agreed, I guess the question I would ask is this: Does anyone here think Hamas helped the Palestinian cause by what they did Oct 7?

    Most likely what they have done is eliminate themselves. Hamas won't survive as an organization, which is a good thing. My hope is that others see this and choose peace. I truly hope that rational people can see that peace and opening up your society brings in good things.

    Look at the Middle East 20 years ago to now. F1 races, the World Cup, super star players, tourism, and various other global events. The choice seems clear, choose hardline Islam or choose to be a member of the Global community. I hope whoever fills the void in Gaza take the peaceful, rational route.
     
    superdave, yasik19, TyffaneeSue and 3 others repped this.
  9. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    https://www.972mag.com/mass-assassination-factory-israel-calculated-bombing-gaza/

    If you read the article these are actual Israelis or Israeli soldiers as he just says sources who are much closer to the action.

    To an extent I get your point because if the course of action is we're going to kill who we need to kill in order to get the bad guys that doesn't quite bother me. What bothers me is the constant whining and crying that all we're really the good guys and it's unfair to cast us in a bad light and all of this other stuff. Just admit that you're a monster and you don't care cuz what they did was beyond the pale and I'd be fine with it but just the constant pretzel logic to defend is what drives me crazy.

    If 5,000 people were killed but 2,000 were Hamas I might actually find that acceptable despite the loss of innocent life. But I think right now we're at 2000 out of 12000.
     
  10. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    So why do we not have peace before Hamas took over Gaza.
     
  11. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    The answer to that could fill volumes, and even then people would disagree.
     
    yasik19, luftmensch and Moishe repped this.
  12. It actually denounces the acts of hamas as terrorism, as the AI-generated targets are nothing less than what hamas has been doing with people inside Israel, calling everyone a target.
    I think the ones who created that AI algorythm and the ones who based their attacks on it's outcome should be put on trial for crimes against humanity.
     
    Mike03 and tomásbernal repped this.
  13. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    Thanks for giving up the game. Because obviously the stealing of lands and IDF escorts to killing people for their land and homes is Totally not part of the problem.
     
    majspike repped this.
  14. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    And yet people want to act like Hamas was the problem. And if not for Hamas etc. etc.
     
  15. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    You don’t know the history of the PLO and its factions?
     
    TyffaneeSue repped this.
  16. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    I do. I just can't stand how people act like Hamas is the problem when we had issues before them. There we concessions and opportunities for peace before we got here.
     
  17. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    Did you accidentally quote my post? This reply doesn't make sense to what I wrote.
     
  18. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    You said
    Completely ignoring hardline Judaism and Jewish extremist that murdered Rabin, elected Bibi to power this 3 time, are wiping their ass with the Israeli constitution, dismantling the Judiciary so Fascism can exist and stealing Palestinian land.

    Put a little effort into recognizing Israeli's role in the inability for there to be peace.
     
    majspike and ElNaranja repped this.
  19. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    Ah, gotcha, I repudiate all forms of extremism, but I was speaking about Gaza, which is Islamic.
     
  20. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Ah so Israel is the problem So I guess Zionism before that right? Of course the idea of Zionism goes back to Europe in the 1890’s. So what about prior to the immigration into the Ottoman Empire?

    What’s the common denominator? Ah yes, they are and were Jews. Jews are the problem, got it.


    “The first time someone shows you who they are, believe them.”
     
  21. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    No I just meant that the fact that there were opportunities before that were not ceased. Saying Hamas is the problem ignores everything before. There have been movements toward peace before one of the two sides does some that upsets the general populace of the other said kills the opportunity.

    The Knicks could use a guy with your reach.
     
  22. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    The Knicks couldn’t afford me. The closest both sides came to real start was with Clinton. Arafat shit all over that deal after the Israeli delegation pretty much said yes to everything.

    Hamas went on to seize power in Gaza by muscling the PLO offshoot Fatah. Remind me when Hamas didn’t thing other try to kill Jews? Let’s not pretend any longer that this isn’t about Jews. The animosity has always and walkways be there.
     
    TyffaneeSue and Ethos repped this.
  23. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    No lies detected.
     
  24. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    I don't get your last sentence. But yes my overall point is there were issues and attempts at peace that failed before. Arafat was reported as saying that his people would not accept the deal as there were some terms and conditions believe he could sell to the people. Much like how 1967 Borders and RoR, the Palestinian people also have their non-starters. I think when Hamas started they did a few things and rebuilt buildings to look like nice to muscle out Fatah, but we all know it was an act.

    We can talk about Rabin but Israel has had leaders like Sharon and Bibi (3x) so it's not like Israeli hardliners were in power or agitating the general public to make deals necessary. I stand by my point thought the majority of the responsibility for peace reata with Israel as they hold all the levers of power.
     
  25. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    The point of all war is political defeat of the enemy.

    I don't believe our countries should offer a blank cheque in how this is achieved. Especially wars go wrong, which is why cool heads should prevail. From those justifying this, I am still waiting to hear any explanation of what victory is going to look like.

    It's not for me or 'the left' to have to rationalise this. Israel clearly has to make the case.

    The fact that it is losing that debate is not somehow my fault.
     
    majspike, Mike03, RafaLarios and 5 others repped this.

Share This Page