Hamas Attacks, Israel Responds II

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by argentine soccer fan, Mar 5, 2024.

  1. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    It's a genocide, according to many scholars of genocide.

    But a comparison to the Nazi camps during the Holocaust is both inaccurate and counterproductive.
     
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  2. babaorum

    babaorum Member+

    Aug 20, 2005
    Marseille
    Nat'l Team:
    France
    Treblinka is not a concentration camp. Sobibor is not either.
     
  3. TyffaneeSue

    TyffaneeSue moderator
    Staff Member

    Earthquakes and Bay FC
    United States
    Nov 15, 2003
    Upstairs
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    The Nazis efficiently and ruthlessly rounded up millions of Jews and marched them, without any concern or remorse, into incineration ovens. That's what genocide is. Every war results in the unfortunate deaths of innocent people, and if I were in charge of it all, there would be no wars ever. But not every war is a genocide! Try not -- whether out of ignorance or Jew hatred -- to diminish the horrors of what happened to us.

    Again, it's unfortunate that so many of you have fallen for Qatar's well-crafted propaganda, including believing many death and damage "statistics" that have later been walked back with much less fanfare.
     
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  4. Val1

    Val1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Arsenal
    Mar 12, 2004
    MD's Eastern Shore
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I'll try not to. As a devout Christian, I celebrate the Seder every year.

    But Sue... this isn't war anymore. It's much worse.
     
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  5. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Good one. Hamas is willing to fight this war to the last Gazan. They’re basically going to ethnically cleanse their own people.
     
  6. He's hired by Quatar as a propaganda writer. You fools fall every time for these lies.

    Just acting as tiffany sue's ghost writer.
     
  7. Tiffany sue pledges jordan rivers full of crocodile tears for those 10 children.....but but ham....
     
  8. Sufjan Guzan

    Sufjan Guzan Member+

    Feb 13, 2016
    It wasn't spoken lightly. Deliberately starving a city of millions that is made up of a majority of children makes me sick in the same way that learning about the Holocaust made me sick as an adolescent. Have you considered how horrific death by starvation is? Malnutrition like what is being experienced in Gaza can cause permanent brain damage. Populations that endure famine have altered DNA that gets passed on for generations. The heart shrinks as the body feeds on the muscle for sustenance. Eventually organ damage sets in. The trauma that is being created will be experienced not only in this lifetime for any survivors, but will be passed on. The body and mind stores trauma. Children in Gaza are developing individuals. Their nervous systems are developing. Their bodies are supposed to be growing and changing. Deliberately starving such a population is to automatically deny them human rights. It's disgusting.

    Obviously the method of killing is different. No one is arguing that. But Gaza is death. Gaza is destruction. In my post I also referenced the genocide of the Native American people. I did not mean that Gaza is Treblinka is the sense that the methods are the same. Rather, the point was to equate what is happening to a Genocide to a poster who has this notion that it's just a war and that Hamas has some sort of agency to end the conflict. The point was to make it very clear that what is happening is the deliberate and planned extermination of a people in the same way those camps were used.
     
  9. Sufjan Guzan

    Sufjan Guzan Member+

    Feb 13, 2016
    Point noted in a literal sense. I can see now how if taken out of the context of what I was responding to my post would be considered inaccurate and counterproductive.

    My purpose was to affirm that this isn't a war, but rather a Genocide to a poster who does not share that view. And I stand by that. In the post I mention the genocide of the Native American people and pointed out some similarities to that conflict (the length being drawn out, the treaties signed and broken). So even in the context of my post, I made it clear that I was making a generalized comparison. Obviously someone can cherry pick what I said out of the context of the entire argument to try and banter back or to make me feel shame for saying what I said. But that doesn't address the entirety of that post or the logical structure that was being used.
     
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  10. Sufjan Guzan

    Sufjan Guzan Member+

    Feb 13, 2016
    https://apnews.com/article/israel-p...uman-shields-80f358dd2c87a1123f26ffada159701c

    From AP--> Israel systematically has been using Palestinians as human shields to clear out buildings and areas that may be rigged with explosives. Source is whistleblowers within the IDF, with the AP corroborating with Palestinians.

    The two Israeli soldiers who spoke to the AP — and a third who provided testimony to Breaking the Silence — said commanders were aware of the use of human shields and tolerated it, with some giving orders to do so. Some said it was referred to as the “mosquito protocol” and that Palestinians were also referred to as “wasps” and other dehumanizing terms.

    The soldiers — who said they’re no longer serving in Gaza — said the practice sped up operations, saved ammunition, and spared combat dogs from injury or death.
    The soldiers said they first became aware human shields were being used shortly after the war erupted on Oct. 7, 2023, when Hamas attacked Israel, and that it became widespread by the middle of 2024. Orders to “bring a mosquito” often came via radio, they said — shorthand everyone understood. Soldiers acted on commanding officers’ orders, according to the officer who spoke to the AP.

    He said that by the end of his nine months in Gaza, every infantry unit used a Palestinian to clear houses before entering.

    “Once this idea was initiated, it caught on like fire in a field,” the 26-year-old said. “People saw how effective and easy it was.”

    He described a 2024 planning meeting where a brigade commander presented to the division commander a slide reading “get a mosquito” and a suggestion they might “just catch one off the streets.”

    The officer wrote two incident reports to the brigade commander detailing the use of human shields, reports that would have been escalated to the division chief, he said. The military said it had no comment when asked whether it received them.

    One report documented the accidental killing of a Palestinian, he said — troops didn’t realize another unit was using him as a shield and shot him as he ran into a house. The officer recommended the Palestinians be dressed in army clothes to avoid misidentification.
     
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  11. charlie15

    charlie15 Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    Bethesda, Md
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What an absolute stupid comment! That sound like someone BIbi would say… ooops I am sure he said it himself. No one here, as far as I know is defending hamas, but trying to cover this genocidal war by never denouncing the aggressor here requires some serious gymnastic talents.
     
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  12. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The aggressor in this war is Hamas. And they’re solely responsible for the fate of their own people.
     
  13. charlie15

    charlie15 Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    Bethesda, Md
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You sound like Bibi's spokesperson. I am not surprised though, Whole Food Avenger/DeSantis supporter.
    Every reliable organization and institution are calling this at best ethnic cleansing or a genocide but you do you.
     
  14. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The big question is if the definition of antisemitic has changed and if that contributes to the increase.




    This dude thinks over reporting may be the issue.


     
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  15. charlie15

    charlie15 Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    Bethesda, Md
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Come on man....If you want to post some data, make sure the sources are at least reliable. That dude, Avi Bitterman, a openly MAGA by the way, is a complete lunatic. He publicly stated that he is to the right of Netanyahu and wants Israel to go even harder on Palestinians. His "data" is complete BS...
     
  16. For those with convenient amnesia, go back to my posts about the Dutch military attaché in Israel, iirc a few months after the 7th of 10th, whose leaked memo to the Dutch government explicitly announced what was going to happen, the deliberate destruction of Gaza as a goal and the Gazan people.
    It was a planned genocide, not a response to what occurred in the months after the 7th 0f 10th, like the resistance of hama.
    We were briefed about it and did nothing, just watched it unfold and making excuses like the "right of self defense", while everything pointed in the direction outlined in the Dutch memo, a scorched earth tactic.
    Now the press published the images of the starving children and babies, the anger among the population in Europe is rising, so the political assholes now do a little bit of lipservice to the pligh of the Gaza people.
     
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  17. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    It's worse than BS: it's an explicit attempt to redefine criticism of Israel as antisemitism. It's the same thing as C*n*ry Mission.
     
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  18. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Here is the source, and one thing you see, 75% are 'hate speech'

    So I am pretty sure that what they are considering hate speech has changed since the October attack.

    It looks like a case of people looking for racism and finding it.

    https://combatantisemitism.org/wp-c...y-of-Record-Breaking-Antisemitism-in-2024.pdf


    CNN has only a 5% increase.


    https://www.cnn.com/2025/04/22/us/antisemitic-cases-2024-campus-protests
     
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  19. Mmm, Israeli activists "Breaking the Silence" report on idf soldiers using Gaza people as human shields, with statements of idf soldiers with a conscience.
    "These are not isolated accounts: they point to a systematic failure and a horrific moral collapse," said Nadav Weiman, director of Breaking the Silence, a whistleblower group of former Israeli soldiers that has collected testimony about the practice from within the army.

    Hamas responsible for war crime acts by idf, like these?
    But obviously these are anti-semits, paid by Qatar. (Just putting up a tiffany sue act:cool:)
     
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  20. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Good back and forth on where the data is coming from between Avi and Richard.


     
  21. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    The pdf doesn’t explicitly lay out its criteria, but the way the piece is written strongly suggests it’s considering protests as well as using terms like Apartheid and Genocide expressions of anti-semitism. Absent clarification, hard to believe that report is remotely credible.
     
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  22. Germerica

    Germerica Member+

    May 2, 2012
    SoCal burbs
    Club:
    Los Angeles
    This is a valid question.

    1927093594382291124 is not a valid tweet id
     
  23. The mood is now taking a turn in Germany too

    Tagesschau

    https://www.tagesschau.de › inland › innenpolitik › israel-kritik-deutschland-100.html

    Auch in Deutschland wächst die Kritik an Israel | tagesschau.de
    2 dagen geledenMehrere SPD-Politiker fordern einen Stopp der Waffenexporte nach Israel. Außenminister Wadephul nennt die Lage in Gaza "unerträglich": Parteiübergreifend wächst in Deutschland die Kritik am ...

    DW

    https://www.dw.com › de › deutschland-israel-friedrich-merz-kritik-gaza-nahost-staatsraeson-v2 › a-72679787

    Deutschland und Israel: Der Ton wird schärfer - DW - 27.05.2025
    1 dag geleden27.05.2025 27. Mai 2025. Bundeskanzler Friedrich Merz (CDU) sagt, er verstehe die Politik Israels in Gaza nicht mehr. Einige SPD-Politiker fordern ein Ende der Waffenlieferungen.
     

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