Goal contribution of the best players

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by Trachta10, Nov 4, 2020.

  1. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Yes but two different newspapers considered it a Puskás goal, so how it's two opinions against one, I go for that
     
  2. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Well but Baggio is not a random average player, is considered by many as the best italian player of all time, and for a big football nation like Italy that is not easy.

    So I don't see his percentage that crazy. What I do think is that he played on average in not so good teams, and that is surely an advantage if we talk in goal involvement terms.

    If you see the goal difference of his teams in his career, the number is 58.91%, which is low.

    That is why I think that taking into account the goals conceded, will adjust the percentage to benefit players that played in better teams. And this would be a better representation of the reality
     
  3. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member+

    Jun 1, 2018
    So, after all, is Pelé still a fraud and just a goalscorer?

     
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  4. Jeffersonfv99

    Jeffersonfv99 Member

    Sport recife
    Brazil
    Jul 10, 2021
    Brasil
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil

    In my research, there are 45 Pelé assistances for the selection
     
  5. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
  6. anamnesis del fútbol

    Apr 9, 2021
    Trachta10 repped this.
  7. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    This is a great find! this game was not listed in any source I had

    https://www.ogol.com.br/player_results.php?id=5733&epoca_id=98&ps=1

    https://statisticsoccer.blogspot.com/2017/09/pele-1969.html

    The match report from A tribuna newspaper
    http://memoria.bn.br/DocReader/DocReader.aspx?bib=153931_01&Pesq=pele&pagfis=90202

    What I don't understand, how could Pelé give an assist if Santos didn't score any goal?
     
    anamnesis del fútbol repped this.
  8. xShion

    xShion Member

    Barcelona
    Brazil
    Jan 23, 2022
    Kashima's goal numbers are wrong.
     
    anamnesis del fútbol repped this.
  9. anamnesis del fútbol

    Apr 9, 2021
    #1484 anamnesis del fútbol, Jul 11, 2022
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2022
    I am not referring to the match against Racing but to the match he played against Sao Bento. I forgot to mention the match.

    07/09/1967

    Santos 4 x 3 Sao Bento

    https://acervo.estadao.com.br/pagina/#!/19670711-28294-nac-0020-999-20-not/tela/fullscreen
     
  10. anamnesis del fútbol

    Apr 9, 2021
    On Twitter you told me there were 1,544 team goals, right?
     
  11. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    The third source Jornal dos Sports doesn't have a detailed description for this game.

    So, a Tribuna and Acervo contradicts.
    For what I have seen, I personally think A Tribuna is more reliable, they tend to give more detailed descriptions for the goals.

    For me there is no assist
    http://memoria.bn.br/DocReader/DocReader.aspx?bib=153931_01&Pesq=pele&pagfis=70869
     
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  12. xShion

    xShion Member

    Barcelona
    Brazil
    Jan 23, 2022
    1543. I found out that a game actually went to penalties at 1:1
     
    anamnesis del fútbol repped this.
  13. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Zico updated

    [​IMG]
     
    anamnesis del fútbol repped this.
  14. xShion

    xShion Member

    Barcelona
    Brazil
    Jan 23, 2022
    210 or 209 assists?
     
  15. xShion

    xShion Member

    Barcelona
    Brazil
    Jan 23, 2022
    I already realized my mistake. By the way, he has 235 in my accounts.
     
  16. Tom Souster

    Tom Souster Member

    Jul 20, 2016
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Thierry Henry Career Statistics 1994-2014

    I have been working on recording a game-by-game spreadsheet of Thierry Henry's career statistics, using opta assists. I have been collecting match compilations of Henry's career for the past 6-7 years, and thought I would probably the best person to collate the most accurate stats of Henry!

    The main issue I have found with existing stats of Henry's monaco years are inaccurate - the only source i've seen is on french/spanish wikipedia. I wanted to built on @Trachta10 's work here, but it very difficult to source accurate ligue 1 stats from the 90's.

    Basically all games from 1999 onwards have footage online, or official stats which i've used to collate this sheet. If there are any inaccuracies/missing assists please point them in my direction - I am confident that this data is accurate, other than the missing monaco games listed, and possibly an assists missing for the national team.

    If anyone knows if are there any sources/french newspaper archives with match reports of 90's ligue 1 games where I could fill in the missing matches much like some other users here, it would be much appreciated.

    My spreadsheet is here:
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_HJ20Nape5WVbmaE0BRUoFMwWCFe0qqiFR_TzAg3le8/edit?usp=sharing

    Total stats for each team:

    NY Red Bulls Total:
    135 Games played, 122 Starts, 11,486 minutes.
    52 Goals 41 Assists 3 Penalty Assists.
    96 Goal Contributions.

    Barcelona Total:
    121 Games played, 100 Starts, 8544 minutes.
    49 Goals 26 Assists 1 Penalty Assist.
    76 Goal Contributions.

    Arsenal Total:
    377 Games played, 338 Starts, 30568 minutes.
    228 Goals (27 pens) 98 Assists 11 Penalty Assists (3 scored himself).
    336 Goal Contributions.

    Juventus Total:
    20 Games played, 16 Starts, 1398 minutes.
    2 Goals 2 Assists.
    4 Goal Contributions.

    INCOMPLETE
    Monaco:
    141 Games played, 7337 minutes
    28 Goals ? Assists


    France:
    123 Games played, 106 Starts, 9180 minutes.
    51 Goals 26 Assists 3 Penalty Assists.
    75 Goal Contributions.
     
  17. xShion

    xShion Member

    Barcelona
    Brazil
    Jan 23, 2022
    Great job
     
    Tom Souster repped this.
  18. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Great! I hope you can find the assists in Monaco
     
    Tom Souster repped this.
  19. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #1494 carlito86, Jul 21, 2022
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2022
    IceBlood34 repped this.
  20. xShion

    xShion Member

    Barcelona
    Brazil
    Jan 23, 2022
  21. xShion

    xShion Member

    Barcelona
    Brazil
    Jan 23, 2022
    Hi guys, I finished my Zico worksheet and wanted to share it with you.

    • Zico's career in official games:
    Games: 768 | 65,093 minutes
    Goals: 521 | 0.72 goals p90
    Assists: 235 | 0.33 p90 assists
    G/A: 756 | 1.05 G/A p90
    Hat tricks: 31
    Assist hat tricks: 2
    Free kick | Penalty | Head: 71 | 91 | 61
    Directly participated in 49% of the team's goals.

    20 assists estimated by Kashima.

    • Teams with Zico in official games:
    Goals scored: 1.543
    Goals conceded: 675
    Wins: 459
    Ties: 167
    Losses: 142

    Assists (Non-OPTA): 38
    Pre-assists: 52
    Penalties conceded: 16
    Missed penalties: 8
    Goals in penalty shootout: 4
    Goals missed in penalty shootout: 2
    Games as captain: 196
    Games as reserve: 22
    Games that was replaced: 102
    Yellow cards: 37
    Red cards: 5

    [emoji3503][emoji3503][emoji3503][emoji3503][emoji3503]

    • Zico's career in unofficial games:
    Games: 316 | 15,625 minutes found
    Goals: 248 | 0.76 goals per game
    Assists: 70 | 0.22 assists per game
    G+A: 318 | 1.01 G/A per game
    Hat tricks: 21
    Free kick | Penalty | Head: 16 | 26 | 21
    He participated directly in 38% of the team's goals.

    • Teams with Zico in unofficial games:
    Goals scored: 841
    Goals conceded: 428
    Wins: 196
    Ties: 71
    Losses: 48

    Assists (Non-OPTA): 9
    Pre-assists: 14
    Penalties conceded: 3
    Missed penalties: 2
    Goals in penalty shootout: 11
    Goals missed in penalty shootout: 1
    Games as captain: 33
    Games as reserve: 18
    Games that was replaced: 62
    Yellow cards: 2
    Red cards: 1

    [emoji3503][emoji3503][emoji3503][emoji3503][emoji3503]

    • Zico in the base and youth career:
    Games: 116
    Goals: 81 | 0.70 goals per game
    Hat tricks: 5
    Free-kicks | Penalty | (P) Lost: 7 | 9 | 1
    Hes goals contributed to 37% of the team's goals.

    • Teams with Zico in youth and youth games:
    Goals scored: 217
    Goals conceded: 66
    Wins: 154
    Ties: 25
    Losses: 13

    https://1drv.ms/x/s!AuXiiQSWfIDhg0bFUnUChQV27Ntl 20220104_001641.jpg
     
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  22. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #1497 carlito86, Jul 23, 2022
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2022
    You should maybe check the list again
    20220723_214748.JPG
    Dragan stojkovic won it in 1995 and made the best 11 on 3 separate occasions

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/J.League_Best_XI

    Zico neither won the best player award in Japan nor did he make the best 11 in any year

    As a side note
    Zico scored what was his own words 'easily the best goal of his career' playing for kashima.
    Its was one the greatest goals of all time IMO but then.... that's just my opinion

    He had a relationship with Japanese football that extended long after he retired (even coaching the NT)

    It wasn't by any means a retirement league for him despite the circumstances surrounding him joining
    https://www.nippon.com/en/japan-topics/g02056/
     
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  23. Jeffersonfv99

    Jeffersonfv99 Member

    Sport recife
    Brazil
    Jul 10, 2021
    Brasil
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    +1 Assistance for the King of Football Pelé, Santos 2x1 Corinthians - Campeonato Paulista - 1970
     
  24. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    I think you are referring to the game of 02/08/1970 that ended 2x2 right?

    You are right, is one more assist for Pelé

     

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