Goal contribution of the best players

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by Trachta10, Nov 4, 2020.

  1. Velvet Takahashi

    Kawasaki Frontale
    Japan
    Apr 10, 2025
    He was the best winger in Serie A in 1998 at Bologna (I think it's fair to say he was ahead of Paulo Sergio). ESM is a very tight group; players like Pep only made 1 appearance on the ESM Team of the Month in his prime. Owen only made 2 when he won the Ballon d'Or; R9 once in 2002, Cannavaro twice in 2006, and Modric once in 2018. These are Ballon d'Or-winning seasons too.
     
  2. Prasenjit

    Prasenjit Member

    Barcelona
    Argentina
    Aug 25, 2025
    Won't argue for such trivial things.we should agree to disagree i guess.
     
  3. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Modrić, Ronaldo Nazário and Cannavaro were all World Cup winners or finalists in the years you’re citing. In each case, they were widely regarded as being at least among the top three performers at those tournaments.


    In a World Cup year, Ballon d’Or outcomes are largely shaped by the tournament itself rather than by domestic league form. There’s no need to go over again how few games Ronaldo played in 2002, how Modrić wasn’t seriously discussed as a best in the world candidate in 2018 until May, or how poor Real Madrid’s defensive record was in La Liga in 2005/06.


    More importantly, this isn’t about a player having one or two ESM Team of the Month selections in a given season. Roberto Baggio had zero ESM monthly selections across a nine-year span, and zero top-20 Ballon d’Or finishes across that same period.


    Against that backdrop being the “best winger” in Serie A in 1998 is not something that meaningfully shifts the argument.
    It just doesn’t move the needle at all
     
    Prasenjit repped this.
  4. Isaías Silva Serafim

    Real Madrid
    Brazil
    Dec 2, 2021
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Oh so what you meant to say by "Essentially, the level of dominance Messi is displaying in USA is the same level of Pele at his peak in Brazil, a bit lower it seems." Is that the Brazilian league of the 60s were much stronger than current MLS and that Pelé at his peak were incomparable to late career Messi? Make it make sense. Remembering you just said "What I am doing, Isaias, is literally the opposite"
     
  5. Frank73

    Frank73 Member

    Inter Milan
    Brazil
    Mar 22, 2025
    Italy
    My contribution to the discussion
    https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Migliore_calciatore_italiano_AIC
     
  6. Velvet Takahashi

    Kawasaki Frontale
    Japan
    Apr 10, 2025
    The reason why he never received a top 20 position in the Ballon d'Or after 1995 was multiple reasons. Did his play decrease post-95? Yes, but did it dramatically fall, and was he a non-factor in Italian football after that period? No, he had both physical issues and issues with management at Milan but left and went to Bologna, scored 25 goals, and provided 14 assists (+ 14 clutch goals by my definition of clutch) in just 38 games for Bologna and Italy. 39 G+A while playing out of position after suffering multiple injuries at a club with poor playmakers and benching a prime Del Piero at the World Cup. Why did he receive 0 votes in the Ballon d'Or after being nominated? because he played for a small team. He finished runner-up to Del Piero (who was playing unbelievable football) at the AIC Best Italian Footballer awards, and he also had the highest average rating by DBSCalcio behind Francesco Totti (side note: also the top assister of Serie A in 95-96). Nikos Machlas finished bottom of the Ballon d'Or voting after scoring 34 goals in 32 games and winning the European Golden Boot over Oliver Bierhoff, Jardel, Hakan Suker, etc. a very impressive feat, too bad he played for a small club so no recognition is needed.
     
  7. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024
  8. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024
  9. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Ronaldinho 2005
    Games: 56
    Goals: 30 (10 PK, 6 FK, 1 hdr)
    Assists: 22 (Opta)
    Assists: 6 (Non-Opta)
    Pre-Assists: 10 (Opta)
    Pre-Assists: 3 (Non-Opta)

    G+A* p90: 1.312
    Team Contribution 71/123: 57.7%
    Clutch Contribution 28/58: 46.6%

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]



    some players, calendar year stats
    [​IMG]
     
    Sexy Beast repped this.
  10. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors

    More years
    [​IMG]
     
  11. Velvet Takahashi

    Kawasaki Frontale
    Japan
    Apr 10, 2025
    Zidane at 48% as a midfielder for real madrid is madness
     
    Trachta10 repped this.
  12. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024
    Where is

    Gerd Muller 1971-1972 season ????????????????????


    Gerd will be the first place as simple as that !
     
  13. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024


    1971-1972 [​IMG] Bayern Munich Bundesliga


    34 40 16 ......... Bundesliga






    6 5 0 - - - POkal Cup from Germany


    C2 8 5 0 - - - - - - - - -.. Cup Winners Cup ....... until the semi-finals ...against Rangers ...1971-1972 season ......

    West Germany National Team side
    9 14 1 ........ 2 Pre-assists (Opta ) ,....... against Poland ..Away-game ...England ...away-game ..


    57 .....Matches ...

    64...Goals


    17....Assists ...........


    In the Bundesliga, it's easier to find the assists Opta and Non-Opta .

    The Kicker magazine provides the data-base correctly and very very accuracy % from the older Bundesliga . "!
     
  14. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024
    779


    720

    143




    Gerd Muller are correct in the Bundesliga yes ...

    i saw the videos ... sounds ...correctly ...yes ..



    But in the other competitions ...

    is missing a lot .... Of Assists and Pre-assists ... (Opta and Non-Opta );;;;;....

    on Gerd Muller's numbers .. "!
     
  15. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024
  16. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024


    from Gerd Muller

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1971–72_FC_Bayern_Munich_season




    101 team-goals % at Bundesliga


    Gerd Muller ...

    34 Matches
    40 Goals
    16 Assists (Opta ) ........

    Total == 56 team-goals == from 101 ...possible team-goals ..


    is missing some ... indirect Assists (Non-Opta )
    and ......... Pre-assists (Opta and Non-Opta ) ...... ..



    56 % ......team-goals ....... until here ....... "!
     
  17. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024

    101 Goals Bundesliga ..1971-1972

    14 Goals Pokal Cup ........... 1971-1972

    12 Goals .....................Cup Winners Cup ........1971-1972 ....


    TeamGoals from Bayern Munich ....on this season ....

    teamGoals .....from West Germany .....1971-1972 ....... Total == 16 == .;;;... team goals with Gerd Muller .
     
  18. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024

    Gerd Muller West Germany National team side 1971-1972 ...season ..


    88 % Team-Goals .. !

    +

    Bayern Munich ... until here ........... 56 % team-Goals ...

    but Bayern Munich is missing yet ...so many many actions by Gerd .. "!
     
  19. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024







    1 Assist (Opta ) was found .....


    Bayern Munich ........ 1 ........vs ...............1 ................ Rangers .......


    Assist to Paul Breitner ......... in the first half from this Match ...there . "!
     
  20. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024

    until now ...... 18 ... Assists to Gerd Muller ....... 1971-1972 season ..... "!
     
  21. Velvet Takahashi

    Kawasaki Frontale
    Japan
    Apr 10, 2025
    His terrible record against the big teams in the Bundesliga that season weigh him down heavily i think
     
  22. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024


    for sure no,


    Gerd

    34 Matches
    40 goals
    16 Assists (Opta )
     
  23. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024
  24. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024


    Gerd

    He's impossible to bring down.
     
  25. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024

     

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