.... .. The categories or metrics I use... to analyze players are different from yours. mine it is like Football Manager metrics . !
well , Look the game .. between Boa Vista 1 vs 0 PSG .... 2002/2003 ...Uefa Cup Ronaldinho lost one penalty-kick taking .... and had a really bad game ... in Big matches !
... Serie A Calcio 80's ... It was more balanced, harder yes... Victories were worth only 2 points, Referees practically never gave red cards for violent fouls. Limit on foreigners. Only 2 until... 1987-1988 Italy..... 1988-1989 Spain..... Countries like France and Portugal circumvented the foreigner limit. European Cups... Always in knockout games
really ??? Diego Maradona 679 Matches 345 Goals 241 Assists .... vs Ronaldinho 816 Matches 299 Goals .... 203 ;;.Assists ... (including Non-Opta and ..Olympic Games ...2000-2008 )
I don’t subscribe to this Voodoo If what I say right now is a lie please feel free to correct me Diego Maradona and Ronaldinho gaucho combined scored 0 non penalty goals in World Cup finals Copa America finals European Cup finals Copa libertadores finals UEFA Cup finals Club World Cup finals UEFA Cup winners cup finals Conmebol/UEFA Finalissima The starting point / main metric of clutch ability is goalscoring That is the foundation and everything else is built on top of it. What you are doing is placing a shiny roof on top of an invisible building. Note: Your rebuttal can be combined in one or two posts My post wasn’t so profound that it requires an avalanche of responses.
Cruyff and Platini ;;; making it also ... using and making goals .. with La mano de Dios ...tambien chico ...hahaha.. Platini did it also ..at Saint Etienne years ...French first division ...Dailymotion videos .. ... Cruyff .. also ... had tries out ..on this . !
N O Clutch=Goalscorer That is the same response you will get from Carlito in London,Jean Pierre in Paris,João Silva in Rio de Janeiro,Rajesh Kumar in New Delhi,John Smith In New York, and José García in Madrid. Take your pick of any name of any fan in any country in Europe,Africa,Asia,Australia,America,the North and South Pole The fu*king aliens Diego Maradona met Anywhere and any time zone You are NOT clutch for assisting or pre assisting a goal in a major final That’s just being a passenger to someone else’s moment. Goal scoring is the only universally recognised measure of being clutch in finals. Get that in your head compadre once and for all!!!!!??????!!!!
That is not a problem, that is a feature of gc% that no other metric offers. That is its value. Relative comparison to player's teammates. To whom else could you comapre a player but his teammates who play in the same team against the same opponent? This would only make sense in small sample size, or if youd argue that teammaþes performance is compeltely random. If teamamtes performance was indeed random, then you would have a point, since it is not random, and across large sample size, teammates performance converges towards certain true value that then you can comapre it. Whether teammates suck and that makes it easy to have high gc%, or if teammates are elite and high gc% is really impressive. That is NOT a bug of gc%, that is something you interpret along side all other factors and contexts. That doesnt make gc% flawed, it makes it necessary to interpret it. You clearly dont understand that gc% is NOT a players rating, because if you did understand that, you wouldnt make this nonsense criticism. Gc% being a palyers rating would imply finality to the value of gc%, no interpretation is needed. You take it literally as it is and comapre players and rank them. But since it is not players rating, it is nonsensical to criticize it for things you do. It doesnt say that higehr gc% means better player. It is just an another data point that informs perception of performance through lens that no other statistic does. It is not a standalone, final fact. Other peopels opinions and interpretation of facts of gc% is not problem with gc% itself, and it doesnt warrant calling it "flawed" or compeltely throwing it out. Then you have problem with those peopel, not gc%. I am not sure who these people are tho. Trachta is providing data, and although he has his opinions you might disagree with and biases or holes in his conclusions, he is not authority on gc%. He is not gc% in human form. Your disagreement with Trachta is not proof of uselessness if gc%. Jsut like if someone misinterprets ga per game, he is not reperesentative of ga per game. That is oen person and one interpretation. The problem is that you actually wont admit that gc% is extremely valuable and shows things that otherwise can not be captured by eye test or any other type of metric.
@Trachta10 as Messi's international career is coming to the end, it would be awesome to capture his entire international career performance. Sort of like per year, per certain significant periods of time. Per comeptitions, qualifiers, etc.
It's not useless. It only serves to highlight the incompetence of a player's teammates. A ranking based on GC% is a ranking of which player had the most incompetent teammates in terms of generating goals without relying on him. And it makes perfect sense to see this across a larger sample size. Let's assume that in 10,000 hours of play one player produced 1,500 goals and another produced 1,300 goals. But player 1's teammates produced 1500 goals without his involvement while player 2's teammates produced 1000 without his. The GC% shows that the first player had more productive teammates and the second had less productive teammates. Although player 1 produced 200 more goals than player 2. This does not excuse player 2 from producing less
No what? That goals are not the only universally recognised measure of being clutch in finals? You are on record saying “ goals being valuable in football is only an assumption and not a fact” In those words and you doubled down ————————— ——————————- You are a complete madman to me and I don’t waste my time with mad men.
come on Carlito 86 !.... Everyone, including in Brazil, points to Lionel Messi as the best player in the Football history, or in second place, along with Edson Arantes Pelé. 1 . Pelé 2. Lionel Messi ... diego is getting forgotten too...
..... .. PVC E JUCA ANALISAM DESPEDIDA DE MESSI E FAZEM RANKING COM O CRAQUE ENTRE OS MELHORES DA HISTÓRIA!
........ ... .. FIFA Player of the Century XX Official votes Magazine and grand jury votes Player Nationality Percentage 1 Pelé Brazil 72.75% 2 Alfredo Di Stéfano Argentina 9.75% vs Century XX1 1 . Lionel Messi 2. C. Ronaldo ... Who was the most Total Footballer among them for you ?
..... yes THE SWISS CHEESE PARADOX .... ... ... O PARADOXO do QUEIJO SUÍÇO é a coisa mais BIZARRA que você vai ver hoje
Literally the most iconic moments of Maradona's career are the "goal of the century" and the "hand of God". No assist in his career compares to those two goals. No one remembers the assist for Burruchaga in the final the same way they remember those two goals
G/A p90 doesn't depend on the player in question but on his teammates As it is true that football is a team sport, the player in question can’t do anything alone, he needs his teammates to do absolutely everything on the field. The example you give isn’t 100% accurate, because players don’t compete in an exclusive way but rather complement each other, since that is literally what a team sport is. Your teammates are largely the ones who enable you to score. If Messi scores a goal from a Neymar pass, that goal wouldn’t exist without that pass, and in turn the assist wouldn’t exist without the pre-assist. In other words, players benefit from each other more than they compete with each other. Having a good team increases your G/A more than it reduces your GC%, and having a weak team reduces your G/A more than it boosts your GC%. And the reason this is definitely the case is because football is a more collective sport than an individualistic one.
Yeah that is not how it works. Worse teammates will also decrease your own output. Ronaldo scored 10+ goals the last 6 seasons in Real. He hasnt scored more than 6 since. Why? Because he left the greatest ucl team ever and joined inferior teams with inferior teammates. And you know that, and you recognize that, and you use that all the time when comparing players based on GA per game. Individual performance and team performance are in a locked, inexcapable codependent relationship at all times.
Messi has a GC% (without penalties) of 61.7% with Argentina and 62% with Barcelona, literally the same in very different contexts. It’s not that simple; a player is boosted by his teammates depending on infinite factors. Mbappé had a GC% of 59% (the best of his career) at PSG while playing with Messi and Neymar. "If Careca and Carnevalle had generated more goals, Maradona's GC% would be lower. As they generated few, Maradona's GC% was high." What you’re saying here is incorrect, because contributions largely ‘overlap’, if Careca scores more, then Maradona assists and pre-assists more, and vice versa.
Yet you cared enough to respond to me and keep searching for my brilliant quotes on the forum. Thank you carlito. It is very basic actually. You cant derive value from facts alone. You need a frame of reference, an objective. It is not that advanced or complicated. Go to chatgpt to help you out with thinking about this. You got this Spoiler (Move your mouse to the spoiler area to reveal the content) Show Spoiler Hide Spoiler Yes, in principle that’s true. Facts by themselves are inert. They simply describe what is. To derive value from them, you need a frame of reference—some purpose, goal, or objective against which those facts can be evaluated. Example: Fact: The outside temperature is 5°C. Without context, this is just raw information. If your objective is to go skiing, that’s good news. If your objective is to plant tomatoes, that’s bad news. So the same fact shifts in value depending on the reference point. This is why: In science → facts gain significance only when placed in the frame of a hypothesis or research goal. In decision-making → facts are relevant only in relation to desired outcomes. In ethics → facts about what is don’t dictate what ought to be (Hume’s is–ought problem). Put simply: facts inform you, objectives orient you. Value emerges only when the two meet. I would like you to prove how "universally" that is recognized. Any final in football is no different than any other football match. What is valuable on the pitch or clutch in R16 or a league match vs the bottom team, is in principle the same thing that is valuable in finals. Finals are not played by different rules than any other football match. What a drunk, average Joe at the bar has mental bandwith to process in football match does not reduce football to just goals. Enough stupidity put together does not equal reality of things, no matter how much you scream it into the void.