Goal contribution of the best players

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by Trachta10, Nov 4, 2020.

  1. Bin1250

    Bin1250 Member

    Arsenal
    Argentina
    Jun 16, 2023
    Now I remember 5 or 6 of him that weren't in the video, one of them was one of his best passes. I think he provided quite a few of them during his time at Sporting Lisbon
     
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  2. Bin1250

    Bin1250 Member

    Arsenal
    Argentina
    Jun 16, 2023
  3. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #2828 carlito86, Sep 12, 2024
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2024
    It doesn’t show him in that YouTube video

    The pre assist is here though

    0:17

    yeah it seems I missed it

    Two portions of his career I can’t claim to of watched(extensively)are his stints at sporting Lisbon and his current stint at al nassr.

    82 pre assists doesn’t seem too far away from the real number I think (and it is a good number by any standard)
     
  4. Bin1250

    Bin1250 Member

    Arsenal
    Argentina
    Jun 16, 2023
    He probably did more than 100 in his career
     
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  5. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Here there is an update for Messi
    if I'm not wrong 2004/05-2022/23 is 161 pre-assists (Opta) it goes to 206 including non-opta (Messi direct pass to teammate non-opta assist)

    https://www.mediafire.com/file/iip2w38u9kkyy9b/Pre-assists.xlsx/file
     
  6. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    I was reviewing this data, and I complemented it with data that I have

    Lionel Messi for Barcelona
    Team's goals while on the pitch: 1802
    778 Games
    672 Goals
    269 Assists (Opta)
    81 Assists (Non-Opta)
    127 Pre-Assists (Opta)
    38 Pre-Assists (Non-Opta)
    Team Contribution: 65.87%

    Lionel Messi for Argentina NT
    Team's goals while on the pitch: 319
    187 Games
    109 Goals
    55 Assists (Opta)
    12 Assists (Non-Opta)
    30 Pre-Assists (Opta)
    7 Pre-Assists (Non-Opta)
    Team Contribution: 66.77%

    Even results, Messi seems to have the same performance in Barcelona as in Argentina
     
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  7. Letmepost

    Letmepost Member

    Arsenal
    South Korea
    Apr 11, 2023
    I'm sort of confused by the data, do you mean that Lionel Messi's pre-assists to OPTA assists to teammates scoring only, tallies to 161 pre-assists?

    127 pre-assists and 30 from the national team does not add up-to 161 pre-assists purely for OPTA assists to teammates.

    1) His tallies of pre-assists to OPTA assists that results in the teammates scoring.

    2) His tallies of pre-assists to all "assists" that include heavy deflections, that resulrs in the teammate scoring.

    I personally think the pre-assist count for Cristiano Ronaldo video was closer in nature to category 2.

    If possible, do you have the pre-assists numbers for both category 1 and 2?
     
  8. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    The file is updated to season 2022/23, if I'm not wrong

    The number of pre-assists to Opta assists is 161

    if we include (non-opta assists of teammates) the number is 206 pre-assists

    In this case, we are saying that Messi made a direct pass and his teammate made the non-Opta assist. This includes deflected passes, but I assume it could also include rebounds from shots and other actions. I don't know what criteria the person used to define non-Opta assists
     
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  9. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024


    ........










    For example .... Ferenc Puskas vs ScoTland .. Away game ! 4 x 2 scoreline ...



    Ferenc Puskas ... 2 Direct Assists (Opta Style ) .. to Hidegkuti and another Assist there to Sandor Kocsis ..




    1 indirect Pre-Assist ... ( Non Opta Style ...).. rebound the Goalkeeper ..there ...
    .....( but Football Manager Style )..
     
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  10. Wiliam Felipe Gracek

    Santos FC
    France
    Feb 3, 2024


    great numbers at all ... Sounds.. like Michel Platini ... ( JUventus de Turin ) TeamGoals % !
     
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  11. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    You will like this

    Cristiano Ronaldo all games

    https://www.mediafire.com/file/e0lpgz7xsata3hk/Cristiano+Ronaldo+all+official+games-1.xlsx/file

     
    Wiliam Felipe Gracek repped this.
  12. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    I don’t know if this is true
    But if I ‘discover’ upwards of 20 extra pre assists I will make a part 2.

    if it is less I’ll just tag you the YouTube match/highlight compilations along with the relevant timestamps


    The pre assisted goals will definitely be in two parts though
    The first part I will post this morning

    The second part will be posted over the weekend.
     
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  13. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
  14. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Team's Goals Contribution %
    When the Team score 1 or 2 goals

    [​IMG]
     
    Wiliam Felipe Gracek repped this.
  15. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Most Clutch Goals+Assists
    551 Messi 376-175
    538 C.Ronaldo 435-103
    476 Pelé 331-145
    411 Puskás 277-134
    314 Maradona 192-122
    283 Cruyff 150-133
     
  16. Bin1250

    Bin1250 Member

    Arsenal
    Argentina
    Jun 16, 2023
  17. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
  18. ffff15

    ffff15 Member

    Argentina
    Sep 29, 2021
    Remove penalty goals I want to see something
     
  19. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    I noticed this, at the other end of the spectrum (teams scoring highly - this will be a mixture of course of playing vs teams easier to score against for the player/their team, and high level games where the player and/or his team has an excellent and/or clutch performance):
    [​IMG]
    Mr.Idolo on X: "Some players when their teams score 3 or more goals (high scoring teams) Let's take a look to the stats for each player. https://t.co/GKakGyY88z" / X

    I guess he might be a guy who collaborates on the data with Trachta on Twitter (I think a few of you share data don't you, and I know he's a friend of @anamnesis del fútbol ), although I didn't try to verify that and it could be there are some differences in data collected, from different reports etc or using different estimations (though on the face of it Opta and non-Opta assists are being recorded the same way anyway seemingly).
     
  20. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    yeah, we usually share the data, this would be my table, the difference is that I take the G+A per 90 minutes, which is why modern players have a higher %

    [​IMG]
     
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  21. Guts_1069

    Guts_1069 Member

    Cruzeiro
    Brazil
    Nov 6, 2023
    Maradona played in that conditions along all his career, some players like Pelé played mostly of the games in the end of the career when the team scoring was very low, but is interesting the data, should be interesting to know also Cruyff pre assists to see how high his contribution grows
     
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  22. SayWhatIWant

    SayWhatIWant Member+

    Jan 10, 2015
    Messi probably blows Cristiano out the water for preassist volumes... but I doibt this means much. These could be extremely basic nonthreatening back or sidepasses... hardly footballing genius and more likely representative of Barcelona's linkage play
     
  23. Guts_1069

    Guts_1069 Member

    Cruzeiro
    Brazil
    Nov 6, 2023
    yeah, tik taka can inflate the pre assists stats, but even the side passes can be good if you had a good link up play or doing one-twos with teammates depend of the context
     
  24. SayWhatIWant

    SayWhatIWant Member+

    Jan 10, 2015
    I am not qualifying all or even the majprity of his preassists as useless. I just really don't think the numbers can be compared and "mean" the same thing. Best is to aggregate in video form and reach a conclusion
     
  25. Trachta10

    Trachta10 Member+

    Apr 25, 2016
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Messi in the World Cup
    Matches: 26
    Goals: 13
    Assists: 8
    Non-Opta: 3
    Pre-Assists: 4
    Team Contribution 28/43: 65.12%
    Clutch Contribution 18/25: 72.00%

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Maradona in the World Cup

    Matches: 21
    Goals: 8
    Assists: 8
    Non-Opta: 0
    Pre-Assists: 3
    Team Contribution 19/31: 61.29%
    Clutch Contribution 10/17: 58.82%

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Pelé in the World Cup

    Matches: 14
    Goals: 12
    Assists: 7
    Non-Opta: 2
    Pre-Assists: 1
    Team Contribution 22/37: 59.46%
    Clutch Contribution 9/18: 50.00%

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Messi in the Copa America

    Matches: 39
    Goals: 14
    Assists: 18
    Non-Opta: 4
    Pre-Assists: 8
    Team Contribution 44/66: 66.67%
    Clutch Contribution 20/31: 64.52%

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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