and FSU defense is terrible at defending 1v1's on the edges where they allowed all three goals from and conceded a PK as well ... which is more concerning? ... which is easier to correct in practice? Either way, this argument doesn't make any sense to me. You can't single out one flaw a team has and make an argument about rankings with it. The coach rankings are about who they think the best over all team was / is, not who is better at defending set pieces, not who has the better record, not even who has the better stats for the reasons mentioned above. It might have been a close call on the check list, but the total at the end for eight coaches? More boxes were checked for UNC.
LOL Coaches watching games? We have tons of evidence that they specifically don't do that. Plenty of coaches have said they stack rankings to fit their own desires.
If you think that coaches spend time watching games all over the nation then you don't understand how this works. Coaches watch two teams: their own and their next opponent. They don't have time to watch a ton of games. Regarding the rankings, UNC is ranked above FSU because of body of work (wins against USC and Arkansas and draws against Penn State and FSU). That's fine. I have no problem with that. The rankings in September don't matter. However, if you continue to press the case that UNC outclassed FSU we will just have to agree to disagree. Also, great job rationalizing a lucky own goal.
I guess. honestly of all the arguments I expected against the #1 ranking for UNC over FSU after the draw, the last I expected to hear from FSU fans was that they think they played better than UNC.
Coaches might not watch all the games, but UNC vs FSU in what was essentially a #1 vs #2? Any coach worth their salt watches that game.
The Soccer Coaches Poll is, honestly, a joke. Only 8 coaches vote in the rankings out of 350+ programs playing WoSo. By comparison, the NCAA Football Coaches Poll has 66 voters, the NCAA Basketball Coaches Poll has 32 voters, and the NCAA Women’s Field Hockey Coaches Poll has 42 voters. The soccer poll cannot be taken too seriously. Which is a shame since it holds so much value for recruiting, etc.
Babs is knowledgeable but really has trouble seeing anyone else’s point of view, especially if it does not favor UNC. As a Carolina fan, what I saw Sunday were two very good, evenly matched teams. Either one could win each time they play. Both have their flaws; it’ll be interesting to see who better addresses their issues as the season goes on. Although it really doesn’t matter much, either team could be called number 1 now. I’d give the edge to Florida State at the moment for the reason stated earlier, a draw on the other team’s home field. Head to head results are just more important than anything else. If you think the coaches who vote in the poll watch all the other teams play maybe you can help me in recovering my royal inheritance currently being held up in Nigeria.
I'm linking a post I wrote in the FSU 2022 thread after UNC went on the road to FSU and snatched a win. You don't have to read the whole post, but I would like you all to just read the first line out loud to yourselves. Then come back here and tell me to my face that I am incapable looking past my biases to admit that UNC was outplayed. https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/fsu-2022.2118697/page-13#post-40875779 to be clear, the argument folks here have against UNC still being the #1 team in the country is: - a home draw against the #3 team in the country - a comparison of unbeaten records between a team that had hardest schedule in the country and a team that has played a single ranked opponent up to Sunday's game. - a belief that FSU played better than UNC based on certain statistics that are even at best while other statistics are clearly in UNC's favor, including a remarkable near 60 - 40 possession advantage for UNC. - finally, the belief that all eight of the coaches selected to pick the weekly top 25 in a coaches poll couldn't be bothered to watch the most important game of the season and instead all of them picked UNC to be #1 based on assumptions, suppositions, and their own cynical desires. Listen, it was a close game. Last years game was significantly more in favor of FSU than this years game was in favor of UNC. However, in the context of the coaches poll ... nobody in charge of a poll with any sense is going to drop a team out of a #1 position and replace them with another top 5 team when those two teams just played to a draw. You would have had a better argument questioning why UNC was #1 in the previous poll. I myself made that same question and was prepared to see FSU there. They didn't do it then, they are most certainly not going to do it the following week when the two teams just play to a draw. You want to dethrone the #1 team in the country? You have to beat them, not tie them.
My argument with you was not over the poll. I would be fine with FSU or UNC at #1 and most importantly I don't care about polls in September so it's not really worth arguing about right now IMO. My disagreement with you was when you said that UNC outclassed FSU on Sunday. But now you say it was a close game so we are in more agreement. Outstanding.
Actually, Penn State is the #1 ranked team ... for what it is worth ... which is not much. Get a grip you guys, how teams are ranked at this stage of the season, when it comes to 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 places apart, is meaningless.
never said UNC outclassed FSU and said from the beginning both here and on the UNC thread that it was a close game. My UNC post even says that if it wasn't for the timing of the goals I would probably think a draw was a fair result. No where on either threads or on twitter did I ever say UNC showed up or outclassed FSU. The context of the arguments here was about why FSU didn't leap frog UNC in a coaches poll after a draw. The answer to me was simple, UNC was the better team. They looked it. They played it. It's supported by the stats. That and "it was a close game" can both be true. @cpthomas Coaches poll but ... you're right, it's academic and I'm somewhat aggravated with myself to be drawn down that rabbits hole after a meaningless poll choice.
My bad. You said outchanced not outclassed. However, you did say that UNC "Looked like the better team. Played like the better team" I disagree with that statement. I think that the game was basically even and I do think that the draw was a fair result regardless of the timing of the goals especially since UNC's second goal was so lucky. Also, I don't see where it is supported by the stats that UNC is the better team. So once again we will have to agree to disagree. I'm sure we will find out for sure in the postseason.
I noticed with the records that you guys have played three less games than us. Did FSU have a game postponed or canceled?
No. Pensky had trouble getting teams to come to Tallahassee due to the team being so good and the high temperatures in Florida early in the season. They already had two road games scheduled at the beginning of the season and the staff decided that playing three or four straight road games to start the season wouldn't be ideal so they basically took two weeks off after the first two games.
Disclaimer: This is a rant, but an admittedly inconsequential rant about biases especially in ACC country. The ACC.Com does offensive and defensive player of the week weekly. Their have been 6 weeks of the same. This week Ally Sentnor of UNC was the OPOTW. There is nothing particularly nefarious about this except that 6 of the 12 awards have gone to, (drum roll please) UNC. Just for diversity's sake, could not some other team get represented? Was Jordynn Dudley not worthy of that honor? Does the UNC AD run theacc.com web page? FSU has had 1 of 12 honors. Duke 1 of 12 , UVA 1/12, Clemson 2/12 and Pitt 1/12. If UNC was dominating as much as these awards suggest, they would be undefeated and untied. Nationally the same goes for the poll which has a 4 tie UNC over FSU, Stanford and Penn St with 0 losses and one tie. Rant over! As long as we get a 1 seed in the NCAAT, it doesn't matter, b/c you have to settle it on the field.
I read this and had to take a moment to remind myself that not everybody is as insane as Anson Dorrance when it comes to scheduling non con games.
As a UNC fan the selections look perfectly sensible to me and I can’t see why anyone would think otherwise. Seriously, though, the numbers do look odd for a league with so many good teams and so many talented players. Does anyone know who actually decides on the weekly awards? All those coaches who are watching all the games or someone else? I want Dudley on my team.
I think, in general, and perhaps not surprisingly, UNC gets a lot of grace that other teams aren't awarded. Especially within the ACC.
I would gladly trade the ACC's supposed bias for UNC with award and ranking selections for the officiating bias we supposedly once had. I mean ... nobody is going to say we've had that in a while, are they?
Does anyone know how the weekly awards are decided? I’m guessing its someone in the ACC office and would be surprised if coaches have the time to be involved in the actual selection. Perhaps Carolina does some lobbying that other schools don’t?
Nothing new here. Some players choose UNC for that reason. Love Maycee Bell, but how do you make pre-season all ACC when you barely played the season prior? Beats me. Actually, it doesn't
To FSU fans, I rewatched highlights and came away more impressed than before with JD. In prior games, I saw lots of promise and glimpses of greatness, but in this game against arguably the best competition out there, she showed out. Doing your best against the best is not a given for even great players. Maybe that should be what separates very good from great! We've had lots of very good players at FSU, who have made us proud, but in every instance I can think of, there is a but when looking at their overall game. With JD the other night, I saw almost everything. I saw her make up 10 yards of distance on a quality athletic defender in a 50 yard space. Excellent long speed. I saw agility. She stopped on a dime and changed directions. I saw the use of both feet in shots. I saw good ability in the air on the corner kick. I saw 1v1 ability. I saw 1v 3 ability in the box. I saw short area quickness in the box which is unusual IMO in one so tall. I saw deft passes requiring touch/nuance. I saw her play defense with intensity. In short, I saw a complete player with a high soccer IQ. We may FINALLY have a player who eventually makes and stays on the USWNT. Our current USWNT Forwards have phenomenal athletic ability, I've been unimpressed with the soccer IQ and especially their passing. Time will tell. p.s. I also see USWNT potential in Taylor Huff, but that is another post.
UNC definitely generates hype for their players. the talk about Meza being the best midfielder in the world the talk about how King or the CBs should be on the senior national team now the talk about Sentnor and her 3-4 goals to date on the season being able to just completely take over games and dominate or the “best player on the field” talk. obviously when it’s coming from Anson people/media take it as gospel and run with it over and over. and many of these unc girls (Sentnor) have the usynt hype train building for years so it’s not really anything new and eventually hype doesn’t meet reality. but it’s also kind of silly.
I don’t know why anyone would get bothered about a coach praising their own players. Sure, Dorrance goes overboard at times, but so what? And he is consistent in publicly complimenting players on other teams after games.