Edward Preble When Preble was still preadolescent his father set out to discover "whether his sons had a dash of the right stuff in them" "A ship had come to Falmouth [now Portland, Maine] with a Turk on board; the Brigadier stuffed young Edward and his brother full of the idea that this awesome foreigner kidnapped and ate little boys, then handed the son of Mahound a couple of shillings to appear gibbering in the doorway one night when the boys were alone with the fireplace. The brother hid under the bed and was lost to history, but Edward leapt up like a lion and routed the turbaned desperado with a firebrand flung in his face." Edward was sent to sea in time for the Revolution, serving in a privateer, then the "Protector," then the "Winthrop," both of the Massachusetts Navy-- there was a Colonial Navy, but many of the individual colonies had there own as well. He performed a notable feat of seamanship in the first posting, and served in a once-famous battle in the second, and was the hero of another in the third. Both of the latter two were commanded by a man named George Little who has almost been lost to history himself but seems to have been both daring and capable, and it is to be presumed that Preble learned his business well from Little-- because he taught a cadre of young officers so well himself that he is the key figure in the history of the U.S. Navy. Lonely, taciturn, moody, passionate, analytical, tall but stooped by terrible stomach problems which ultimately killed him in 1807-- whether it was stomach cancer or a perforated ulcer is impossible to guess at this distance-- this was the man Jefferson and Secretary of the Navy Smith turned to when "the avarice of rank" threatened to make the Tripolitan War a failure. The Navy's two best senior captains, Truxtun and Richard Dale had both managed to resign from the service in a huff over questions of what was due them. (He was also probably the man C S Forester most patterned Horatio Hornblower after, though unlike Hornblower, he was an accomplished singer.) He was the junior full captain but one at that point and the service roster had to be combed out to find officers enough who were his juniors to allow him to command the third squadron sent out to Tripoli to prosecute the war (no officer could be compelled to serve under one his junior, so each ship had to be commanded by one junior to Preble. Most of the other ships were small enough to be commanded by Lieutenants-- but then they had to be seconded by Lieutenants junior to them, which was a bit of a trick in a service too small and new for seniorities to have shaken out much yet. The result was a squadron commanded by what Preble initially complained was "a pack of boys." But they turned out to be the greatest collection of talent ever assembled in one squadron, and it happened during Preble's watch, and Preble made it a very active watch indeed; so he is entitled to credit. The officers he had with him were only about 14 per cent of the officers of the Navy, and only a third of those at command rank by 1812-- but only Perry among those who won a battle in that war was not among them and only three of those who were did not so win. Preble's service before Tripoli is well documented-- the only thing that isn't in the popular histories is that the weather was terrible the first winter, driving the ships of the European navies into port-- yet Preble's pack of boys in their fleet of small ships managed to stay at sea and on blockade of Tripoli throughout, often amid waves as high as their masts. A great deal of seamanship was learned in these months, never to be forgotten. The rest, the loss of the "Philadelphia" to the enemy and her subsequent destruction, the gunboat battles, the repeated bombardment of the forts, the Eaton expedition, etc, were all in my grade school histories, so I imagine that they are at least easily accessible to present company and I won't go into them here beyond the list above. Edward Preble-- a "founding teenager," but among the most important and admirable of those who served in the Revoltion...
Mine was my fourth. I didn't cue you because I thought you had already taken your fourth. I haven't taken my fifth because I don't think chaski has. Beyond that I cannot say...
The Chancellor Robert R. Livingston, of the New York Livingstons. Was born into the life of privilege, but earned it himself. Attended what became known as Columbia, graduating as a lawyer. Practiced law with fellow teammate John Jay (they went to university together). Member of the Whig Party, was an anti-colonialist. Prevented the issuance of stamps under the Stamp Act in New York City. Was Secretary of Foreign Affairs under the Articles of Confederation. Along with another fellow teammate, he is the final draftee of the Committee of Five, the group which drafted the US Constitution. Became the chancellor of New York (hence his nickname) and swore in, George Washington. The Chancellor helped write the New York state constitution. He also worked with James Monroe on the details of the Louisiana Purchase. Met Robert Fulton and John Stevens, inventors of the steamboat, and financed the development (and got the navigation monopoly on the Hudson River). In his later years he experimented with agriculture and raising sheep. He is related to, directly or through marriage: John Jay Alexander Hamilton George Mason The Lee Family of Virginia and Maryland The Bush family The Roosevelts George Clinton (4th Vice President) The Astors William Patterson Fred Astaire (yes, that Fred Astaire) And my favorite: Elizabeth Cady Stanton @Val1 - make your 5th Correction, that should be @Knave and val
Remaining picks, in order: Knave Val roby chaski taosjohn already picked out of order in 5th round: cop shot cop brummie nutter That will make 5 picks for all. Should be do a brief write-up of our Fathers?
Me too. Because I stayed up late Tuesday night, I fell asleep early last night and didn't do my 4th round pick when I was supposed to, leading to today's confusion.
Those of us who are children of the sixties aren't so into that... Didn't drown my sorrows Tuesday night. Fire next time, y'know...
Sorry...didn't realize you were still a youngster! I had 2 bottles of Yoo Hoo to drown my sorrows. I got married mid 60's and by '70 had 3 little ones. Are you suggesting flame throwers?
I think I'm up. Right? No? Screw it, I'm going anyway! With my 5th and final pick, I'm choosing the man himself, the first "president" of The United States of America! That's right, I'm choosing ... Samuel Huntington Who the hell is Sam Huntington? Well, he was born in Connecticut, became a lawyer, was a delegate to the Continental Congress, signed the Declaration of Independence, signed the Articles of Confederation, and -- finally -- served as the first "President of Congress" under the Articles of Confederation. Because those articles are what first formed and named the United States of America, and because Samuel Huntington was presiding over the Continental Congress when they reformed the body into the first congress of the United States, he was (arguably at least) the first "president" of the United States, albeit not a presidency that resembled at all the executive office we have under the Constitution. Indeed, the "office" was largely ceremonial. I know. I was going to pick Sarah Palin and chickened out. Oh, well ... -- @Val1, come on down!
It must be my turn by now Benedict Arnold May 1775, captures Fort Ticonderoga with Ethan Allen. October 1776, loses naval Battle of Valcour Island on Lake Champlain, but stalls British plans to reach the upper Hudson River valley. The gunboat Philadelphia, which sank in this battle, is the oldest surviving American fighting vessel. It was discovered and raised in 1935, and now is in the Smithsonian Museum of American History. Oct-Sept 1777, Major General in Battle of Saratoga, the critical battle of the American Revolution. If Arnold had died at Saratoga, he would be in the pantheon of American heroes. But . . . . @taosjohn you are up @Val1 @roby you are overdue
You people show no respect for senior citizens! Vice Admiral Horatio Nelson of His Majesty's Fleet. He was appointed second-in-command to Admiral Sir Hyde Parker in an expedition to break the 'armed neutrality' of the Baltic States. The fleet sailed for Denmark and, despite the irresolute Parker, engaged the Danish fleet at anchor off Copenhagen. During the course of battle, which inflicted heavy losses on both sides, Nelson ignored Parker's signal to disengage from the fighting by putting his telescope up to his blind eye and claiming that he had seen no such signal. The bolded part is the tactic employed by MLS Referees to this very day!
Joshua Humphreys, shipwright and designer. Humphreys was already a craftsman of some note when the revolution struck, and was instrumental in refurbishing the collection of old merchant ships which were purchased and militarized to make the initial Colonial Navy. In the process he learned a good deal about the ergonomics of warships, as almost everything had to be strengthened in order to allow them to carry and fire naval batteries, but as soon as the weight of the strengthening and the guns was added, they turned dead slow. He also had some hand in the design and building of the built-from-scratch part of the Colonial Navy, which produced conventional but admirable ships-- but never the officers and men to make the most of them. The record of the Colonial Navy was one of miserable failure punctuated by the occasional Jones or Dale or Biddle. The original squadron of converted merchant ships did make one cruise to the Bahamas under Esek Hopkins, and captured a substantial lode of military stores which allowed the Revolutionary Army to go from rabble to something resembling a real force-- small arms, uniforms, sheet lead to make ammunition from and shoes and boots. Fast forward to the end of the Washington administration, when the revival of the Navy as a national service was contemplated. Humphreys was commissioned to design six frigates for it as an exploratory gesture. Humphreys reasoned that any fleet the fledgling nation would build would be grossly outnumbered by any enemy, and its largest ships would be too small to face the largest of the enemies. So he decided that he must design ships capable of overpowering any they must fight, and too fast to be caught by any they could not overpower. He designed the 19th century equivalent of pocket battleships-- frigates as long as small ships of the line, as length means speed in a sailing ship, yet armed with 24 pounders on the main gundeck where ships of the class mostly carried 12s. They were narrow and carried very tall masts, steeply raked bowsprits, deep at the stern and shallow at the bow to allow the leverage of those bowsprits to drag them through turns. A long narrow warship with heavy guns always hogs its back in service-- that is, it warps along its length and loses all its speed and maneuverability-- but Humphreys invented a solution to this, something called "Humphreys bracing" which counteracted the actual lines of force which tried to hog his ships. They were built of fir, which the Baltic powers had tried and rejected-- fir built warships murdered their crews in combat, because fir splinters on the inside when struck by shot on the outside-- large splinters which would fly the length of the deck, killing and maiming all in their path. Splinters killed and wounded more men in the age of sail than bullets, shot, swords and pikes combined. Humphreys designed and built of fir for its light weight and flexibility-- but he sheathed the inside with several inches of oak; this lamination turned out not only not to splinter like fir-- it also didn't splinter as much as the harder, heavier oak that most nations used. The fir compressed against the oak like a shock absorber when struck, and neither splintered as much. "Old Ironsides" was really more like "Old Balsasides"-- the shot didn't so much bounce off her as just drop into the ocean... And so they were built, in fits and starts, as an indecisive congress couldn't make up its mind whether they were needed for protection, or threatened the nation with debt and a military class-- "Constellation, Constitution, President, United States, Congress, Chesapeake." The ships that fought in six wars, and were home and classroom to an adolescent navy. "Chesapeake" and "President" were lost in the war of 1812, "United States" was destroyed at Norfolk Navy Yard when the Union recaptured it from the Confederacy, "Congress" much rebuilt, was the same commission when destroyed by the "Merrimack" at the battle of Hampton Roads-- although there may not have been an original plank or timber in her. Similarly the "Constellation" which floats in Baltimore harbor was so thoroughly rebuilt that she isn't even the same design as Humphreys', or so I'm told. But "Constitution" is still in commission in Boston harbor, a floating museum. I have been familiar with her plan since I was 8-- but seeing her was still a revelation. At rest she appears awkward and ungainly and at first impression one can see exactly why the British held our "handful of fir-built frigates" in such contempt. But as soon as one visualizes her in motion, whether from light breezes or in a gale, one can also see exactly why she was pound for pound the most effective warship ever built. One disappointment though-- in the ship herself and the nearby museum when I was there, there were a total of three mentions of Joshua Humphreys' name.
The way things have been going in this thread lately calls for a thread title change. "Floundering Fathers" is more like it!
Lighthorse Harry Lee Governor of Virginia, Congressman, father of Robert E Lee, cavalry commander extraordinaire, and the man who delivered George Washington's eulogy: first in war, first in peace, and first in the hearts of his countrymen.
Updated http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/founding-fathers-whose-your-daddy-the-selection-thread.2036729/ If anybody want to do a write up, that could be fun/interesting.
If it does become a vote-rigging contest, I feel that Knave and I are clear front runners, as, in Aaron Burr and William Blount, we have the most naturally talented candidates when it comes to political skullduggery. The fact that neither succeeded is an obvious mark against them, admittedly, but not every ploy succeeds for even the best-planned and well-executed intrigue.
Pfffftt! Clearly and without further discussion Vice Admiral Nelson would have Trumped them all with his arm tied behind his back. Granted he only had one arm which makes him most worthy!