If by "original Middle Easterners" you mean the first modern looking humans of 190,000 years ago, then you're right, they were most likely black. However, Jews were cousins to the ancient Babilonians. They were both semitic and white. That Jews were from Mesopotamia as long as 3,800 years ago we know from both history and archaeology as well as from the Bible. It appears, in around 1800BC, Abraham's father lived in Mesopotamia with most of Hebrew tribesmen in the midst of the semitic heartland. So, it begs to suggest that ancient Hebrews were certainly white. hebrews of Moses time (about 500 years later) were certainly white according to the Egyptians. Now, you, Dmitriy, seem to be tied to the ethnic definition of Russian and seem totally unaware that your opponents use the word "Russian" in a "nationality" sense.
This is both the stupidest and most interesting argument ever. In my opinion, what you and your family does as tradition because your ancestors did it, is culture, BUT the culture has to come from somewhere. It comes from your ethnicity. Am I an American? I am not sure. I was born here, yes, and I do take part in some american activities. But do I look American? I am not sure. I dont think that you can look american. I can probably pass off for an eastern european, or a frenchman, depending on the day. (I dont look Italian at all). I take part in family activities that my family has done for generations, whether they lived here, or in the plethora of other places where my ancestry originated. I dont speak the languages. Though, I do make an effort to try to know a little about them. I dont pay taxes to these lands either. I am a Roman Catholic because my family before me practiced it, and had practiced it for generations. Because I dont live in the place where they practiced it originally, I cant practice it, or call myself a Roman Catholic? Hardly. Do you see the ridiculous nature of a question like that? If the Soviet Union was still together, would we all be flaunting our own ethnicities? Or would we all be in here, talking about how we are Soviet, from many lands under one flag united? To tell someone they arent something is ridiculous if it is plausible.
I ment esterichka. Actually, dont try and make out Russians any different from the rest of the world, its the same basic concept no matter where you go. The only reason you say ethnicity is nonexistant in America is because it is abolished for you if you choose such. Your annual income is, afterall, averaged in the caucasian American column instead of the average for Hispanics, African Americans, and Asians. Are you telling me that America and Americans dont identify their citizens by ethnicity, that it doesn't exist and that nationality is the only thing you go by? Okay, then you should fit right in with your borthers in south-central LA from whom you are not the least bit ethnically different? America's large Mexican population must be one and the same with the good old rednecks from Texas - both sides being not different ethnically in the slightest, and treating each other as such? The Italian community has no pride whatsoever because of their ethnicity and doesn't get sterotyped by the American public on the grounds of ethnicity either? Cut the crap Shurik, Russia is dasies in comparisson to the ethnic stereotyping and segregation that occurs in your beloved USA... it just doesn't affect you and your narrowminded egotistical views. Same thing with Canada and our hotly contested French vs. English debacle as well as our largely segregated Asian population. Ethnicity exists whether you like it or not. Ethnicity is a good thing, but you and your inferiority complex make it out to be negative.
You guys are ridiculous, the Middle East was black until the Aryans and Greeks invaded and intermingled. Do u not know wtf a semite is? A person of mxied origin usually black and white. Arabs are black and white to varying degrees. ever heard of the Moors? The Ancient Egyptians? Have any of u seen Ancient Egyptian statues? Do u not knwo who Emhotep was? Are u people serious? Hair like wool, who has hair of wool? Ever wonder why so many Jews and Arabs have curly hair? Look it up. Egypt was almost entirely black ( except for the very few who mixed with the Greeks) until the Arabization of that country. If you were to look at the people of souther. Egypt where mixture with the Arabs isn't as definitive as in the north, the people are black.
Sphynx of King Taharqa Gee, never knew white people had such wid enoses and big lips I have nothing to gain from this rae talk, just sharing facts.
Thousand year old Egyptian artifacts Believed by many to be King Tut's mother. If you were to guess, white or black?
It's a non-existent word. In Russian, at least, but I will grant you a better knowledge of whatever language your ethnicity speaks. Trotting in the complex history of inter-racial relations in America would be an interesting point if only you were able to go to an anthropologist and get an affidavit signed which would proclaim Russians and Jews to be different races (as is Dmitriy is trying to do right now). Now, for all you know, your great-7times-grandmomma was a half-breed Tatar/Uzbek in a forbidden liasion with a German, whose offspring went on to espouse a Khokhlushka with a healthy dose of Turkish blood. And another person which shares the same Line Five as you could be a 7th-generation Zyryanin with lots of Iranian/Ossetian influence in his ethnic makeup on his mother's side. Both of your bloodlines have no smack to talk to mine. Your only connection to the word "Russian" is the language and the cultural background you've grown up in. Which is EXACTLY the same as mine. Except for the language. Mine is better.
Well unlike you I can trace my bloodline on my fathers side back a few centuries: its as Russian as you can get. Granted some Russian nobility was in fact originally from other parts of Europe, but if such is the case for my ancestry: the roots of that I cannot trace. On mother's side I am 1/8th Mordva, which I guess isn't Russian. Some Volga German or Tatar genes ony my mother's side are also a possibility... but not too likely. Apart from that, I am as Russian as can be.
What Russians want to be: What they would settle for: Gotta love Alyosha's Mongolic features and Ilya's dark, curly beard. Did you know that the Zhidovin Poganyi from one of the bylini was actually Ilya's son in another? What they actually are:
Nope, you can't trace the roots. And even if you could, you'd be so extremely surprised to see a slanty-eyed Finno-Ugric mug of the originator of the most Russian of all your anscestral lines, you'd plotz right there and then. Will you finally answer the question on whether Pushkin qualifies or not already?
I have no idea where Pushkin came from... so I cant answer. The name seems Russian enough, although he doesn't quite look Russian. While I can only trace my heritage 3 generations in some directions and a little over 10 in others... my phenotype and the baby blues speak for my ancestry without having to do much tracing.
Pushkin's grand-greatfather was an African servant to Peter the Great named Hannibal. Solid knowledge of Russian history is a nice complement to baby blues. Which, to think of it, are nothing to brag about. A greasy-haired Italian diver who scored a PK against the Aussies can brandish the same retinal pigmentation as can any number of Jews.
Jeff Halpern, the captain of the Washington Capitals. And quite a Jew. Beat that phenotype and baby blues, buster.
Okay, so Pushkin wasn't ethnically Russian as weren't alot of contributers to Russian culture... whats your point? The baby blue eyes are afterall a recessive trait, and having at as the predominant eyes colouron both sides of the family must say something about my non-Turkish, non-Tatar, non-Mongol, non-ect heritage. Jews can certainly have baby blue eyes, espcially Eastern European Jews... know why... because being Jewish is not an ethnicity. A Jewish person can look like Hitler's definition of Aryan or be indistinguishible from the Arabs that hate him. No need to burst my bubble of pride over the baby blues either, being voted most hypnotic eyes throughout my highschool career is an achievement I hold dear.
My point is very simple. If you consider yourself to be different ethnically from Pushkin, then you cannot possibly be Russian. Absolute BS. Light eyes and light hair are far more common in mixed offspring than you think. Jews are no more mixed than Russians and are no less an ethnicity than Ukrainians. Language and culture. And you can take your baby blues and stick them on an Eskimo of your choice. Hold on to that. May wind up being the pinnacle.
Yes yes, I know living examples of Russian and Polish Jews who are more Aryan looking than anyone in position of significant power in Nazi Germany. Refer to my above post about Jews and phenotype. Conversly, you have some sway in discrediting my roots due to my lack of distinct Slavic features... but arguing how my baby blue eyes make me a Mongol isn't gonna get you far.
Know what? I will grant you your Frank Sinatra oculars. So, is this the only EXACT ETHNICAL QUALIFICATION you got? If that's the case, will you disqualify of Line-Fivers with different retinal pigmentation? And will you admit all Non-Line-Fivers with the same one? Could be interesting that.
If Pushkin was African and not Russian, what does that have to do with me? Really, care to provide an example of a Tatar-Turkish child with blue eyes? I can't speak for the lightness hair to the point of being blonde since mine is what would call Russiye volosi - and that is derived from Russian mind you. Jews are more mixed and more dispersed than Russians, I dont know how much of an ethnicity Ukranians are, so I cant attest to that. Ive yet to see a blue eyed Eskimo... and in terms of being the pinnacle, it has been surpassed countless times and will likely get surpassed a few times in the 6-8 hours of total highschool time I have remaining.