Wow - this story about RSL is impressive. Stands in stark contrast to the Heck regime whose motto has been - there are plenty of fans out there ripe for the picking - why do we need you 10 year season ticket holders? http://www.realsaltlake.com/news/2012/05/sports-business-journal
Thanks for sharing this. What an incredible contrast to the Red Bull experience. Someone should email this article to Chris Heck and the austrian overlords and ask why not us.
Try these: chris.heck@newyorkredbulls.com fan.services@newyorkredbulls.com consumer.information@us.redbull.com
Was listening to the Seeing Red podcast. Heck said season ticket holders who renew during the season won't see an increase in their tickets for 2013. They really expect to raise prices again?
Interesting - did he mean he'd waive the card fee? Barring signing Kaka, I don't see them getting much interest from the folks who already said no. It was a tough decision for us to not renew, and I'm not changing that just to avoid a hike next season! Good grief. Edit - duh, I misread your note - in other words, it's going to be the same squeeze in advance to force renewals from the folks most loyal. I've listened to the Heck interview - it's mostly dull - but he is just as dismissive as ever of people who are disgruntled. I really can't stand him. I like how he thinks the t-shirt "Chris Heck hates soccer fans" is whimsically funny - when that isn't the point.
If this is what they're doing I'm so glad I didn't renew. Fool me once shame on you... To be fair there are always going to be a disgruntled population of your fan base. However, we know the difference between good management and bad. I'm not sure what the bottom line looks like right now, but from the start Heck hasn't struck me as a good managing director. On a related note: What happened to Erik Stover? I know there were logistical problems when the Arena opened (still are), but I thought he was great. Connected much better with the fan base IMO.
I don't think Stover as taken a new job since he left Red Bull which is a shame because I did like him as well. I think in a market with unlimited demand (ex. NFL) he would do well because he knows how to squeeze funds from people who will love the sports unconditionally. However, in a sport like the MLS where there is still grow and solidifying of the fan base needed because it is a young league, he ends up alienating people
Stover's specialty was in dealing with stadiums, not ticket sales. Once RBA was up and running, the parent company's focused shifted and they went with someone else. PS - I could have sworn he landed on his feet somewhere
I found the Heck interview to be sadly interesting. He had somewhat of a weary, defeated tone - or at least the sound of a man who knew he had a lot of heavy lifting to do. A quick summary for those who missed it,... He confirmed the worst of what we all believed. RedBull GmbH will not be spending money to advertise this team an/or connect it to the local sports landscape. He explained that there was no pile of money coming from Austria and that RBNY promotion was being done on a shoestring. More hustle - less cash. You won't see a Cosmos - style story in the Times Magazine section - that requires money. You won't hear a Cosmos style interview on Boomer and Carton - that requires money as well. They are constantly meeting with media outlets but they're merely asking. They don't have the checkbook out He further explained that those RedBull Henry billboards contain no explicit reference to the team because they are RedBull beverage ads. RedBull GmbH will advertise the beverage and the brand, but apparently not the ball club. He stopped just - JUST - short of saying the team was an ad for the beverage. But then again, he sort of went there. So as we speak about "fixing the Red Bulls off the field" remember that we're not throwing around much more money than a small market team. Guerilla tactics and hard work seemed to be the direction he was going. Out of necessity - because the money ain't coming.
I can think of better ways of getting the name out on the cheap. I don't see anything about the Redbulls in my area and like he said the majority of the fans come from NJ.
Question from Chicago. I thought about starting a new topic about this, but figured I would just get flamed for it. So this forum seemed close enough. I don't know much about the NY sporting scene, but I often hear from afar that NYRB doesn't get better attendance because its such a pain to get to RBA from NYC. My question is this - there's a lot of people in NJ, more than enough I would think to support a MLS franchise, why don't all the people in Newark, Jersey City, etc sell out games at such a fantastic stadium? If my assumptions are incorrect, please feel free to set me straight. I'm not writing as a troll, but as a someone who wants to see MLS succeed. Thanks.
Personally for me, since i live in the nyc metro area (north bergen, nj) getting to the arena isnt that difficult. I take bus to journal sq and form there the path train to newark/harrison. The path train is available in nyc. What keeps people away, in my opinion, from this team is a legacy of nonstop losing/mediocrity and questionable front office decisions. NYC is a place that loves a winner and this franchise has not been a winner since the day it was founded. To this day the MetroBulls have never won 1 single major trophy (no MLS Cup, no SS, no USOC, no CCL) In addition to that losing history, many people were turned off or angered by the Red Bull takeover of the club and the "erasing" of the Metro identity. In one of the biggest media markets in the nation, the Red Bulls soccer team barely registers as a blip getting close to zero coverage on the local tv news and only a few articles in the newspaper. Most people in this area know about the Jets, Giants, Yankees, Rangers, Knicks even if they aren't sports fans--but there are many people walking the streets who still don't even have a clue that there is a soccer team in the nyc metro area. Basically the only people following the team has are the hardcore. It seems that whether it was under Metro back then or presently under Red Bull the front office for the franchise has never quite known what it is doing. There have been too many decisions that have not worked out, not enough marketing dollars have been spent, and too many high profile players that never worked out here in NYC (Tab and Reyna to name just two). In addition there have been too many former MetroBull players that found success elsewhere in MLS as soon as they left the MetroBulls. Some people believe the franchise is snakebit and refer to the "curse of caricola." Fans are hoping that the Backe/Soler pairing as coach/GM will finally turn around years of losing. Not all has been bad--we are happy for the players that first played here and became big such as Tim Howard, the fans are hardcore, and we always have fond memories of fan favorites such as Wolyniec, Mathis, and Savarese--but that having been said fans of this club have gone through a lot over the years.
The reasons we don't sell out are multiple. Some quick hits. 1. Chris Heck and the current management/ownership group are trying to run the team like an NBA franchise with an already existing fan base. Instead of communicating properly with the already existing fans and treating them with respect they have been out to make as much $$$ as possible. Their tactics include 30-50% price increases for many season ticket holders 2 seasons in a row, renewal scare tactics such as a 2-week renewal window, bogus season ticket holder "gifts" like giving you 20% off everything in the fan shop and then marking up prices in the fan shop 20%. 2. There are no connections and very few efforts being made to engage the local soccer community and or local businesses. In fact some fan favorite local businesses (such as the Taco Truck) have been driven away from the grounds of Red Bull Arena. 3. Commute: The PATH ride to the stadium from NYC is great. The PATH ride back is a NIGHTMARE. Takes 2-3 times as long and the Harrison PATH station is way to small to handle the traffic. Progress is being made (we're told anyway) in renovating that PATH station. Traffic around the Arena is nothing short of a nightmare also. Roads, on ramps, highways just can't handle that volume. There is also very little parking that is close to the stadium which is a nuissance. 4. Concessions: Have been a problem from day one. Not a HUGE deal, but a families expereince at something as mundane as concessions should be a quick and easy one. When it's not they are less likely to return. 5. The NY sports market is saturated and it's tough to get a foothold in terms of news coverage etc. when you battle the nets, knicks, rangers, devils, jets, giants, mets, and yankees. Hence why ownership's attention to the ALREADY existing fan base should be stronger. THEY are your advertising. THEY are the people brining new fans to the game. In short, the stadium is beautiful and the game day atmosphere is actuall really good, but management doesn't have a clue about the fans, community, and/or the sport in general.
@ Tiger and koko So if I can summarize, NYRB would be probably be MUCH bigger if they have won more and their ownership were as fan-friendly as they are in places like the NW and KC. Plus the stadium isn't in the most ideal location. All that makes sense. It reads like a manual on how NOT to run a sports team in the US.
Pretty much what Tiger said. I am from NJ and I like to drive to the games. I could jump on a train like I do for the Devils games, but don't. All the big games at Giants Stadium sell out. Soccer is huge here. No reason for us not to be doing better except for the reasons above and people just not caring for the product on the field.
I don't believe location of the stadium plays a part. It's just outside of Newark and about a mile an a half from the Prudential Center, where the Devils play. For being a "NY" team, yeah, the location isn't so good. One thing I never liked is that they dropped NJ from the name long ago.
Winning and Ownership/Management. The location isn't as big a deal. Traffic/rail isn't ABYSMAL and has slowly been getting better and will only continue to get better. The area that the stadium was built in has real potential if/when the economy turns around. However, I wouldn't put it past the current ownership/management to screw all that up somehow.
So to carry on the BigSoccer tradition of taking threads off-topic, what kind of support do the Devils enjoy? I'm not a NHL fan, so have no clue, but since they do attempt to embrace the Jersey side, do they enjoy alot of support from NJ?
Announced attendance for the Devils is about 85% capacity. The Red Bull by contrast are currently at 65%. And that's only announced. There is another thread here which tracks acutual butts in seats and I think we have that guesstimate at about 12,000 people per game. Read this: http://www.sbnation.com/soccer/2012/6/4/3061648/mls-attendance-record-pace The most notable decline belongs to the New York Red Bulls, who are down about 12 percent from last year's pace to 15,823. That's nearly 24 percent off last year's final numbers, would be by far their worst attendance average since moving into Red Bull Arena in 2010 and would be their fourth lowest attendance figure during their 17-year history. All this despite getting off to one of their best starts in franchise history. So Ownership/Management has really got an issue on their hands if these trends continue. Chris Heck can spit any word vomit he wants, but the numbers (up to this point) don't lie. Something they are doing is wrong and I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility to consider the points brought up by the fans on this board are legit.
They're doing so well at the box office that the NHL is looking to take them over (and this is for a team that has been run very well on the field, um, rink).
I can't argue with anything you are writing here. If you built a stadium in a less than ideal location, there's not much you can do now (Chicago Fire, FC Dallas for instance). However, they way you choose to market your team, how you treat your supporters/fans, and the product you put on the field you can control. There's no reason that all of the teams in MLS shouldn't be fan-friendly.
Some interesting points in this thread. I covered some points here in my review of my trip to RBA: http://****************************...n-english-exploration-of-major-league-soccer/ I couldn't believe the way that you walk through a barren area from Harrison PATH to RBA. I would have thought this would be car parking, entertainment, something! Has this changed since I last visited?