What a ridiculous statement. The skill part can be debated. But, how is it that you know he doesn't bring leadership to the team? Everything I've heard and read about him is that he is most definitely the team leader and players, in general, look up to him. You don't like him, fine. His skill is, at least, on par with the rest of the team. Maybe, he's lost a step or two. But, don't let your animosity of him cloud your judgment of him. I'm sure Hudson and the players on the team will all disagree with you.
How Quick They Forget! United20 said: "He definitely is not the same player he used be, and does not bring leadership or even skill to the team." Well, I guess you spent all last season at the hotdog stand; you evidentlf failed to watch the team and its leading scorer last season! Inthenet
First, enough with the personal insults. They are not welcome here. Second, if you're going to call Etch our leading scorer last season you should acknowledge how shameful the team was last year when it came to scoring. Or have you forgotten how infrequently we scored? Etch had a paltry 14 points for the entire season (3 goals, 8 assists). Convey was one point behind him with 5 goals and 3 assists. These were our two highest scorers last season and those numbers are absolutely pathetic! Being the leading scorer for the 2002 DC United team was hardly something to brag about. In fact, that slogan applied to anyone on that team sounds hollow and ridiculous.
Hey Knave: What United20 said was a "personal insult" to me and to the entire D.C. United Team. It should have been to you as well. Go back and read my post! Etch was the leading scorer, as you say as well, 1 point above Convey. Granted they had a very bad season last, but unlike you and United20, I and others know what "Etch" is capable of and what he has brought to the team. THAT IS WHY HE IS STILL TEAM CAPTAIN. Have you watched the man play; or are you one of the Wanna Be guys that want to remake D.C. United into something it is not? Yeah, everybody wants D.C. to get better, but flushing their top talent is not something they will do, expecially the team captain. That is not what Coach Hudson will do, because he knows what "Etch" can do, as we all know, at least those of us that watch the team! BTW...gonna threaten every post I make just because you disagree?
I think that athough Marco did loose something from the first couple of years, this quoted statement is just plain IGNORANT. There hve been many recent articles where Hudson and many other players praise Marco because of his leadership. Bobby convay even said that he is the soccer player he admires the most, and that Etch takes him to a side, and teaches him what he knows. Convey always asks to be pairedwith Marco, and it has been like that from the beginning. Marco is a true captain, that means that overall he is the best influence on the team both on and off the field. I do admit that he is not the player he was, he still is above the level of play ofmany ML players, and we could use his experience. It is funny how when the MLS started , Marco was the biggest thing here, and now most people are critisizing! who do u think youth players on youth DC united teams larn from. Marco. Marco still has a couple of seasons left in him, and if instead of critisizing , w showed support in him, and the wole team, the team would rspond much better!
Um, this goes to all the people that think somehow our comments on Bigsoccer.com about players "bring them down." Have you ever been to RFK during a United game? At least half of the people posting on this board, if not more, are part of one of the fan groups that stand and cheer for the full 90 (or 100). I somehow fail to see that the team doesn't feel that we support them. Unfortunately, the team has not responded for the last few years despite having such partisan and loud support... If you don't like your favorite player being criticized, especially when done with fair comments rather than off-the-cuff remarks, then I highly recommend you don't read such threads. I've read some very disparaging comments about my favorite MLS player that have nothing to do with his on-the-pitch actions and everything to do with his worth as a human being. Get used to it! And finally, get your facts straight please the Team's Leading Scorer can only be the player that scores the most GOALS! And that was a tie last season between Curtis and Convey with 5 each, followed by Nelsen with 4, Moreno, Quaranta and Etch all had 3... I know that MLS keeps bizarre stats but according to my dictionary to score means to have the ball bounce off your body and into the goal. It does not mean to bounce the ball off someone else and from their into the back of the net...
I am new to the boards, so I make the following generalization with caution: People seem to assess players merely as "better" and "worse" without evaluating the player's strengths, weaknesses, or style of play. I posted earlier saying I felt that MAE needed to have more players supporting him off of the ball. He is a brilliant passer and is at his best sending people in. Last season the players surrounding him did not provide him with many opportunities to penetrate with a pass. Whether or not someone feels that another team's midfield or attacking players are "better" or "worse" than those fielded by DCU last season does not answer the question as to whether their players were more active off of the ball and able to get into the attack. For example, Roy Lassiter is a pretty one dimensional forward, but he worked very well with MAE because he was constantly creating space behind the defense and then looking for a through ball or a ball over the top from MAE to exploit it. Moreno, when healthy, did the same. Ali Curtis does it as well, but not as effectively. In DCU's "glory years" Bruce Arena surrounded MAE with players who looked to go forward and did so very quickly in transition. One person compared MAE's performance last season to Valderrama's. I would venture that MAE would have performed rather well if he had Carrieri, Spencer, and other healthy players to put in. My point is that some "great" players will simply not complement each other well. You need to assess a player's strengths, weaknesses and style of play. I believe that DCU's current roster, if it remains healthy ("knock, knock"), will provide a better opportunity to determine whether MAE is still the player he was. Players like Kovalenko, Olsen, Convey, and others are very active off of the ball and love to get into the attack.
“Hudson appeared perplexed: "I don't know why this happens. (Etcheverry) has trained very hard, he has done everything I have asked of him, but he has to be in better shape and he needs to get results.” I stand by my post earlier and hope Hudson has the guts to sit down Etcheverry if he doesn’t produce. MLS has gotten much faster and Etcheveryy has gotten much slower. To me he runs like he is flatfooted out there. He can’t create space anymore or scare anyone with his dribble. He can’t be the main conduit from the back line to the forwards anymore. I would much rather see him as a safety value for Convey, Olson or Dema when they get in trouble and then Etcheverry does a quick pass though to a streaking forward. The key is quick pass (sort of like what El Pipe is so dangerous for). I feel for the other poster who said he felt like a traitor for turning on Etch as 4 or 5 years ago he was the heart of this team. Now he is becoming more and more of a liability on the field. - The Far Side
There are knowledgeable fans out there that recognized what qualifies for a leading scorer. Diablot69 & IntheNet, as much as I respect you guys for supporting DC (IntheNet - does it say you support DC "if they win"?...hm), Etch has lost his cool consistently on the field for the last 2 years. Real leaders contribute on the field, and yes, off the field in practice. But, clearly Etch has not done the first of the two. Do you guys really believe Etch will be in DC next year if he and the team produces like the last 2 years? I don't. This is make-it or break-it year.
Etch's best days are behind him. It's perhaps unfair to judge what may be wrong with him this season, but judging from last, I'd agree with the usual criticisms: he's slow, slows the attack, and doesn't even pretend to play defense anymore. It's not much of a defense to say that Etch would have had better numbers if he had better players around him. That would be generally true for everyone. I think Tron is on to the real problem: his style of play does not mesh with the majority of his team mates. When Moreno was on the field, he was the only DC player Etch could see. Maybe Marco was trying to help his buddy out of his scoring drought. Without Moreno, Etch tended to hold the ball looking for options, usually getting himself into trouble. It seems that the players around Marco are looking for quick combination play, or they expect him to send the ball wide to be carried by the wing. Meanwhile, he's looking for the 'one killer pass', for which only Curtis was tailor made. Marco can still contribute, but he needs to adapt. Even so, I don't think he has, or will regain, the athleticism to be the sole creative force in midfield.
Whereas you just say cut the captain regardless of everything he has done for this team. As for him losing his cool too many times; I'd rather my captain go down swinging instead of taking it laying down like so many players on the team did. At the very minimum, recant your statement that Marco offers no skill or leadership. Show, at least, an ounce of respect for a player who clearly has earned it.
I think that was a wel though out statement boydreilly!!!!!!! No matter what definition any person has about what SCORING is, it means nothing on MLS. twopoints for a goal, one for an assist, sort of like hockey. Those are the rules and no matter wat you do, they wont change just because someone doenst agree with it. It wa pathetic, it is true to have etch as a leading scorer last year with so few goals, but the rules are the rules. A player should get credit for an assist for without an assist there would be no goal. I am not really fond of etcheverry , but i can understand respecting him for wha he is and what he has done for the club. I think we should see how this season, or at least part of it goes, and then decide what to do with etch.
I think it's safe to say we all love Etch and remember his glory years fondly. That said, it's hard to escape the feeling the past few seasons that he has at times become a liability. Convey has shown flashes of brilliance and I'm convinced that if he could be given enough time to adapt to the central mid role he would flourish there. Now would be the perfect time to start, with Marco available to lend his wisdom. At the very least he should not be involved in set pieces anymore. His free kicks and corners last year, with a few exceptions, were often downright painful to watch.
Starting the Attack I do not have a big problem with Etch's holding style after we are already facing a set defense in our attacking third. At that point, the urgency has disipated and we're simply looking to move the ball around until someone can break down the defense. This is very hard to do and usually doesn't result in a good scoring opportunity, so having the ball at Etch's feet is perfectly acceptable. But when we first get the ball, the opposing defense is seldom set, and is very often caught with numbers forward. This is when we need to quickly move the ball into the attacking third and create chances against an unsettled defense. We need to attack their defense before their midfielders can help defend. Attack while their midfielders are pushing forward, and get behind them. While simply booting the ball upfield to the forwards is one way to accomplish this, it is not my preferred method of counter-attacking. With guys like Convey, Olsen and Reyes, we have the quick passing ability to fly the ball up either flank via short passes and fast dribbling (particularly Reyes and Convey). This allows for a controlled attack with multiple attackers against an unsettled and often undermanned defense. These are exactly the type of quick strikes that we failed to take advantage of for the past few seasons. When we get the ball, and someone passes to Etch, he needs to immediately look to the streaking midfielders to play the ball towards goal. This is exactly how many of the top teams in MLS and the world score. Looking at the old Chicago Fire attack, they scored a ton of goals by winning the ball in midfield and then instituting this same quick, short passing game to push the ball and midfielders forward before the defense was set. Inevitably, they would find a gap in the defense and get a good shot opportunity--and their midfielders took the shots. Nowak obviously was good at this, but so was Dema. That's how he scored most of his goals, by a quick passing game passing the opponent's midfield while the forwards pressed the back line closer towards goal. This allowed Dema to be behind their midfield and in front of their defenders with space to take a shot. Then the quick passing game would get him the ball just outside of the penalty box in a great position to take a shot. If Hudson is going to use his Miami Fusion system of a 352 with midfielders who are comfortable releasing into the forward line, he needs to utilize Convey, Olsen and Dema in this same way. Nelsen and Etch need to be instructed to be sure to start the offense quickly without dribbling the ball unless absolutely necessary. Let the ball do the work. Then when our counter-attack has stalled--and Etch finally gets into the attacking third--he can have free reign to hold the ball in search of that killer pass. But until then, he needs to let the rest of the team play to their abilities. In the case of Convey, Olsen, Dema, Stewart, Santino and Esky, that means allowing the "fast-break" type of short passing counter-attacks. -Tron
I'm not a big fan of Marco at this point in his career, but there is a chance that with Jaime gone, he might actually look to involve everyone in the offense more. I think it is simplistic to say he only looked for Jaime, esp. since Jaime missed so many games the last couple years, but not having a clear "go to" guy might open his eyes to doing just what many posters have said. That is getting rid of the ball quickly, using some width, and keeping pressure on the defense when DCU causes a turnover by making quick decisions. A striker like Jaime in his prime made it worthwhile to hold the ball and wait. Not sure if we have that kind of single firepower, but we might have more depth. Let's hope.
Or there's a chance he may spend his time on the field whining to referees about fouls that don't exist. See picture in link below. http://soccernet.espn.go.com/feature?id=260685&cc=5901
Well put Tron, I hope that the style of play that you described happens this year. I had thought that by having Ray become coach we would of seen this style of play last year but instead the ball was constantly plodded though the middle by the feet of Etcheverry or worce Richie Williams. As for the photo of Etch attached by ds39heon, I'm afraid that is going to my main image of Etch instad of the play that once made him one of the best players in MLS - The Far Side
DigitalTron: Just a thought: if Etch is benched and Convey and Stewart are selected a Center starters, what is going to happen at those times ahead if both Convey & Stewart have to leave D.C. to practice/play on U.S. Men's National Tea? Am I mistaken about this coming absence?. Or to ask the question another way, since Etch will probably cover Convey and Stewart absences... shouldn't he be starter anyway? Any idea how the coach is planning to handle sudden departures? I think one way or another, Etch needs to start and nothing should change his Captain authority...the rebuilding of D.C. combined with the U.S. Men's National Team may alter the stars to give Marco one more year of starter status at D.C. IntheNet
Good points all. Here's my opinion on them. Stewart, one of the all-time great USMNT players, is not going to receive many more call-ups. By 2006 he'll likely be too old for the World Cup team, so Arena will look elsewhere. Between now and 2006, Arena will likely be auditioning as many young players as possible. When we make drives for meaningful competitions--like the Confederation's Cup--I suspect Arena will use those occasions to mesh his young players with the veterans that are expected to be in their primes for 2006. Stewart might see some call ups now and again to provide wisdom and inject some scoring punch for key games, but I wouldn't expect him to get many more callups, and I wouldn't expect him to get another "look." Arena knows what Stewart brings to the table, and as long as he keeps defying the age curve, he should get a few call-ups just like Preki did last year. Convey should get a lot more callups, but I don't expect him to get called in every time. Arena has been very good about not overtaxing any single MLS squad. So, I wouldn't expect to see Convey, Olsen and Santino/Dema/Stewart all 3 in camp at the same time. Two at a time, sure, but probably not 3 at a time. I don't see Etch as a replacement for Convey at all though. With the trade of Justin Mapp, DC United no longer has a player who can adequately play left midfield in a 352 if Convey isn't available. That's a big hole in our lineup, so I don't really see Hudson giving Convey a chance in the middle unless we play a 442. In that setup he could put someone like Reyes at left back and give him the whole left side. Unlike most people on this board, I don't expect Olsen to start on the left except in an emergency. I think Etch should play, but I think it would be best for the team if he adjusts to start the attack instantly via quick passes. Once our initial attack stalls and we're facing a set defense, then Etch can revert back to his traditional role. That's just my opinion, but the recent practice showed exactly the type of attacks I had been mentioning, so perhaps the team is concentrating on a quick transition from defense to offense via fast short passes through midfield flying the ball into attack. Etch bleeds black and red, if he realizes that this helps United, I'm confident he'll adjust his game accordingly. But it's up to the coaching staff to make that clear. -Tron
please be a little more respectful with other people's opinion, and elaborate on what you meant by that remark! I am stating what i think, not what you or anyone else should think.