Eric Wynalda's "Howard Beale moment": FSC employees rant against MLS at the NSCAA Convention

Not all of them, but many of them, especially if they have no family ties to the country in question.

I didn't mean to suggest you were, I was just pointing out that if your options are limited to the American soccer pyramid then your best choice for development is going to be MLS, regardless of opinion of their contract rules.

Not the only option, but largely the only realistic one for most of our prospects. This seems to be backed up by the fact that a majority of those prospects end up in MLS. Many of those who don't immediately go to MLS end up there after bouncing around for a while internationally (Greg Dalby. Lee Nguyen, etc.).

 

love it when jasonma gets proven wrong

time to leave this thread, spent too much time arguing with trolls

 

I'm sorry, could you show me where that was again ? I must have missed it ...

 

Yeah, it kind of sucks when you realize your ideas really don't have a basis in reality doesn't it. Thanks for stopping by, feel free to come back when you've had some time to really think about the issues that face MLS and American players and that there are no simple solutions.

 

Are you confusing EU labor laws where there is a fundamental right to movement of labor with the legitimate restrictions on non-EU immigrants? Because they be different.

 

This response you explained where you're coming from a little more, and I do agree with some of what you said. I'm not referring to most prospects here. In general, MLS is great for the large majority of all our prospects. I'm referring to the creme of the crop, legit NT prospects, or current participants, who do have interest from larger clubs abroad which offer better training, coaching and higher competition.

But as I said in a previous post, I do think it's changing and that the best prospects or current NT players who want to move on for development purposes are starting to be allowed to, and that's probably in part to Jurgen making it clear to MLS that at a certain point NT players/prospects are ready for another challenge, another level, and preventing them from doing that can hurt their development, and by extent the NT.

A problem I see if if theoretically, you have a 19 yr old who could go to Europe, but might struggle, and for the time being MLS is the better option, but the only offers he gets are for 4 years, and nothing less with more leeway. Say that kid puts in two good seasons with MLS and foreign clubs pick up their interest and want him, and the kid who at 19 wanted to go to Europe and was on the cusp, is now ready for the jump at 21/22, but his team and/or MLS says no until he has the option to leave for free at 23/24.

From a business/MLS/club point of view, they have every right to do that. But from the players point of view, if he doesn't leave until 23/24, most of his key later development years have passed. Both sides have reasons for their point of view, and both sides are looking out for their own interests, I get that. I get MLS wants to keep top young Americans here to promote the product and it's better for fans. But if a guy really is going to turn into a full NTer or a "star" in his mid 20's, he's going to leave one way or another most of the time for the challenge and to better himself, and if MLS were to let guys walk for free, instead of cashing in, that's actually worse business wise.

I don't see the next wave of stars for MLS being top Americans. That won't happen for awhile imo. The best Americans will play abroad. Landon is the exception. IMO, the next wave of stars will be from South America, as Seattle has done, or by getting Euro DP's younger and younger as time goes on, as in getting a Becks/Keane/Henry/Frings a couple years younger.

 

But how many cream of the crop/legit national team prospects reach that level these days without already being attached to a MLS team? As I pointed out, the average number of youth National team appearances for the last set of first round draft picks is less than 2. The top quality guys are getting to that level by being signed at a younger age by MLS teams, either through scouting or the MLS academies. You rarely have a case now like Donovan who came of playing age while unaffiliatted with a MLS team.

 

There's always a price point where MLS will sell. That seems to be missing from the discussion from this evening. Four year contract = no problem if you're really good enough to get the contract sold. But MLS will weigh your total value - not just performance on the field - when deciding what sort of transfer fee is worthwhile to it.

 

Some are here, as in guys like Kitchen, Salgado, Gil, Valentin, Villareal, and aside from Salgado I'd say MLS has been good for them. What will be interesting is how their clubs handle offers/opportunities when they come, and Gil(Arsenal) and Kitchen(Anderlecht) turned down Euro opportunities for MLS. Will they be allowed to leave when opportunities come? Salgado is in a poor situation, and Van rejected offers to buy and loan, which made matters worse. RSL seems very willing to let Gil go when he sees an offer he likes, as they knew his ambitions before hand.

Others had offers rejected, and some of them were finally sold or are still waiting and probably should have moved on earlier, as in Ream, Kljestan, John, Gonzalez, Shea, Agudelo(good place now, but had multiple offers to buy/loan rejected).

But many of the other NT prospects skipped MLS, and while most, not all but most have ancestory elsewhere to help, MLS would have been better off if they played here for 2-3 years, were sold for cash and then moved on. Guys like Corona, Bijev, Doyle, Gatt, Lichaj, Pelosi, Luna, Cunningham, Jeffrey, could have helped MLS clubs, a few maybe not as they're still prospects, but having those guys in the league would have helped, and the clubs/MLS would have most likely made some money off them when the did move on. Many future NT prospects will be affiliated with MLS as they come up through the academies, but actually signing with the clubs is another question. We need these guys to stay at some point in the future, and make money off them when they're 20, 21, 22. Not really a loss in talent, as they weren't in MLS to begin with.

 

Players will be sold if there is a reasonable offer.

 

No not really since MLS overvalues players and want too much $ for them. Case in point the numerous bids rejected for players like Ream, Agudelo, Salgado, and Pappa

 

I'm all in favor of MLS not being a doormat to big Euro clubs, rather than selling at the first bid. The league doesn't need to be starstruck just because a big Euro club comes calling.

 

Maybe if those bids were more reasonable, the players would've been sold.

 

Ream? You mean the Tim Ream who went to Bolton?

I'm confused because you also keep mentioning a "DaMarcus Beasley." The only DaMarcus Beasley I know played in the Champions League with PSV.

Or maybe that means you think teams should take the very first offer that comes in for a player. "Oh, Wayne Rooney's interested in moving to the Galaxy? But you're only offering $500 and a box of Hong Myung-Bo jerseys? Well, OK."

Still waiting for you to articulate "Wynalda's ideas." As I recall, most of the thread was about the idea of fans showing up in the tens of thousands to see Chicago play Toronto in February.

 

How much of this do you really believe is about the contract status though, Jond ?

The "creme de la creme" theoretically is above the MLS development curve anyway right now. The league is vastly improving and in some instances might fit the needs (guys like Rowe for instance ... just using as an example) but for the most part aren't going to. These guys are heading to Europe/down South regardless because that's their level either real or perceived. That 4yr standard contract doesn't have crap to do with it.

As the league closes the gap (which it is doing) I think this will be much more of a point of contention.

 

As far as MLS selling players goes...MLS has always sold players when they got a good offer. I can do this by positions. They sold Bradley and Toja and Arguez and Convey and Beasley and Adu and Dempsey. They sold Pickens and Guzan and Howard. They sold McBride and Altidore and Johnson and John.

I'll let someone else pick up on defenders. If someone wants to add some mids or keepers or forwards, feel free.

To my knowledge, the list of MLSers who were held captive against their will begins and ends arguably with Shalrie Joseph. Celtic offered a laughable $1M for him.

I'm a huge DC United fan. I hope that the keep Bill Hamid and Andy Najar because I want my team to win things. I can't fathom an LA fan who doesn't want Gonzalez and Donovan around.

 

Those two statements completely contradict each other.

 

MLS sold Danny Szetela too. Just remembered him due to the post below.

I follow the Yanks Abroad forum diligently, and I don't agree. At all. The returns are mixed for such players. Marcus Tracy, anyone? Gale Agbossomonde (or however it's spelled.) And on and on.

As with most things in life, it depends.

 

A necro-thread whose revival is solely one guy making it all about himself.