English players Dual Nationality thread #2

Discussion in 'England' started by roverman, Sep 26, 2020.

  1. Jenks

    Jenks Member+

    Feb 16, 2013
    Club:
    --other--
    The alternative is to fly halfway across the world to cap-tie yourself to a nation that you have next to no connection to, that you very likely would not ideally want to play for throughout your entire career.

    Which holding midfielder would you have brought into the squad replace JWP ahead of Bellingham?
     
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  2. Port Vale Fan

    Port Vale Fan Member

    May 30, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Bellingham was next in line after playing well for the under 21s.

    Replacements very often come from the under 21s.

    The kid has been playing for Birmingham before he went to Germany, it’s a different situation to Musah.
     
  3. markdavies17

    markdavies17 Member

    Oct 28, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I don’t disagree, that Bellingham has impressed more, but like you say he has a full professional season under his belt and is at a better team, more suited to putting youngsters like him into the team, due to the fact they’re better.

    Also, while it maybe is better advised to concentrate on Bellingham’s development, what does this cap do for him, if he’s more than likely to be in the u21 team if everyone is fit, for next window and perhaps the ones after that?

    and as you said and I agree with, England will lose more players to dual nationality, that’s reality. Will also keep some however
     
  4. markdavies17

    markdavies17 Member

    Oct 28, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    i don’t particularly think there was a need, squad wise, for a replacement in that position. AM-N could’ve filled in, if necessary and he didn’t even use the 2 DM’s in the squad. I think the FA/Southgate WANTED to call him up for PR reasons and maybe in response to Musah going with the USA. Might sound far fetched, but it’s not beyond the FA
     
  5. ChristianSur

    ChristianSur Member+

    May 5, 2015
    Club:
    Sheffield Wednesday FC
    Honestly I think you're massively overcomplicating things. They've called up a hugely talented 17-year-old who already has a case for being in on merit and is only likely to get better. It doesn't require a conspiracy theory to explain that.
     
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  6. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
    First time in years we have a manager trusting youth and people still moan
     
  7. Port Vale Fan

    Port Vale Fan Member

    May 30, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Hey Mark, I follow your train of thought now.

    There’s good judges of players on here and I think they’d back me up saying that the two best orthodox central midfielders under 18 are Musah and Bellingham.

    In fact I think the best two since the Gerrard, Scholes, Hargreaves and Lampard era.

    Note: I don’t class Mount, Foden or Maddison as centre mids.
     
  8. markdavies17

    markdavies17 Member

    Oct 28, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    That’s fair enough & I respect your opinion, but if you look at the history of Southgate and the FA, it’s filled with PR statements. What I’m basically saying is, Bellingham getting a cap at 17, is a PR statement, not that he isn’t talented enough or whatever
     
  9. markdavies17

    markdavies17 Member

    Oct 28, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    As far as I see, it’s not people, it’s just me so far. Relax. I have my opinion on this topic, which you don’t agree on, the same way I don’t agree with your near obsession & sense of “ownership” with dual nationals. I have no problem with Southgate playing youth, but do it because they actually help to improve the team & can meaningfully contribute. And not simply go back down to the u21’s next time round
     
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  10. markdavies17

    markdavies17 Member

    Oct 28, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    You wouldn’t put Azeez in that category then?
     
  11. Port Vale Fan

    Port Vale Fan Member

    May 30, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Azeez dovetails Musah beautifully in a two and I love watching them together, but I have doubts he will get any game time this season.

    I’d have thrown him in by now at Arsenal but he hasn’t even got on the bench yet.

    So I just can’t make that judgement sorry mate, I know he played well in the league trophy but there’s lots of competition at Arsenal.

    Youth games are youth games of course.
     
  12. markdavies17

    markdavies17 Member

    Oct 28, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    ah, I understand now. I thought you meant the best u18 central midfielders in general. But you’re referring to the u18 central midfielders that are getting first team minutes also?
     
  13. Port Vale Fan

    Port Vale Fan Member

    May 30, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    In general the best midfielders get first team minutes?
     
  14. ADM99

    ADM99 Member+

    Apr 28, 2019
    #214 ADM99, Nov 15, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2020
    On the subject of midfielders, just checked the training camp squads for this week & Southampton's Kgagelo Chauke is a late replacement for Aaron Ramsey (who was moved up to the U19s) in the U18 squad.

    Had previously been reported that he was open to playing for South Africa.

     
  15. Jenks

    Jenks Member+

    Feb 16, 2013
    Club:
    --other--
    I'm not sure that an elaborate Musah-wooing plot is a more reasonable explanation than JWP being replaced by someone who is already at St. Georges Park and playing in his position at a high level in the Bundesliga and the Champions League.
     
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  16. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
    Saka now with us for 3 years at least
     
  17. markdavies17

    markdavies17 Member

    Oct 28, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    This is true. But it obviously depends on their individual club dynamics, but this is largely true and I agree with it
     
  18. markdavies17

    markdavies17 Member

    Oct 28, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    :):)
    I didn’t say it was a more reasonable explanation, I just said that the good PR For Southgate & FA was an influence in him being called up, 100%. I’m sure him having the #17 shirt also, was just a happy coincidence
     
  19. JTay

    JTay Member

    England
    Apr 27, 2019
  20. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
  21. Marcho Gamgee

    Marcho Gamgee Member+

    England
    Apr 25, 2015
    Somewhere in English Arrogance land
    Club:
    Manchester City FC
    That’s not what the tweet was referring to mate. It’s referring he will be back with England.
     
  22. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
    I thought it meant he was sticking with usa and the poster said he was happy with musiala
     
  23. Gaz811

    Gaz811 Member+

    Everton FC
    England
    Oct 15, 2018
    TheSercetScout who said Musah will be back. Follows England at all ages levels. So he definitely means he'll be back for England. Weather hes right is another matter.
     
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  24. ChristianSur

    ChristianSur Member+

    May 5, 2015
    Club:
    Sheffield Wednesday FC
    The comments coming out of the American camp sound hopeful rather than confident, and Musah himself hasn't posted anything about the call-up on his fairly active Instagram page. I don't think he's remotely decided yet.
     
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  25. MrSnrub

    MrSnrub Member+

    Oct 7, 2018
    The US have a good track record at keeping people they get to play for them, i'd be surprised if he switched back after playing at senior level.

    To get someone like Dest for example to turn down the Netherlands for them, they must be able to sell their vision extremely well.
     

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