England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) Pre-Match Thread [R]

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Bad attitude man. Talking the other team down isn't clever if the game is still to be played. Nobody denies the quality of of them Lampards and Rooneys but someone invented football as teamplay and we do not elect World Cup winners by examining the transfer earnings or the FIFA rankings. Thank God!

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Bentley: "I believe it was the right decision for me, but the wrong decision for the team"

Why is all this selfish s**t now beginning to come out the woodwork. Carragher and Bentley. We dont need/want people like this in the team.

I'm not one of Beckham's biggest fan's, but the guy talk's as if he'd die for his country.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Are you actually reading the previous post's. "Bad attitude", what are you going on about. I have not talked your team down, in fact I agree your team has played better over the last couple of years (as a team). However you know as well as I do that there are more highly rated individuals (by proffessionals and manager alike) in England's first team than Germany's. So for your compatriot to say England have no world class players and Germany have five, is quite simply a ludicrous statement.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Schneider is too ineffective to be world class. Mertesacker has to show that his form at the WC can be repeated for him to be considered as world class.

I think Löw may well have known what he was talking about when he recently said that Ballack, Frings, Klose, Lehmann and Lahm are Germany's world class players.

As to comparing these players to Gerrard, Lampard, Terry and Rooney, one can surely make a case that the German players have performed well above the English players for their respective countries. Of course, this doesn't necessarily make them better players for their clubs. For some reason more than a few of the English players who often look quite ordinary when playing for their country manage to look world class when performing for their clubs.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

To TL, karloski and all :

I invite the england players just to show us how good they are.

Over the past 2 years, and especially 16 months, germany have played much better football than england, technically and aesthetically, and have achieved much better results too. I've been watching every game of both teams so I know.

In such a scenario, how is it plausible to suggest that the english players are better, if the only objective in football is to play as a team? Football is a team sport. That is how you prove you are a good player. You play well with others.

Consider this :

In 25 years if it says that germany won euro 2008 playing wonderful football, and world cup 2010 likewise (the first is looking reasonably likely and the 2nd not out of the question at all), will they remember england's players as greats or germany's players?

For me, here is a good analogy. This explains why the english players who play for england - not the capable ones who don't get selected - are seen as they are in terms of status.

English team is a team of tom cruises.
German team is a team of tim robbinses.

One team has played much better than the other.

That's all I have to say on this. Period.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

The reason is obvious to most English fans. Innefectual managers. Wrong formations, players out of position, lack of tactical intelligence, the list goes on.

Everybody knows the Champions league has a higher class of football than the Internationals, and yet the English players mentioned,are most of the time THE star performers for their team. If you dont know how to utilise your best players properly they wont perform, it's not a chinese puzzle for f***sake.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Loew was high on drugs. Schneider is the brains of the team. Invaluable. Best touch, technique and short passing in the team. But he is the complete anti-celebrity so he is not noticed. Like a fine wine. Not noticeable.
Lahm is not world class. Mertesacker has proved for germany and bremen last seaosn that he's twice as good as metzelder.

he had hte best 1v1 challenge percentage (85%) at the world cup, and without a single booking. He carries metzelder quite a bit. He's also improved two fold since the world cup, this kid is jurgen kohler plus klaus augenthaler combined.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

You need to start handing out some forum bans to these idiots.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

I know, I know. I foolishly believed I could educate them a little, so they wouldn't go embarrassing themselves anywhere else.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

The team should be announced in a few minutes..

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

nor do we need krauts telling us they are rubbish when they obviously are not....

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

You would have to be insane to pick Rooney (or any current England forward for that matter) over Klose.

Klose has 10 world cup goals, 99 goals in the 5 past Bundesliga seasons, and in the last two Bundesliga seasons he has scored 40 goals and created over 20 for his teammates.

The shear lack of disrespect that he recieves is unbelievable. Klose is an incredible all round forward. He can finish with his head and both feet. He is fast, can dribble in tight spaces, and is a great passer.

Even if he scores another 5 goals at the next WC i doubt he will ever be mentioned amoung this generation's best forwards. Oh well.

Guys don't worry to much about the squidward propoganda machine, some of the fans in the Germany forums are also annoyed by his antics.

If I were to list the world class players Germany has it would be:

Ballack, Frings, Lahm, Klose.

I think Lehmann is a clown and should be dropped for one of the half dozen or so keepers that are both younger and better than he is.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Rooney is not really a out and out striker. He is usually behind a main striker that Klose is therefore scores less goals but instead creates them.

Talking of disrespect Rooney is mocked frequently especially on the Germany boards when he is a player that you Germans would love to have.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Agreed. He shouldn't even be considered this season. If he's too tired to go to the U21s then Euro 2008 would surely be too much for him.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

could do with him though for England with his width..

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

You may well be right. It can't be helpful if you have a manager who doesn't know how to utilize his players. As long as England doesn't have such a manager and doesn't manage to go farther than the quarter-finals of major tournaments it's difficult to prove though.

That said, IIRC Sven Göran-Eriksson was widely considered to be a pretty good manager before he failed to live up to expectations with England. When one considers this, other possibilities which might suggest itself to explain the discrepancies between the performances of English players for their club and their country are that a few English players simply don't adapt well to the international game, or that some English players are allowed to play to their strengths in their clubs because some English teams have put foreign players in key positions for which there is a lack of English players.

Another perspective is that while the Champions League may well have the better football, the mental pressure of playing in a World Cup or Euro would seem to be even higher than in the Champions League. You can win the CL every year and you don't have your entire country focused on you. Talent is of limited use when a player isn't able to utilize it properly because he lacks mental fortitude.

Mind, I don't necessarily subscribe to these alternative explanations. Putting all the blame on the manager alone would seem to go a little bit too far in exonerating the role of the players, though.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Then the rest of the world must be insane.

Klose is a better striker no doubt, Rooney though is a better alround footballer and as he is 7 years younger, his potential outweighs that of Klose.


Sorry Three lions, I'm doing it again.....

...what I meant to say was yes mein friend Klose is the best player since Maradona... nay he is clearly the best player that has ever lived. Rooney on the otherhand has the footballing ability of a blind moose with two broken legs.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Some "krauts" like the english players very well and some "krauts" cheer for three lions if they play against portugal or argentina.

I know that its easy to decline into arrogant behavior regarding the own team but i see it that way: As fancy as some people explain way their team and the players of their choice are by nature superior to any other its on the other side very interesting how lousy their excuses are, if their predictions fail. And they do fail often.

But anyway, talking about teams and players is part of the game. I got no problem if someone tries to confront me with a crappy team i am supporting. I just say that the truth comes with the final whistle. That includes both sides.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

To be honest I was not being arrogant and just playing around.

I remember Arsene Wenger responding to Sir Alex that 'we all think our wives are the best looking' and this mirrors a lot of the german posters attitudes towards England players.

Carry on the discussion.

 

Re: England vs. Germany ( Wed. Aug. 22 , 8:00p.m. ) [R]

Schneider has his qualities, certainly. I don't see him as the brains of the team though. Ballack would seem to be more influential. Schneider's biggest problem is that he doesn't score or create enough for an offensive midfielder.

Lahm wasn't playing particularly well last season for Bayern. He has always performed for Germany and at Stuttgart, though. Löw isn't the only one who thinks that Lahm is world class either. Lehmann has singled him out recently too.

As to Mertesacker, I agree that he had an outstanding World Cup and that he has performed (way) better than Metzelder there, and in the league. I don't think Metzelder should be the yardstick though. Metzelder is much too error prone and is still profiting from his strong WC in 2002. The reason why I'm reluctant to say that Mertesacker is world class, is that it has yet to be seen if he can keep his level of performance over more than one season.