England U-17 Discussions Thread #3 (2008 born)

I'm not sure how you could deduce that City u18s easily beating a Slovakian u19 team as evidence that Brexit has been good for our youth football? City also dominated Inter last week in terms of possession and territory but were soundly beaten on the break. The reason why City actually look so dominant in possession in these games is the Spainish influence of Sorinao and Guardiola so claiming it as a Brexit win might seem a little odd.

The English sides haven't been competitive in the Youth League since Brexit kicked in which is likely due to a lack of foreigners to augment our sides. City lacked cutting edge against Inter with their only foreigner scoring the goals. If this is inherently bad for English football is hard to tell, our system as whole seems to be producing many very exciting players still, although mass non-European immigration is undoubtedly playing a role in this, just look at the youth teams. I argued last week that City dominating possession like Spaniards with 10/11 English players against a top Italian academy side was very encouraging, despite the end result.

It's worth pointing out that the number of English players in the Premier League continues to decline, although again it's debateable if this will ultimately have any negative effect on our senior team. We still have many more players than we can call up playing at the highest club level in the Premier League, whilst many more English players are now trying their hands in foreign leagues.

We may be looking at the rather boring reality that Brexit has done so little to English football development, save from making us less competitve in the Youth league and the domestic scene becoming more uneven, that we can't really estimate if it has been good or bad at all.

 

Just to add a caveat about the Youth teams not doing well because we lack foreign players. Didn’t Olympiacos win last year with an entire Greek side. If they can do it, not sure why our teams can’t do the same.

 

And the year before AZ won it with an entirely Dutch team.

 

I don't know what's it like in other countries but the 4 teams that qualify for the Champions league in England often don't have the best U18 PL teams. Villa, Newcastle and Arsenal have all finished 8-12th in there respective conference before entering the comp the following year.

If Chelsea would've been in it for the last 2-3 years I think they would have competed very well for example.

 

It can and does happen but most of the best teams in the Youth League historically use foreigners to bring up their level.

Worth pointing out to that the best u19 side in England now is probably United and they're not in the competition.

 

Our best young players are more spread out across the clubs than say Netherlands or Portugal where the best will play for 3 or 4 clubs.

 

United are in the competition, just not in the main path. They go through an alternate route and provided they win those games, they'll join up with the main tournament later.

 

So the reason these English lads look so good is because of their Spanish coaching yet you say Man United are the best team at that level without the Spanish coaching.

The number of English players declining in the premier league is due to foreign managers and their selection choices - a separate issue altogether.

 

I said the reason why City are dominating games in terms of possession in the Spanish style is because their owners modelled their club on Barcelona. Fistly bringing in the people that ran Barcelona to run them, namely Ferran Soriano and Txiki Begiristain. They then built a side and footballing culture that Pep could seemlessly take over. It worked quite well for them.

United probably having the best u19 side has nothing to do with that. In terms of having real standout players City youth are at a bit of a low spot compared to recent years.

 

Anyone know why this squad wasn't announced yesterday?

 

Announced in 2 weeks

 

18th of October

 

Luca Williams-Barnett got a hat trick and assist for Spurs in a 4-3 win against Man Utd 18s this morning, really talented player.

 

Luca Williams-Barnett v Man United u18s [MOTM] https://t.co/AD5FV1di94

— 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 (@attacthespace) October 5, 2024

 

This is a strong age group with these potential pick of players> Alejandro Rodriguez, Williams-Barnett, igor tyjon, Ibragimov, mcaidoo, Howell, harry Gray, reigan Heskey, Seth ridgeon,bendito mantato, max dowman 2009 , Theo julienne, Wesley okoduwa, Jack porter, kaden braithwaite, mfuni and Finley gorman.

 

I assume you have no problem with athletes or footballers using drugs then. After all, you endorse winning.
Similarly, you never complain when someone cheats against your team? All in the game?
Which is your team?

 

Refusing to ride a foul is not cheating.

 

We obviously view sportsmanship from different angles. If I want to watch a non-contact sport I'd follow basketball. However, that isn't my cup of tea.

 

I would normally agree but in this day and age, you don’t get given anything for trying to stay on your feet. Not that I’m advocating diving but if there’s clear contact, staying on your feet doesn’t get rewarded.

 

I just want to see fair contests. Oh well.

 

Then why are you getting upset about the idea of a player getting a penalty for a foul?

 

No problem when a player is genuinely fouled but certainly not when, to use a media phrase, the contact is initiated by the forward. It is becoming a game where defenders are not allowed to tackle. Phrases like "the defender dangled a leg so the forward is entitled to make contact and go down." Do me a favour. Anyway, you have your beliefs, I have mine. I really don't see any point in continuing this conversation.

 

It's a bit of a "so what?" either way for me. Nobody should have been voting for or against Brexit based on how it would affect elite football, and I don't imagine that many people did.

 

The winger options in this age group are legitimately ridiculous - Williams-Barnett, Ngumoha, Ibragimov, Ezenwata, Mantato etc. Hope we can find room for them all. Can see Ngumoha moving up at some point this season.