England Senior National Team General Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'England' started by BarryfromEastenders, Jul 15, 2024.

  1. horrisengleton

    horrisengleton Member+

    Arsenal
    England
    Jul 18, 2023
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    We spoke about it the other week but the main question marks about Morton are defensively. He can cover ground pretty well and is actually a fair decent ball carrier so I don't think he's got any major mobility issues. He's shown sigs of being good in duels too, even if not perfect. He doesn't contest a great deal though so it's hard to tell.

    In an ideal world you'd probably want to see how he copes defensively in the PL before giving him a senior call-up, but with what Carsley values I don't think he'd be able to pass up on someone with that much buildup quality. He's everything Angel Gomes is plus way more.

    On the ball he's got most of what you'd want. Creative passing from deep, insane press resistance, looks like he has good potential as a controller too. He also has a solid eye for goal and is a decent shooter. I think there'll be plenty of PL interest this summer.
     
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  2. horrisengleton

    horrisengleton Member+

    Arsenal
    England
    Jul 18, 2023
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I'm very worried about how reliant we're going to be on Anderson for buildup quality. We'll see what next week's squad is like but I don't think Tuchel has anywhere near the same levels of appreciation for on-ball quality in deep midfield areas as Carsley. Specifically in that regard he's a bit closer to Southgate.
     
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  3. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    DM 6 type. Composed with a good passing range.
     
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  4. ht_hu96

    ht_hu96 Member+

    Middlesbrough
    England
    May 23, 2019
    To be honest, I’ve never liked the way Tuchel uses midfield, even before he became England manager. He would regularly play Marquinhos in there at PSG.
     
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  5. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    I really don’t get the logic of this discussion. Doesn’t highlight that we are likely to need four or more options in those CM roles that will likely be needed to play significant minutes at this WC.

    Ignores that Mainoo, Wharton and Henderson aren’t really suited to either role. Especially like for like in the system.

    This is the worry and it has been seen with some of Tuchel’s changes. Significant decline in the whole system when starters are replaced by options that don’t have the relevant skill sets to replicate.

    If you want to take Henderson in a ‘leadership role’ these alternative replacement roles need to be extremely solid and functional.

     
  6. Gaz811

    Gaz811 Member+

    Everton FC
    England
    Oct 15, 2018
    I know i'm biased but I'd be looking at Garner. Be ineresting to see how many midfielders he picks because bellingham gives him cover in both the 8 and the 10, James also gives him cover.Away If its between Mainoo and Henderson. I'd pick Mainoo.
     
  7. AJ123

    AJ123 Member+

    Man Utd
    England
    Feb 17, 2018
    As a side note, it was interesting that the Spanish side only had 29% possession in this game.
     
  8. horrisengleton

    horrisengleton Member+

    Arsenal
    England
    Jul 18, 2023
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Unfortunately I don't think I've seen anyone have that discussion outside of this forum. Aside from Albania away when the whole setup was just weird, I don't think many people have clocked or taken notice of how big the drop-off has been when subs have been made in-game. It's just mind boggling to me how many people are in support of Henderson going.
     
  9. Catenaccio88

    Catenaccio88 Member

    England
    Sep 23, 2023
    #20034 Catenaccio88, Mar 13, 2026
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2026
    Just watched the full Man City game over lunch. And O'Reilly was probably the worst player on the pitch and Pep probably should of subbed him at HT.
    He was at fault for the first goal and partly the second one. He also got away with gifting both Diaz a goal and Vini Jnr a fourth (if it weren't for poor finishing).

    What's telling was this was O'Reilly's first real test in a high-pressure knockout stage game and he kind of got exposed. Contrast this with Lewis Hall's performance a day earlier, having to mark Lamine Yamal. And although we still have the away leg to play at the Nou Camp. At this stage, I wouldn't pick O'Reilly for England, esp as an option who can cover at both No8 and LB.
     
  10. horrisengleton

    horrisengleton Member+

    Arsenal
    England
    Jul 18, 2023
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Screenshot 2026-03-13 at 15.19.44.png Screenshot 2026-03-13 at 15.19.18.png

    Just had a very quick glance at a Brentford fan forum and shock horror, they're making exactly the same criticisms of Henderson that have existed since, well, forever.
     
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  11. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
    I'd take o'reilly as a midfielder
     
  12. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    And he might even be made vice captain!

    And I am still fearing Tuchel will not take 26 and will copy what Deschamps has done in the past and take less than he is allowed to.
     
  13. Marcho Gamgee

    Marcho Gamgee Member+

    England
    Apr 25, 2015
    Somewhere in English Arrogance land
    Club:
    Manchester City FC
    Rooney is the only sane one there, really don’t know what Henderson can provide over any of the other midfield options other than he can shout the loudest.
     
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  14. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    #20039 BarryfromEastenders, Mar 13, 2026
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2026
    It is so strange because it is arguably the biggest issue in this squad and the logic used for picking his third and fourth CM’s is just so weak. He’s not really even explaining why fully anyway I guess.
     
  15. Catenaccio88

    Catenaccio88 Member

    England
    Sep 23, 2023
    Neville just keeps rambling on about how Rice/Anderson are un-droppable. So Tuchel might as well fill the rest of the selection with Henderson and CM's who are happy to sit on the bench and play Crazy Golf after training.
     
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  16. horrisengleton

    horrisengleton Member+

    Arsenal
    England
    Jul 18, 2023
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Yeah it's ridiculous. Especially when people like Neville (correctly) identify that England have so often gone out of tournaments due to being dominated in midfield.

    It's probably the most important area of the pitch and the team with the better midfielders wins more often than it loses. We got played off the park by Senegal last year because we played a Rice/Gallagher pivot. It'll be exactly the same when we play someone good at the World Cup if Anderson either can't play or isn't at 100%.
     
  17. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021

     
  18. Gaz811

    Gaz811 Member+

    Everton FC
    England
    Oct 15, 2018
    Pep didn't help him by playing him in midfield for a month then stcking back at lieftback for the biggest game of the season. I think Pep is geting close to his sell by date.
     
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  19. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    I would not be confident that Lewis Hall would look any different to O’Reilly if he had to play in that system at the Bernabeu.

    That system is just laughable when you look back. Even an experienced player like Donnarumma is indecisive because of the space the system gives up. Didn’t even look like he knew where he was on the first goal.

    I don’t think it is a complete coincidence that players fail to get tight in the one on ones throughout a half when you are pretty much playing 4-1-5.

    That is not to say O’Reilly isn’t admonished of blame. Second goal particularly is on him no doubt.
     
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  20. Catenaccio88

    Catenaccio88 Member

    England
    Sep 23, 2023
    #20045 Catenaccio88, Mar 13, 2026
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2026
    It's definitely Peps fault for playing him there in such an important game. Pep's always had this fetish for playing midfielders in a back four since Barcelona

    But O'Reilly's positional awareness is atrocious and he makes it too easy for opposite players get in to dangerous positions. And thats not because he's been switched from CM to LB. If anyone watched him play LB previously, its been obvious he's not a natural defender.
    That first goal really showed. He didn't even just sit on the half way line with the last man (Valverde) he just let him get goal side of him because of a lapse in concentration.

    And also his recovery speed is shocking. Can you imagine England playing a WC game with Trent and O'Reilly as fullbacks. We'd be ripped to bits against any half-decent counter-attacking team, they wouldn't even need to be that good, just have strength and pace...
    Both Livramento and Hall do seem to have far superior recovery speed than O'Reilly.

    But on the positive note. I would much rather he got found out in a last 16 tie for City (in the CL) than for England in the last 16 at the WC..
     
  21. Catenaccio88

    Catenaccio88 Member

    England
    Sep 23, 2023
    Donnarumma hesitated because he didn't want to get sent off for either handling the ball outside the box or fouling the last man

    We've all seen in the past how often the above has happened and the whole thing becomes a shit show; GK gets sent off, team goes down to ten men and an early penalty to the opposition
     
  22. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
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  23. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    I think O’Reilly has shown natural defensive instincts in previous games. He’s just misread the flight of the ball on that first goal. Thinks he can head it and then realises he’s screwed up.

    Hall and O’Reilly have question marks defensively. I don’t think there is that much between either at this point. Whoever plays there for England will have to be complemented by the wider team. With Gordon and Anderson on that side you can see more than adequate support.

    At this point I think they are both going to go the WC as the left backs.
     
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  24. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
    Hall has an advantage as he has a good relationship with Gordon on the left
     
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  25. Port Vale Fan

    Port Vale Fan Member

    May 30, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I'd love to see Lewis Hall in centre mid again, it must be 4/5 years since I've seen him there.

    That extra gift he has of beating players in deep and tricky positions and finding a pass could open up a lot of counters in tournament games.
     
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