England Senior National Team General Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'England' started by BarryfromEastenders, Dec 12, 2022.

  1. ht_hu96

    ht_hu96 Member+

    Middlesbrough
    England
    May 23, 2019
    #10076 ht_hu96, Dec 2, 2023
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2023
    Going to be honest, I don’t really think those wide forward positions are anywhere near as competitive as we make them out to be. Saka and Foden are both elite talents and bang in form, but outside of that I think we overrate our depth there. The three options that aren’t those two are Rashford, who as we’ve seen many times before is brilliant when on song, but atrocious when off it and also has a tendency to go very long periods of time out of knick. You then have Grealish who I do still like fair enough even though he hasn’t quite got going yet this season. However the final option from the last squad is Bowen, who with all due respect is a player with a limited ceiling and inferior in quality to both Gordon and Sterling.

    I generally don’t like to get as paranoid around duals as others on here, but Livramento and Gordon do seem to be receiving serious advances from countries who would be very viable choices. It would be short sighted and reckless to not do what we can to tie them down given they either upgrade the squad or in Livramento’s case, play in a position which could become an issue in 2-3 years.
     
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  2. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    The issue with Gordon and Livramento is what happens if Scotland offer a place between now and March, Southgate claims he will never promise a place to someone but we know he did that to get Rice so he might have to do the same with them.
     
  3. horrisengleton

    horrisengleton Member+

    Arsenal
    England
    Jul 18, 2023
    Valencia, Spain
    Gordon and Livramento won’t switch to Scotland just because they’re offered a place in a Euros squad. I think that’s pretty obvious.
     
  4. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    I agree with Gordon as his agent clearly shut down talk but not fully convinced Livramento won’t
     
  5. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    Tomori scored for AC Milan tonight.
     
  6. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    It is obvious to reasonable observers. We would be much more concerned about losing them if they were NOT playing well.
     
  7. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    I wouldn’t have Bowen in a squad either but the other options are very strong regardless of form. All offer distinctive skill sets that work well within a squad.
     
  8. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    Gordon discusses his England Euro 2024 ambitions at the end of this interview -

     
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  9. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
    Gordon and Livramento have zero interest in Scotland. That's pretty obvious. Scotland can want all they like. I'd like taylor swift but it's not going to happen
     
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  10. AJ123

    AJ123 Member+

    Man Utd
    England
    Feb 17, 2018
    #10085 AJ123, Dec 3, 2023
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2023
    If Rashford, Grealish and Gordon all continue on their current trajectories then Gordon will be going to the Euros.

    Livramento is a little more complicated as he has done the whole 'I'm happy to play for anyone at international level' thing. Balogun also used to say similar things. I do think Livramento has a good chance of being called up to the next squad though. I think as a left back he suits Southgate's mentality more than Lewis as he's solid defensively first and foremost. We also need to be planning for the post Walker and Trippier world at right back. Trent is unreliable defensively in that position and Reece James is very injury prone and a bit of an odd character. I think looking at pathways Livramento should be able to see a clear pathway with England.

    By the standards of international football they're hyper-competitive.

    There's Sterling, Rashford, Grealish, Foden, Gordon, Saka, Bowen, Palmer and Barnes vying for two positions. Most players have periods of good and bad form.
     
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  11. AJ123

    AJ123 Member+

    Man Utd
    England
    Feb 17, 2018
    I think Trippier deserves a bit more recognition. I think he's at world class level at the moment but playing at a club where he won't get the attention. He bossed the game against United last night.

     
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  12. Marcho Gamgee

    Marcho Gamgee Member+

    England
    Apr 25, 2015
    Somewhere in English Arrogance land
    Club:
    Manchester City FC
    I think the issue at right back is that as fireburn has said that it could and probably will be Walker and Trippiers last tournament since they are 33 and I think it’s likely they call it a day Internationally. Trent and James were the obvious choice to replace them a few years ago but they have their issues ( as stated by AJ ) so I really think there’s a serious case to get Livramento involved as soon as possible.
     
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  13. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    And Southgate has also used Maddison and Eze this year in those positions.
     
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  14. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    Trippier has said before he won’t ever call it a day but when faced with being dropped I’m sure most players would want a diginifed retirement.

    If Livramento is lost then Rico Lewis becomes next in line but he wants to become a midfielder full time then I’m not sure who.
     
  15. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
    From Livramento's perspective. It's a tough choice. Play regularly at tournaments for two sides that can potentially win them. (Us and Portugal) or play for a bang average team that qualifies for a tournament once in a blue moon
     
  16. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021



    Tottenham are monitoring Manchester City midfielder Kalvin Phillips, 28, ahead of the January transfer window. (Football Insider)
     
  17. AJ123

    AJ123 Member+

    Man Utd
    England
    Feb 17, 2018
    I’d say that Walker and Trippier are still both playing at the elite level. One or both might retire but I’d not be surprised if they’re still around at the next World Cup. I do think we need to look to the future though and Livramento is pretty clearly it.
     
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  18. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
  19. roverman

    roverman Member+

    Dec 22, 2001
    The jocks are wetting themselves over Livramento. Southgate needs to call him up in the next squad.
     
  20. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    Watkins back for Vila. Konsa also starts.
    Palmer only on the bench for Chelsea (Rumours of a slight knock.). Colwill, Gallagher and Sterling start. James suspended and Chilwell still injured.
    Trent starts for Liverpool. Jones and Elliott on the bench.
    Bowen returns from Inury to start for West Ham. Ward - Prowse also starts.
    Guehi and Johnstone start for Palace. Eze injured.
     
  21. Inter Row Z

    Inter Row Z Member

    Oldham Athletic
    England
    Mar 26, 2023
    #10096 Inter Row Z, Dec 3, 2023
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2023
    Exactly. Livramento and Gordon have both said they want to play for England, so as long as they know they're in the mix-up why would they give up the dream? Tino's performances at left back alone already place him ahead of Chilwell for me. And that ability to play both left and right is absolute gold dust for an international manager.
     
  22. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    Arsenal v Liverpool in the FA cup. Will Ramsdale even get to play that match?
     
  23. Marcho Gamgee

    Marcho Gamgee Member+

    England
    Apr 25, 2015
    Somewhere in English Arrogance land
    Club:
    Manchester City FC
    Why would they be wetting themselves? I mean he’s not a Scotland player and very unlikely to be so anytime soon.
     
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  24. MrSnrub

    MrSnrub Member+

    Oct 7, 2018
    The talk of Livramento seems a bit baffling to me, if he wasn't a duel nobody would be talking about him. He's started literally 2 premier league games since April 2022. Needs to prove an awful lot in terms of form and ability to maintain fitness before a senior call up is part of the conversation.

    Besides which his position is hardly one England particularly struggle to produce. We have top talents right through to Rico Lewis in the 04s. Seems unlikely it's a position that's going to just completely dry up going forward. Similarly for Gordon, he's having a great season and unlike Livramento deserves to be part of the conversation, but I struggle to see a situation where England wilk not be producing plenty of players of a similar or higher calibre going forward.
     
  25. Fireburn47

    Fireburn47 Member+

    West Ham United
    England
    Nov 5, 2021
    We do and we don’t in terms of top full backs. James and Trent are very talented but also have major flaws. Other than Livramento theand Lewis there is Aarons, Thomas and Hall at PL clubs. Others are at least a season or two away from the PL Unkess I am missing someone.
     
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