Ecuador en Brasil 2014

Discussion in 'Ecuador - National Team' started by barcelonista1981, Oct 16, 2013.

  1. barcelonista1981

    May 16, 2007
    GUAYAQUIL
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    You and I agree in just about everything but just from different angles, I have always said that Mexico wasnt a bad destination for our players, they get paid well, the league is somewhat competitive but most importantly they play there every weekend, they stay active and fit, but come on B9 you have to admit This World Cup showed a serious lack of depth from our team and experience, we were never able to cover key absences and bad performances, we stuck with Caicedo when we know he's been dragging ass for over a year. Montero, we all knew it was coming, but we prefer to have these players at 50-60% than an alternative, and You have nailed it when you say your club represents what you have done as an individual, but dont you think we needed a little individuality from our players? I mean it kills me, NOBOA should have scored that shot he had, Arroyo too, Montero had sooo many one on one to beat and face the keeper and lost everytime, these are things than higher level of competition, better coaches in consistency do help. Switzerland didnt have many chances to score on us, but did twice. they didnt have a superb game agaisnt Honduras but Shaquiri was on one of his days, WE NEED THAT. and our players wont have those days when the are playing in Russia, Middle East, MLS, and regarding Valencia, I'm being quite frank when I say you make a good point, I dont know wtf happened to him, being captain and expected leader really didnt fall right on him, hes a role player.
     
  2. barcelonista1981

    May 16, 2007
    GUAYAQUIL
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
  3. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

    Ecuador
    Mar 13, 2005
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Dominguez did good but he made mistakes too against Switzerland. Remember Switzerland had a legit goal dissallowed as well. We were also lucky Honduras didn't score a couple more goals to be honest. Our midfielders have to drop back too deep to help the defense and that's the problem in my eyes. Nothing against the players because I think they did the best they can but Rueda should not be calling up Ayovi or Guagua imo. Agina is not personal I just don't think they are good defender... I would have rather seen Bagui then Ayovi he's not that good either but he at the least plays with some urgency and closes down space better then Ayovi, oh yeah and whatever happened to the LB from Dep. Quito? Can't remeber his name but he was better as well IMO. In Cb I don't know who could play over Guagua cuz I don't follow the Ecua league much since I live in USA and don't have much time but my guess is ANYONE would have been better lol even Checa or Govea, Leon is another shit like I said I don't follow much but I would rather have a guy who is limited but a tleast consistent. The defense is the backbone when it's shaky slow insecure(kicking the ball up the field giving right back) it will influence the whole team. Look at he German defense for an example not only do they defend well they look comfortable defending they control the ball and play passes forward to the midfielders they know where the midfielders are when they clear it just the simple stuff man futbol is not complicated.
     
  4. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

    Jun 27, 2004
    house on the hills
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Individuality is important as I stated. But #1 is always going to be collective play. An individuality for us, for example, is Enner Valencia who gave us a key win and scored in key moments of a game when absolutely no one else made a difference. But HE did make a difference. But it only took us so far, and as result you see we are now going home with 4 points (which isn't a bad result in groups, but it is mediocre) which didn't allow us to pass to the next phase of this tournament. Other teams did pass with 4 points (like Greece or the US), but unfortunately for us it wasn't enough. But individuality only goes so far, and "so far" was the group phase. If you want to last in one of these tournaments collective play alone can take you much further with individuality being key cuando el arco se te sierra.

    Montero and Antonio, as well as Arroyo IMO, are individualities that made a difference for this Ecuador in the last few years. Especially the first two guys i named. They won us games and key points to allow us to qualify whether it was with an assistance or a goal. But most of all, the collective play that we held in the Qualifier was the heart of any individuality even coming to life if you get what I mean. Individual plays spark from moments or good seasons that a player may be having. Truth be told, Montero was not having his moment. In fact, he was injured and barely played these last few months in Morelia. Valencia wasn't in his moment either, although he was playing an above average amount of games this season. Noboa actually did have a really great last few months in Dynamo and Castillo got injured so we lost him. Arroyo and Enner truthfully were the ONLY players that I would say were in their moment. Meaning an individuality could spark from their feet, but we have to be real with ourselves, WHO else was in their moment that was actually on the field? No one. If anything Paredes' performances should be applauded b/c although he hasn't been a standout at BSC, he showed up in these games and stood out in this WC. He's an example to follow. Saco el futbol de donde no lo tuvo.... is how I like to say it.

    Joao Rojas or Fidel weren't in their moment either. Ibarra although he was playing 90 mins every weekend wasn't in his moment, although I think he deserved a lot more minutes in these 3 games b/c mayyyybe he had something in store to display on the field that was "different". So yes key individual plays are important when things aren't working out but this NT that went to the World Cup didn't have many players to choose from to make THAT kind of difference. And if you add on that we didn't have a strong collective system to that which is the most fundamental thing, then you can see why we collapsed.


    Anyways, now it's too late and it's time to rebuild and focus on a different style of futbol. We can't continue with this colombian school of futbol any longer. It's time for a change and I'm not saying that b/c I have anything against Colombian's or their coaches but b/c it's time for a transition to be made. Cycles end and new ones begin. I think the colombian style of futbol was good for Ecuador to help them develop into what they are today and it is much appreciated that our colombian brothers helped us establish ourselves on the map of world futbol, but life and futbol is all about evolving and becoming better. There's a next level to reach and the new generations that are now coming up are more developed and more prepared for a different type of challenge. And this is because Ecuador as a footballing nation has evolved. We can't treat or teach the new generation the same way we did with the 2002, 2006, 2010, or 2014 squads. And I think that's the trap we've fallen into. We haven't noticed (or more like the FEF hasn't noticed) that we've evolved so much - from small things like being versatile and playing a line of 3 or 4 at club level every week, having reputable coaches like Sampaoli and Bauza coach teams in our league and launching their careers shortly after, having a team like Liga win 4 international cups, having Liga de Loja and Independiente play with no fear in their first international appearances even though they're considered "small teams" and advancing to Octavos in a Copa Sudamericana, Emelec giving teams a hard time when they play away, having someone who was regarded as the best winger in the best league in the world two seasons in a row-Antonio, etc. etc....I can go on for days on how much we've evolved. All this only means that it's time for the transition to take place and for new ideas to refresh this squad and allow our players to reach their max potential.
     
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  5. X@vier

    X@vier Member

    Sep 6, 2013
    Club:
    Liga de Quito


    Im with this guy, WTF was Rueda thinking??

    RUEDA and CHIRIBOGA need to get the F*** OUT!!!
     
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  6. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

    Ecuador
    Mar 13, 2005
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    I believe only Paredes put in standout performances defensively. Dominguez was key in the last 2 matches but should have done better against Switzerland on that cross and the 2nd goal. He needs to communicate to his defenders.
     
  7. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

    Ecuador
    Mar 13, 2005
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    I really wish we had Hurtado and Reasco they were a class above the current guys.
     
  8. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

    Ecuador
    Mar 13, 2005
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Again I don't want to knock the guys even Guagua cuz I personally support the players and they did what they could. The defense was acceptable tbh and they did great to hold on against France. I applaud the effort of these guys and they have nothing to be ashamed of. Castillo's injury was always gonna be tough to overcome so it is what it is we came up short and Honduras didn't really do us any favors.
     
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  9. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

    Ecuador
    Mar 13, 2005
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Oh yeah and Rueda needs to go I won't support/follow the team unless he is gone.
     
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  10. javer

    javer Member

    Sep 11, 2012
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    jeff is no longer going to continue in morelia thank god he said he has received an offer from Europe i hope these rumors are true and that he gets back to full form
     
  11. barcelonista1981

    May 16, 2007
    GUAYAQUIL
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Aguinaga would know him, Chiriboga was a member of the board at D Quito back when he played for them.
     
  12. barcelonista1981

    May 16, 2007
    GUAYAQUIL
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Again, we agree, of course team play is number one priority, but how many times in qualifiers and in World cup where you got 7 months to study your rivals, plans don't come together, THATS WHEN INDIVIDUALITIES COME IN, I mean wouldn't it be nice to have a decent free kick kicker? You look at teams like Barcelona who are known to or at least were known to play the best futbol in the world, how many games where they "played" bad were won by one of Messi's individuality, we are seeing it in this World Cup, has Argentina demonstrated team play to walk out with 9 points, not at all if you ask me they didnt deserve 2 of those 3 wins, but you got players that can make something happen regardless of how the game has gone or is set, look at Uruguay, you know Ecuador would have lost those games against Italy and England, Uruguay too, except they have an individual who can make a difference when the game stuck, look we can criticize all we want how Rueda paro al equipo, if you ask me the last 2 games he went with the best we had, maybe Mendez instead of Noboa, but one thing we also need to accept is that there were opportunities for us to score, we didn't have the quality players to break a game. out of all our recent games and believe me I watch them all more than once as Im sure you do as well, at some point Benitez and Caicedo were those players. I'm not talking about Montero's performance against Paraguay where he was fantastic, but that game was open, I'm talking about the Peru game in Quito where it looked like a 0-0 was a fair score, then out of nowhere Benitez who had been having a bad game, caught a long kick by Dominguez, held it, turned around ran half of field dragged four defenders petrified he was gonna shoot, and on the right time he released it to Mendez and as they say in GYE lo puso a comer. Caicedo against Bolivia, we didnt deserve that win, but Caicedo came in and had enough confidence to enter the area when 8 Bolivians were there, passed it to Saritama and drew a penalty. We needed this. One last example, The Switzerland-Honduras match. the Swiss didnt do much, but that Bayern Munich Sahkiir, was at a different lever than the other 21 players in that field

    Look I'm not bashing our players, I think we have a solid team, good shape, hard workers, well disciplined, I'll even go as far as to say that we have a really good chance of qualifying again, we'll always have Quito, our base is almost intact, meaning Erazo, Paredez, Noboa, Valencia, Montero and Enner, I'm not saying they'll play in Russia but they will get us started, but we need a Benitez/Caicedo type of player (old Caicedo) look, team work is priority but there will be times where that wont be enough.
     
  13. barcelonista1981

    May 16, 2007
    GUAYAQUIL
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    I read this as well, he mentioned it was a European team, thank god, I thought Middle east lol, but if this does happen, Montero must realize one thing.....This is it, this is his last opportunity to play in Europe, if he screws this up, it will be Mexico or back to Ecuador for him, it doesnt matter what league he goes to and what team, El tiene que ir y ganarse el puesto y ser figura, if something better comes along in a couple of years so be it, but he must go all out, I'm really disappointed in how he handled his last season in Morelia, barely playing, half assing when he played, Montero is soon to be 25, this is it, he needs to evolve now, not next year, not after Copa America, not for the Qualifiers....NOW. I do not know what's on his mind but he needs to stop thinking he deserves to play in Europe and start showing he should be in Europe.
     
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  14. LongLiveThe80's

    Manchester United
    Jun 8, 2006
    Palos Verdes, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's about time that son of a bitch Chiriboga gets some pressure to resign or quit. I know the people in Ecuador aren't going to make much of a fuss, but if we start pestering the social media outlets from here, maybe we can make some noise. This World Cup was a DISGRACE, but not because we lost in the first round, but because of the way our team showed up to play.

    I read in some Ecuadorian news papers that this team fought and showed character. Really? I sure as hell didn't see that. I saw players making bone-head decisions after bone-head decisions. I saw players trying to be goddamn stars instead of making that extra pass to an open teammate. I saw players leaving the pitch with their heads down and dejected looks on their face. And last, but not least, I saw Rueda clapping at the end of the game like they had something to be proud of! You got to be f-ing kidding me!

    I love the Ecuadorian team to death, and as much as I feel like giving up on them, I can't. They must, however, get rid of that corrupt, complacent, no-good SOB Luis Chiriboga and his son. Next, Ecuadorian players have to change their goddamn mentality! I've been following Ecuadorian soccer since 1993, and the story has always been the same! Ecuadorian players never step up on the big stage! NEVER! There are only a hand full of exceptions that I can think of since 1993 where they showed Mexican level balls and grit. The game in Peru for the 2002 qualifiers when they practically started the game down 0-1 and came back to win in that hostile stadium. The games against Paraguay in Quito where on two occasions they came back to win with 10 men on the field. And the most recent game against Chile in Quito where they overcame Paredes' own goal. That's about it! Can anybody think of other games? Bottom line, 1) we need to get rid of Chiriboga and his crownies, and 2) we need to change our mentality.
     
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  15. Primitive Ways

    Primitive Ways Member+

    Jan 30, 2009
    Florida
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Who comes up with these rumors? Lol Enner to PSG, Bayern and Chelsea.
     
  16. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

    Jun 27, 2004
    house on the hills
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Yeah I agree with your comment. That's exactly what I was saying. Individuality is something you fall back on when all else fails (and by "all else" I mean collective play). Everything you said was right, but the one factor we were missing for us to rely on those individual stand out players (Montero, Valencia, Caicedo) is that their NOT in their moment. That's the issue. When a player is just not his moment things just won't work out and those individual moments won't show. That's why I said Caicedo, Montero, and Antonio and everyone else BESIDES Arroyo and Enner looked very scrubby and unpolished when attempting to attack and almost always lost possession. Montero and Antonio couldn't dribble out one player and beat them down the wing, not one! Uruguay takes advantage of Luis Suarez because he's just that type of player that always shows up in these games, PLUS there's one big thing that you need to take into account- he's in his moment. Right now Suarez is the best striker in the world if you ask me. Undoubtedly. We don't have that. The only two players that are in their moment are Arroyo and Enner. That's it. That's absolutely it and everyone else isn't having a standout season: Montero- was always injured these last few months, Valencia- good but didnt stand out this season, and Caicedo-attempting to get back into rhythm and isn't even playing every game out in the middle east or even scoring much for that matter. All this means we only could rely on 2 players; 1 of which did show that individuality is important when collective play doesn't work and his name is Enner Valencia. The thing is this Ecuador that you saw in the world cup DID in fact rely on an individuality and he was the reason we got 3 of our 4 points. He scored all of our goals too. So there's no denying Ecuador relied almost solely on one individual player: Enner. Now, would we have been better if Caicedo, Jeff, and Antonio had been in their "moment"?? of course! They're players that collectively and individually respond when needed (Besides this WC). They change games. The problem was we couldn't fall back on them to individually take charge in key moments b/c they simply weren't in form or confident enough these past few months to even do it at club level, so it was expected they'd not stand out on the NT. During the Qualifier the story was different as you stated. But you have to take into consideration that those were other moments. When Montero was killing it in Morelia. When Antonio was just killing it every NT game no matter how he was performing in Manchester. When Caicedo was in top form and basically made a come back to the NT by saving our asses in the game vs. Bolivia in Quito. Those were other moments. Today we living a different reality which reflects what you have seen on the field from these guys.

    That is also why I said "guys don't get your hopes up". I had a bad feeling we would see what we saw. The only highlight that I did tell you guys we'd see in the months to come was Enner Valencia. I don't know if anyone remembers me saying back in December or January that Enner was going to be THAT guy up front. I didn't expect him to be such a prolific goal scorer, but I did believe he was going to be key up front and a player that made a difference. But I said a while ago- Caicedo IS NOT in his moment, he's on decline. I said it about a dozen times not now, but months ago and maybe even a year ago. With Jeff I also said he's not in his moment. The few games he played in Morelia this season he was just not himself. Completely disastrous compared to the Montero we all know. Antonio IMO was maybe the only player that could've done better in this cup but didn't for a very unknown reason (no injuries suffered this season and he wasn't in a bad moment, he came to the NT playing a decent amount at Manchester). I personally think Rueda assigned him a role that did not allow him to be himself. And by that I mean he was told to defend as a priority and attack when possible which is a very mediocre mentality that Reinaldo Rueda has.

    And you mentioned Argentina getting 3 points by relying on an individual player: Messi. Very similar to how Uruguay depends on Suarez and very similar to how we depend on Enner. The difference is they won all three games. And the difference also is that as "bad" or regular as a season as Messi had, he still scored almost 30 goals (if im not mistaken). That just shows you the standards the world has for Messi...so much, that scoring almost 30 is considered bad or regular. If this is Messi in his poorest version (which it is), then you can already imagine him at his best (which of course we've all seen). Messi is an exception to the rule to be honest. He's just a player that is always going to be a notch above the rest and still change games even in his poorest form. And most of the world doesn't have that player, so comparing ourselves to argentina is impossible b/c we don't have anyone nearly as good as Messi and neither does the rest of the world.
     
  17. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

    Jun 27, 2004
    house on the hills
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    So far it's PSG, Bayern, Chelsea, Arsenal, Newcastle, Everton, Tottenham, and Porto. That's like 1/4 of the Premier league right there lol
     
  18. \^the king^/

    \^the king^/ Member

    Jul 4, 2007
    wherevr da action @
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    I'd love to see him in Everton. Chelsea has a knack for ruining forwards lately
     
  19. barcelonista1981

    May 16, 2007
    GUAYAQUIL
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    #1094 barcelonista1981, Jun 26, 2014
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2014
    These are the rumors I have read about.
    Felipe Caicedo - Espanyol
    Jeff Montero - Milan, Juventus, West ham
    Renato Ibarra, West Ham, Ajax
    Enner Valencia- Tottenham, Arsenal, Sevilla, Porto, Everto Newcastle
    Frickson Erazo - Tottenham
    Juan Carlos Paredez- Wattford (I think this is official)

    I really hope all these become true, hopefully the loss at the World cup will inspire them to go out there and be consistent starters, scorers do score and defenders gain confidence.
    All these players will most likely be in the next qualifiers.

    BTW I have the links for these if anyone needs them
     
  20. barcelonista1981

    May 16, 2007
    GUAYAQUIL
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Also, has anyone noticed how ineffective we are at free kicks or corner kicks, what's with the short pass in free kicks? that's got to be lack of work on the coach's side.
    correct me if I'm are wrong but wasnt the game vs Argentina in Quito where we had like 26 corner kicks? we tied that game 1-1 btw our goal did not come from our corner kicks
     
  21. \^the king^/

    \^the king^/ Member

    Jul 4, 2007
    wherevr da action @
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    I remember that game. What a stupid way to give up that penalty 30 seconds in. Smh and the reason we look so weak on set pieces is because our main target man Castillo was out. (He's also the guy who scored from a set piece in the Argentina game)
     
  22. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

    Jun 27, 2004
    house on the hills
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Enner is now that main target man. He's the type of player to take advantages of set pieces. It's been seen in Pachuca where him and Walter connected and also in the NT where the same thing has happened. Enner has even taken free-kicks in both Pachuca and the NT where he's proved he's effective and dangerous. IMO, we have very few players who are good with free kicks. Michael Arroyo and Enner are probably the only two. Walter isn't going to be on this NT much longer....or at least he shouldn't. But this is where the new blood comes in: Junior Sornoza, Fernando Leon, Miller Bolanos, Luis Canga- all good players when it comes to a free kick whether it's shooting and scoring or putting in the assist. And then you have players like Jose Cevallos Jr. who is good at heading and he's not even a striker. This is why i've been saying for so long that what we have on the come up is a very unique and interesting generation of players that we have never seen. Not because of where they're playing but b/c there's aspect to their game and qualities like these that make them different. I have never seen an ecuadorian center back take free kicks like Fernando Leon. For those of you who have never seen the kid take a free kick, you'd be REALLY surprised at this kids technique. It's impressive. The squad we have right now doesn't have players who can even shoot correctly on goal. The ones coming behind them aren't exactly as limited.
     
  23. Gourcuff_07

    Gourcuff_07 Member

    Sep 6, 2010
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Totally wrong man, I dont know who you're confusing me with but I've never been a big fan of Gruezo. I wanted to see Gaibor as starter this world cup but his absence was obvious due to injury. Still I wouldve taken Cevallos no doubt, his strong, good vision, great tackling/marking, good passing, and good at headers which in all makes a great center midfielder. Lol your in denial, Rueda is one of the worst coaches ever and yet you try to praise him or at least cover up for him. This is your problem, you have no knowledge of of football outside of stuff you've heard or read and that's why you don't believe in youngsters. You've heard that all youngsters need to be taken up slowly and therefore you believe that in contrast to me who has been playing football for a very long time and has watched the biggest teams in the world play for many years. You are very poor at judging talent, I bet you have no idea that MANY of the biggest stars in the world of football today have played a world cup at under the age of 21 examples include Messi, Ronaldo, Pele, Maradona, and the list carries on and on and on throughout all time periods. We actually examples in our own country. Whose our symbolic player in the NT despite his shit performance this WC? Antonio Valencia, you know how old he was when he first played the world cup? Look at his age or edison mendez and many of the other Ecua legends who played in 02 and 06. Well at this point I'm pretty sure I killed any of your arguments. You have the world stars as examples and you have our very own best players as more examples just in case you try to argue that only the biggest nations can produce young players capable of playing a world cup. In the end I'm the one who said way before the world cup started that this team was going to be a disappointment while you blindly believed in Rueda. BTW dont forget what I said about Marcos Caicedo and dont forget to check out your boy Penilla at the mighty Cruz Azul where he hasn't even been transferred yet. lol.
     
  24. cabezamagica

    cabezamagica Member

    Feb 10, 2011
    NYC
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Even the mexican reporter from univision feels frustrated about lack of tactics ,yet that rata ,at the fef is about to reward the world cup biggest coward dt another 4 years ..did anybody see this loser Rueda hiding in the decks when he should have been ,egging his team on like the other dt s on the sidelines.i f &&@ ing lost it when I saw that shot.my total respect for the players that went out and put it all out when the s hit was hitting the fan,noboa,paredes ,enner, arroyo ,ibarra even the players that im not a fan of ,dominguez ,guagua put it all out.japan just let go of their coach,suarez quit with dignity and this freaking pariah still hanging around.
     
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  25. viagoal

    viagoal Member

    Jan 5, 2005
    Now that Ecuador is out, which World Cup team should I root for now? LOL Go USA![​IMG]
     

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