things never change people cant ever respect the election process... but what really disgust me is the police i dont know what to say just wow
The police were irresponsible and pathetic. But it is the fact that it was the police holding him in "secuestro" which leads me to believe it was not masterminded by Lucio Gutierrez, who never was exactly friends with the police. He usually always had the backing of the military, who in this case rescued Correo from the situation.
idk much about ecuadorian politics but this seems kinda like a game changer how can you restore confidence in the police after this what stoping them from doing it again. what exactly were the benefits that were taken away. and they better be huge or else i dont see the logic in this other than corruption.
I just know Socialism does not ever work never. We should get the money in the hands of the people who know what do with it/earned it. The people who will create big corporations, employ workers, stimulate economy, this happens in a free enterprise I believe in free enterprise. Ecuador needs to grow as an economy not like Cuba where they never even know what is a flat screen TV. I really don't know what has happened right now but a friend who works for the police says they took away the police benefits, bonuses and whatnot, but imagine that, that is wrong I mean that would be like if Obama takes away your 401k earnings I imagine it's something like thta, and that is just wrong that money is rightfully there's. If the incentives were modified well who knows it's all hearsay at this point but well in all this confusion there is panica because of Correas bad decisions. Correa better straighten up soon because Ecuador I know won't put up with much of his BS for long. With all that said I still think they should just let him finish his term then when the next president is elected he can help balance this out a bit this is how democracy works it balances itself out, doesn't mean it's perfect of course.
Respectfully, this is a rather absurd notion. It is true that a doctrinaire Communist regime has never "worked", but to say that Socialism "does not ever work never" is just incorrect. Many prosperous European countries have economies that are quite socialistic. A lot of people think "Socialism" means all or nothing, when in fact many prosperous countries around the world have a mixture of socialist and free market elements. Chile, Argentina, and Brazil are all examples of countries that have adopted certain elements of socialism and they haven't suffered for it. And as for getting the money into the hands of people who "know what to do with it," I can point to the recent global financial crisis as an example of how letting the private sector do whatever it wants with money is a really bad idea. I'm not Ecuadorian, so perhaps I don't have as much of a "dog in this fight" as all of you, but I consider Ecuador like a second home, and I want to see the country succeed. I haven't been able to find in any of the news reports exactly what kinds of benefits were cut from the police-- does someone know the exact details?
actually socialism does work some examples people use in they everyday lives are the firefighters, the police, the library, in the us the post office (also medicare but to a smaller extent). of course people will try to write these off but bad thing about "free enterprise" is eventually it always lead to the same scenario the wealth being distributed unevenly and the eventual of the few holding most of the wealth and the majority fighting for whatever else is left
Apparently, it was something along the lines of reductions of guaranteed salary increases and bonuses, and an increase in the amount of time required for promotions. I'm not going to get into politics here...but it doesn't strike me as plausible to think that this type of action sprung up out of nowhere due to a bunch of rebellious police officers. There's someone backing it...there always is.
My issues aren't with the ideal that belong to socialism. Socialized medicine and education do wonders in Europe, Would it work in Ecuador? perhaps not. Would it work in the US, perhaps not. My issues with Correa are not the fact that he has socialist tendencies. My issues with Correa are that he has taken it further to crush capitalism and start manipulating the freedoms granted to citizens and certain entities like the press. You would never see this in even the most socialist regimes in Europe unless you go back to what the Soviet Union represented. Correa is a power hungry egocentric. That does not mix well with politics and his personal agenda is getting in the way. The police were incorrect to retaliate this way. They should know that donning that uniform has meaning other than job security to feed themselves and their family, but the fact that a a member of the police, they are there to bring confidence and peace to the citizens. They failed to do that yesterday - shame on them. Matters should have been handled differently.
Correa actually raised the wage for police officers. What he was trying to get rid off was some bonuses that most of the time were given to a small group and not all police officers. I hope you guys know that not all police officers are behind this. The officers who tried to overthrow him are probably the ones who were getting these bonuses. There has to be someone else behind this so I can't wait to see what happens.
Socialized medicine was on the verge of Collapse in Germany when I left in 2001. You have a little headache? Three days off! Catch a little Cold? A week off. That shit wrecked havoc on businesses which is almost impossible to start in Germany. ******** that! own a Television in Germany? ******** You pay me (TAX). Own a Radio? Yes a Friggin RADIO!!! ******** you Pay me (tax). How much is Sales tax nowadays in Germany? it was 14 Percent over 10 years ago. I'm not even going to get in gas prices and how much it cost to own a vehicle, homes etc..etc.. in Germany. If you are lucky you may come home with 25% or less of your check..Yes you are taking care of but it works in Germany because their Economy can hold it together. basically a few hold up many. That's why every so often you hear about Bavaria wanting to break away. The concept of Socialism sound like the next big thing in a Country like Ecuador where you have over 70 percent of the population living in poverty.
I can't disagree. I was just stating that the concept of socialism goes far beyond running education, medical and welfare programs. When you have power hungry mongers like Correa and Chavez, it includes the need to control media outlets in order to maintain a grip on public opinion so it can be molded in the direction the feel like it. This works when you have a country that is so high on the poverty level scale that there will be little to no intellectual debate coming from these people as their level of education would not permit them to know what is right or wrong in government, especially in the long run. Make these people feel loved and you have the public supporting your ass. Coerrea has catered to these people, but the end result will not benefit Ecuador as a nation in the long run. Cutting out the opportunities for capitalistic business could very well kill off any intentions people had of foreign investment in Ecuador.
Despite US Support for Correa, both Hugo Chavez and Evo Morales blame the United States for the attempt.....why does not surprise me? Next they will probably pass laws banning any Americans (including tourists) from entering their countries.
The US is two faced. Everyone knows that. Its not hard to believe and IT WOULD SURPRISE ME. Obama and hillary Clinton just pulled a good cop bad cop on the whole narco terrorism crap on the mexican border. Reading this made me Laugh: Gol...Gol...Gol.. Golpe de estado..LMAO.. http://www.ole.com.ar/futbol-internacional/Botines-botas_0_345565551.html
Obama is probably going to be a one term president anyways. He's as much disliked in his own country as he is in most parts of the World. Not everything in the United States is bad though. I'm sure that American Movie stars and American musicians get more love around the world than anyone from the American government though. If there is any American very popular around the world right now (not sure about Latin America though) its Jay Z.
Most people are so blind and believe exactly what this show was put up for If you had seen it live like I did the whole coverage yesterday and you are half inteligent, you would have noticed that this was manipulated totaly or partially by Correa himself. Like when Hitler burned the Reichstag and blamed it on the communists lol. Well most people are dumb in a population and easy to brainwash. Or like Bush's weapons of mass destruction hahaha.... Anyways, all this looked like the same shows that communists put up with all the time in the past and like another big manipulation of the public. The guy was "kidnapped" and injured by 500 armed cops and then he suddenly he gets magically saved and taken to the palacio in 5 mins? And then he apperas all healthy, strong and arrogant talking politics bullshit and making campaign??? It's all bullshit.....this guy is a vivisimo....he is really smart and dangerous. He manipulated all this to make him look like a martyr and heroe..... His popularity points have been dropping lately and he needed such a political action as this to raise it again!!!! It's just perfect timing! He is an egocentric power hungry bastard that is smart enough to manipulate the masses.If you would ahve seen all the live coverage on TV, it was all like a big show....things were as if put in place....and even the balacera was kind of strange. They said it was rubber bullets first and afterwards they showed on the public TV reall bullets so that people now think they were real. A lot of contradictions and also correa can't speak of democracy when he shuts down for a few hours private TV.....perfect timing also, he needed to bainwash a bit.....Lucio Gutierrez??? Hahahaa yea right! Thats exactly what correa is telling people to belief...and don't be dumb enough to fall for it. Correa plants so much hate on his followers it's crazy how he can make our own people rivals with his passionate extremism and hatred. But on the other hand there were also two manifestations against this show, this bullshit and this communist dictator. One in la avenida de los Shyris and we screamed against this clown for hours and a los of people are agianst him here too. On a side note, I went to have lunch and since there no cops, thieves were everywhere. They robbed the cashier from the restaurant i was in. Good thing that they didn't assaulted any of us the customers...but is was a big scare anyways since they were screaming and intimidating and no one knew what was gonna happen....
So if someone takes away your bonuses, the appropriate response is to wreak havoc on your entire country with violent protest? Like Cris 09 said: shame on them. They could've just had a civil and peaceful strike, like normal human beings.
I went to Germany a few times. It's pretty damn nice there. In fact, it seems the nicest, wealthiest countries like Sweden, Norway, Germany and Holland are also the most socialist in their policies. It's not a straight cause-and-effect, but there is a relationship. The U.S. is not going to say, "yeah we support it!" We've learned the lesson of toppling leftist leaders in the past. The official leaders have to look surprised and always say we stand by democracy. Meanwhile, unelected officials in the Pentagon pull the strings of our military and intelligence operations, which extend through pretty much every corner of the world, and you best believe they have influence on events, especially in Latin America.
Makes you wonder why the United States of America does not come out and say that any coup d'état attempt in latin America will "NEVER" be recognized the U.S.A and will be economically sanctioned, all ties CUT. I mean since we are the Holder and the light of DEMOCRACY. It's not hard to believe that the U.S was behind it. Ecuador is a Petroleum producing country and they just found a huge deposit of natural gas in Puna. An Island off the coast.
I thought I was hearing thing but having been in two Conflicts. that shit sure sounded like fireworks.
lol....yeap you got the point By the way everything is back to normal on the streets as if nothing had ever happened... Hay definitivamente gato encerrado aqui y todo fui manipulado y al menos parcialmente actuado y armado es obvio....he hablado con mucha gente aca al respecto y muchos piensan asi tambien...
It works in these countries because people, for the most part, work toward the common good. In Ecuador, it is every man for themselves. Having national pride in being Ecuadorian and actually working toward the betterment of your nation are two different things. Corruption is the best example of this. People prefer to have a few extra dollars than to support the very system they work for. As much as I disagree, I can understand why: The poverty levels are ridiculous and people are taught to take advantage of every situation and being corrupt in Ecuador simply means you are mas vivo que el otro, not that your morals and ethics are of a low standard. It is encouraged more so than it is discouraged. Your peers do it, your boss does it and his boss does it. It is the example to set on "how to get ahead in life". A great shame.
I've always cringed at that idea of the viveza criollo...a lot of these things are just ethical gaps that corruption has manipulated for decades.
you do realize that in the us there is socialized medicine in Hawaii and for the elderly and poverty stricken kids? its not that it wont work or it cant work its that medical insurance companies don't want it to work.
Of course I know that. The most successful example is the Massachusetts. Not to mention, pharmaceutical companies get to charge outrageous prices because the insurance companies are in bed with them. But that is neither here nor there.