Donovan looking increasingly likely to be Striker

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by Allamerican74, Apr 12, 2006.

  1. ugaaccountant

    ugaaccountant New Member

    Oct 26, 2003
    While your QB analogy makes sense, Adu and Zavagnin are not in the top 8 to play AM. The thing with our midfielders is any of the main ones except pablo could play there, and many have. We have an extremely versatile group, due mainly to our playing style of using the outside backs as our wing play and letting the midfielders just be midfielders.

    Guys who could do it well-
    Donovan
    JOB
    Convey

    Guys who could do it ok -
    Dempsey
    Reyna
    Beasley

    Slightly better than Zavagnin -
    Noonan
    Wolff
    Adu
    Martino
     
  2. Mr. Bee

    Mr. Bee New Member

    Feb 2, 2005
    Buzzing Around
    Club:
    Wolverhampton Wanderers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Oh dear God, I've never seen a less informed opinion.

    Do you subscribe to Fulham TV and/or watch FFC games that are broadcast in the US?

    Because I can't imagine you do by saying that he is "out of gas". Not only does McBride open up avenues that let players like LBM (a slightly more talented DMB) score goals on Chelsea, he's actually back in the box defending every single play. He's hardly out of gas.

    And did you see McBride's goal that "doesn't count?" Brilliant strike. You wouldn't discount it if you saw it.

    I'm sorry, and maybe I'm a little biased as a Fulham man, but McBride has caused twice the goals that he's actually scored and probably Fulham's player of the year.
     
  3. firstshirt

    firstshirt Member+

    Mar 1, 2000
    Ellington, CT / NK, RI
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    just not a big fan of convey but he does seem to have gotten better.....
     
  4. westcoast ape

    westcoast ape Member+

    Nov 27, 2000
    Portland, OR
    I also would start Convey over Dempsey. Dempsey is a valuable starter, he is a valuable sub, so he needs to be there, but Convey has more experience, and I would also say that Convey is better able to go toward the opponent's goal. Dempsey is too often dribbling laterally, and at the speed that Italian defenders and midfielders will close down, I imagine that he may cough up a few nasty breakaways doing that.

    This isn't at all implying that Dempsey is a bad player. His dribbling is great, but against higher quality opposition passing is going to be more important, and he did make a couple of really bad passes last night.

    This leads in a little bit to what I don't like about Eddie Johnson, at least at the moment. Johnson pulls in every ball rather than running with it, tries to move laterally, can't do that, and then passes it back and it eventually makes it back to one of our defenders. Eddie's feet at least are almost quick, but not like they were. Ching seems to take a full two seconds to settle any ball that comes to him, which is why he is so terrible on the national team. Ben Olsen, who many feel had a great game, well, that's fine, he did act at least as if he cared, but we shouldn't reward him for his goal. Not only was it not well taken, it took way too long for him to get the shot off.

    And this, my friends, is why I'm actually a supporter of Josh Wolff. Though he can't ever seem to score, he does cause problems for the other team, he does get good chances, and he helps set up others, not only because he is fast, but because he is quick with his feet and he is making fast decisions. Both of which are essential.

    So, as for starting forwards, if we stick with a 4-4-2, I'd say either McBride and Wolff, or McBride and Beasley. Landon is a decent option, but not great. I honestly don't know, but can Dempsey play forward? Because I would rather do just about anything rather than have Twellman or Ching play up front in Germany. In fact, they shouldnt' even go, because as substitutes they do not add anything at all. Eddie Johnson as a forward, take him in case of injury to other players, because I would advocate bringing only McBride, Wolff and Johnson as forwards.
     
  5. firstshirt

    firstshirt Member+

    Mar 1, 2000
    Ellington, CT / NK, RI
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'll go along with this for the most part....hell just because your a UGA alum I will go along with all of it,,,,GO DAWGS........Now if Hershel had played soccer!
     
  6. firstshirt

    firstshirt Member+

    Mar 1, 2000
    Ellington, CT / NK, RI
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Demps is much better in the mid than as a forward, not that he can not play it, just more dangerous attack goal from the mid. I honestly think Twellman can contribute to this team...His work ethic, determiniation and grit is unquestionable. He will be in Germany
     
  7. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    Or if only one of Reyna & O'Brien is available, then perhaps Dempsey wide right and Donovan in midfield.

    Last night was the first time I ever thought of either a 4-3-3 or a 4-5-1 for USMNT. I said to myself, "Unless one of these guys improves [the 4 headless horsemen we used as forwards], Arena's not going to start him. He's not going to waste a World Cup starting slot on a player of that caliber. He'll alter his formation so that he can get a squad full of true World Cup quality guys on the field."
     
  8. Ronaldo's Idol

    Jun 13, 2004
    I'd rather just have McBride up top by himself than stick Donovan up there with him. Donovan's abilities are completely neutralized at forward. We should go with a 4-5-1 if need be:

    ----------------Keller---------------
    Dolo--------Gooch-----Gibbs-----Lewis
    --------JOB--------Reyna------------
    Beasley-------Donovan-------Convey
    ---------------McBride---------------

    I know this is basically having Donovan as a withdrawn forward, but the point is that the only initial target is McBride, and everyone else runs off him.

    I think this is a likely lineup if EJ doesn't step up and claim a spot. And IF BOTH JOB and Reyna are healthy.
     
  9. BenfromUSA

    BenfromUSA Member

    Jan 20, 2006
    Minneapolis/St. Paul
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Its going to be awfully hard to not start dempsey... he is absolutely tearing it up right now.
     
  10. dlokteff

    dlokteff Member+

    Jan 22, 2002
    San Francisco, CA
    Yep. That's the personell and the alignment we're likely to see.

    The other variations on this line-up are Dempsey in for Convey on the Right with DMB switching to the left.

    And Mastroeni in for Convey as a true D-Mid, behind holding/distrinutors Claudio and JOB, with LD and DMB as attacking mids/withdrawn forwards.

    EJ can force his way in still, but the clock is ticking.
     
  11. TrickHog

    TrickHog Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 14, 2002
    Los Angeles, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yeah, based on what I've seen so far, I'd play a 4-5-1:

    -----------Keller
    Dolo--Gooch--Gibbs--Lewis
    ------Mastro--Reyna
    Dempsy----------Beasley
    ---------Donovan
    ------------McBride

    Donovan plays best when he's got strong support behind him and a target guy in front of him that he can run behind.

    Then sub in O'Brien for Reyna (since I doubt either will be able to go 90 minutes for three games in a row). Bring in Convey for whichever winger ain't cutting it (if it's for Dempsey then Beas moves over to the right). And Eddie Johnson for McBride if he tires and we're behind, switching to a 4-3-3 to provide more attack...
     
  12. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    McBride was a failure as a lone striker for Fulham. With the Crew and with Fulham, he's been notable for making his strike partner look good. He got Stern John to England. He got Leverkusen to try out Cunningham, thinking he was good enough to help them. (This was back when BL was an elite team.) He got people to call for Dante Washington to get caps. He got people to think Edson Buddle is a USMNT-quality striker.

    Why are so, so, so many posters wanting to throw away Brian's strengths and play to his weaknesses? It's mindboggling.
     
  13. BenfromUSA

    BenfromUSA Member

    Jan 20, 2006
    Minneapolis/St. Paul
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Donovan and beasley would be about the same at striker... but we would be losing more in the midfield if we moved donovan up rather than beasley.

    i'm fine with a McBride/Beasley pairing, or a Donovan/McBride/Beasley three man strikeforce.
     
  14. JugglinNCWest7

    JugglinNCWest7 New Member

    Feb 18, 2006
    Raleigh, NC
    Or something that would actually make sense :) :

    ----------------Keller-----------------
    ---------------Gooch-----------------
    Dolo-----------------------------Lewis
    ---------------Mastro-----------------
    ----------Reyna-------JOB------------
    Dempsey--------------------------DMB
    ---------Donovan---------------------
    ----------------------McBride---------

    I've though all along the formation for this summer should be:
    ---------------Keller------------------
    Dolo-----Gooch---Boca/Gibbs-----Lewis
    --------------------------------------
    ----------Reyna-----Pablo------------
    Donovan--------------------------DMB
    ----------McBride-------EJ-----------

    with JOB in for Pablo if healthy and every once in a while going with
    ---------------Reyna-------------
    Dempsey---------------------DMB
    ---------------Lando------------
    in the midfield.

    We have too many midfielders this year!
     
  15. BED-STYPUNDIT

    BED-STYPUNDIT New Member

    Dec 20, 2005
    Brooklyn/Boston
    Though you defended MC man wonderfully, describe the goal aganist Chelsea fully, it was a blunder by Petr Cech and McBride was right there to tap in the rare mistake by the Czech goalkeeper. He gave Robert Huth all the fits in the world and even gave John Terry problems in that game in the first half, but still, he didn't have a clear cut chance and his goal was all about capatilizing on a horrible mistake by Cech.
     
  16. BED-STYPUNDIT

    BED-STYPUNDIT New Member

    Dec 20, 2005
    Brooklyn/Boston
    Besides the stab at Edson Buddle (who really is national team quality but because of failing to hustle and give a damn and a myriad of injuries won't be on the roster this summer, sadly) this is a great article as people ridiculously talk about 4-5-1 as a formation for us.

    THE 4-5-1 will never be a good formation for us until Eddie Johnson, Buddle or any forward with a combination of speed, skill, size, and experience comes along. It is a disaster and puts the US in a spot of long ball stragey all game long instead of keeping it on the ground. It failed horrible in France 98 and reared its ugly head back last Easter aganist Mexico. McBride needs another forward to work off of and that is were he plays his best soccer. It makes us defensive instead of offensive and gets us automatically on our heels.
     
  17. Mike22

    Mike22 New Member

    Nov 8, 2005
    Tampa-->KC, Mo
    Ok, I hope the smiley face means your joking, b/c we would get torn apart with that defense.
     
  18. TrueCrew

    TrueCrew Member+

    Dec 22, 2003
    Columbus, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I agree completely. Folks, if you are playing three in the back. Conventional wisdom (correctly) points out, you play with 3 center back types. For a couple of reasons.

    1) Need some height on the back posts. With Dolo and Lewis manning that task, I foresee lots of goals going in.

    2) With 3 in the back, defenders are staying at home a LOT more, wasted formation for flank guys like Dolo and Lewis. In a 3-5-2 the width and flank play should be coming out of the midfield more.

    That being said, I still favor playing Donvoan up top or as a withdrawn forward in some type of 4-3-3/4-3-2-1, if we want to be aggressive, especially against the Czech's.

    -----------KK------------
    Dolo--Gooch--Gibbs--Lewis
    ----------Mastro---------
    -------Reyna---JOB------
    ---Donovan----Beasley----
    ----------McBride----------

    Offensive Subs:
    Convey
    Dempsey
    Johnson
    Wolff

    Defensive Subs:
    Hejduk
    Pope
    another DM (Olsen?)

    I think we may only bring three strikers (not counting Landon), McBride, EJ, and Wolff. And go with 9 midfielders. Another DM behind the three above (Olsen, KZ, or Armas) and another offensive middie (Ralston, Noonan, etc).

    If you want to play three in the back, something like this looks better
    -----Pope---Gooch---Gibbs OR
    ---Spector--Gooch--Gibbs.
     
  19. -----------KK------------
    Dolo--Gooch--Gibbs--Lewis
    ----------Reyna---------
    --JOB-------Donovan----Beasley----
    -----EJ---McBride----------
     
  20. bltleo

    bltleo Member+

    Jan 5, 2003
    GERMANY
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    as a Donovan fan I would like to see Donovan in striker position better rather than in attacking midfield. I think forward, striker suits better to him. He should score goals, many goals during the world cup. This is pity he left our team Leverkusen. We won today against against Keller team. We have good chance for UEFA-cup, we are getting better. He would have chance to play in european league.

    Well hope to see Landon in Germany as striker:)

    bltleo
    Germany
    from the city that Landon left:)
     
  21. BED-STYPUNDIT

    BED-STYPUNDIT New Member

    Dec 20, 2005
    Brooklyn/Boston
    Thanks bltleo, you are the best.
     
  22. pwip

    pwip Member

    Jul 10, 2004
    Dallas
    KK
    Dolo----Gooch----Lewis

    Maestro

    Reyna

    Demspsey-------Covey

    LD

    BMB----------Bease
     
  23. bltleo

    bltleo Member+

    Jan 5, 2003
    GERMANY
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany

    thanks for kind words.

    I have never given up...I still hope that Donovan will play in Europe after world cup...maybe Bundesliga again...maybe he got matured and he will be no more homesick.....

    I would like to see him as striker during WC, better than midfield:).
     
  24. JugglinNCWest7

    JugglinNCWest7 New Member

    Feb 18, 2006
    Raleigh, NC
    We'll see what happens but I predict that if Landon lines up at forward for more than 30 minutes in a game this summer, we won't advance out of the first round. The NT just isn't creative enough without him in midfield... unless Convey is drinking some magic creativity/playmaking juice.
     
  25. HTownSoccerGuy

    Mar 29, 2005
    Houston, TX
    I like EJ up top, his speed is valuable. whens the last time he got to play with our full national team? Its been a while. I think he can excel if he has a solid midfield backing him up. But i do like donovan up top as well. Maybe EJ, as well is dempsey can come on as a late sub and take advantage of a tired defense. Thats what cobi jones did last world cup and it frustrated defenders
     

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