Well, please understand that I've been responding to you because you are the messenger for this argument -- one of many. I wanted to bring this discussion to the forefront because I'd seen it a lot on here, but my comments aren't really targetted at any one poster. You just happen to be the lucky draw winner. Anyone, I think the problem is that perhaps you are expecting to see more improvement from club play than I am. I don't expect the player's technical skills to improve very much once they turn professional. What I do expect to see are improvements in decision speed, anticipation, tactical awareness, etc. All of these small improvements compound to separate the good players from the great ones. Ronaldo and Maradona didn't go to Barcelona to improve their technical skills. They went to Barcelona to (1) earn a lot o' dough, and (2) to improve on their "soft" skills, i.e. those mentioned above.
I don't disagree with this. I just don't think it has happened with Beasley (or Mathis for that matter) based on what they did for the USMNT before and after going to PSV.
Part of Dell'Apa's complaint is that MLS doesn't know how to value its players and expects too much in transfer fees. Based on comparable players, what kind of a transfer fee should Dempsey be worth? PS. Sorry to those of you frustrated by my typo in the title of this thread.
For a guy that covers MLS, Dell'Apa seemed confused that the main driver here is that MLS is willing to risk a lower transfer fee in exchange for not taking key players off contending teams in the middle of the MLS season. If the same money comes in for Dempsey in January, I suspect MLS will take it.
i think martin nailed it right with dempsey ... if duece doesn't go once january rolls around, i'd be very surpirsed
I suspect you're correct that MLS is not selling off players in the midst of their title race. But I keep reading on here that Dempsey's simply mailing it in these days. If that's the case, not sure the same money comes in. I would guess the folks following him are following him, and if he's not impressive, well, they won't be overly impressed. Is he playing poorly? Beyond that, as noted earlier, his contract length drops (he can negotiate with other teams in the summer for a free transfer). Finally, not sure he's the sort of January pickup folks are looking for. He's unproven, so won't be seen as an immediate fix for teams in need, who will be much more likely to overpay for a proven, if mediocre, player to steady the ship. Bigger clubs might be more willing, to give him six months to adjust before next season, but not sure he's attracted much interest at that level.
Perphaps this is at least partially correct, but in the US market MLS believes that it is a bad idea to damage the credibility of its product by selling name players to foreign leagues in the middle of its season -- even given the risks you point out. I suspect MLS is willing to take less money in January to avoid this issue, and that they are right to do it. P.S. -- if you grant a below-market transfer to every guy who mails it in (if Dempsey is actually doing this), you obviously create some bad incentives. Better to let Dempsey sit and stew and play out his contract as he is a bargain even at 25% effectiveness.
You think? By the way Dempsey hit the crossbar on what I think might have been goal of the year last weekend. Unbelievable move. A good reminder of why the league would like to keep him.
I think it could have been goal of the year also , until I saw Davy Arnauds strike against the Galaxy that went off the crossbar . That would have been unbelievable... Dempseys strike did show some of his class though , and just a little of his potential .
Anybody in the league could have done what Arnaud did, I think the list for what Dempsey tried in MLS includes Dempsey, Freddy and nobody else. That was, quite literally, a Pele move. Can't believe he missed the easy part. Of course MLS has blown the replays on quick kicks so...
http://www.football-rumours.com/news8_sep06_5.htm PS. Some had posted that one can't "tap up" an FA registered player from another FA side. That, I assume, is only FA rule.
As I noted, I don't disagree with the idea of holding on to dempsey for the title race. That has a certain value to the league. In general, I think that holding on to players who want away is poor policy, because you get players with poor morale, it affects entire teams, and the club (IMO) is better off with a team full of players who want to be there than folks looking to leave. But Dempsey's case is difficult because of the season in the states. His market value (the amount folks are willing to pay for him) wasn't high enough to force MLS to believe they had to sell. IMO, his market value (what MLS can get) falls from this point on, but I'm sure MLS knows this and has decided they don't care. Lot's of clubs let folks walk on frees. He won't be the first.
I really don't know much about the situation surrounding Deuce, but I do know this. The European leagues are are all wonderful training grounds for players who want to improve their game. They get the experience of playing against and with world class talent everyday. I really do believe that the US needs to get more players represented overseas, to hone their skills against the likes of Cannavaro, Ballack, Cech, Sheva and so on and so forth. I like the MLS, I catch a game whenever I can, and honestly, there is only so much you can offer as a player in that league. The league needs some more talent, and until you can get someone like Bill Gates to fund it (or soccer becomes bigger than football), there is going to be little chance that talent will come and/or stay in the league. It will only be a matter of time before they get lured away by the calls of Europe. The league needs to realize that the challenges these players need to reach a higher level of play doesn't exist in the MLS. They should just let the players reach their "league prime" and then release them to a league where they can expand their game. Who knows, maybe this will potentially bring in outside talent which will grow and develop in the league and bring another level of play into the U.S. Unlikely, but we can dream.
That's why Jovan Kirovski and John Thorrington and Danny Karbassiyoon were so great and led us to the semifinals in Germany.
All those silly MLS players, interested in actually playing games... Everyone knows the best teacher is the training ground.
As funny as it may seem, some people get their kicks stompin' on a dream.* But I, I don't never let it get me down 'cause that big ol' world (of transfers) keeps spinnin' 'round. ** * Right, Superdave? Right, Sunil? Right Don & Ivan? Right, ... ** Sorry about the double negative and other liberties taken (including copyright infringement, if any. This post is for educational purposes only, or whatever that blurb on top of the library's copy machine says).
You can't even humor a newbie without resorting to an attack. And the newbie was being reasonable, btw. You're not.
So they would have been world all stars if they'd played in MLS? Europe does not, as you point out, turn sow's ears into silk purses. There also will be examples of really fine players it ruins (some physically, some mentally). This does not negate the fact that the level of play is much higher, and players at the highest levels will have a better chance to hone their games there than MLS. The US doesn't have a lot of players playing at the highest level (even those in the top leagues are more in the lunch-bucket than transcendent group (nothing wrong with lunch-bucket players, every team needs them)). When the numbers increase, substantially, we'll know more about the truth of this proposition. But, IMO, we have a better chance of dominating cup games when we have players who dominate CL games.
Kirovski and Thorrington were both highly touted youth prospects, particularly Kirovski who was seen as some sort of super-savior. Both were youth national teamers. You'd think if their development experiences were so superior they might at least be national teamers. Thorrington is 27 and can't beat out Calen Carr for playing time. Then there's Grover Gibson, Alex Yi, Bryce Wegerle, Phil Salyer, Chad Deering, Raul Palomares... It's precisely because Europe can't turn an American youth national teamer into Andrea Pirlo when he moves there at 18 or 19, that MLS is so necessary. Who exactly is supposed to do the necessary training when the players are kids if not MLS. And if the league can't expect to reap any benefits in doing so by cowing to the demands that they ship everybody off as soon as someone from Europe asks, then why precisely should MLS be concerned with upgrading our youth development?
Still trying to attract interest (at any level): https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=409369 A little dated, I guess, but fun writing. Hope you know the tune.
getting back to the original post, yes he does. so do many others. but, the europeans ain't exactly beating down the door...