Do you guys have Bergkamp' opta index? I was surveying his index for 2002-03 - it was not looking good. Make of that what you will - personally I do not put much stock into it. Arsenal's Team Stats compared to Division Avg 2002-03 Most dribbles and runs 2002-03
Glad you enjoyed the video... I agree Bergkamp still had some great moments in big champions league games as you mention but for a player of his calibre there should have been many more if he were to play in more away games. 01/02 was probably his best champions league season for arsenal and was imo his best post-90's season, he played 6 home games, arsenal won 5 with bergkamp being a big factor in the juve, leverkusen, mallorca games, and even his great pass won the penalty vs deportivo (H) which henry missed. he missed 5 away games that season, and arsenal lost all 5 - we had a horrible away record at the time but can't help but think bergkamp could have won us some points. Would arsenal have won it with him? I doubt it still, but we were 1 win away from qualifying to the quarters in 01/02 and then who knows what can happen. I don't like to talk about hypotethicals but my points is there were many missed opportunities for arsenal in the champions league in the early 2000's and bergkamps absence was no coincidence imo
If I'm understanding Wiliam correctly I think he is a fan of Bergkamp in terms of being a player he enjoyed watching: https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/t...rites-and-best-players.2134033/#post-42768740 But he is placing a lot of emphasis on decisiveness and feels Bergkamp under-delivered in some big games: https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/t...rites-and-best-players.2134033/#post-42768728 I think in other places Wiliam did refer to Gullit as a favourite as I would have expected, along with Pele, Platini, Puskas.... and I'm thinking maybe in terms of combination of enjoyment and appreciation of all-round game (so the list with Bergkamp on, headed by Burruchaga, Bebeto, with Pires near the top too is probably entertainment-based and with those he found fun to watch growing up etc). At some point in the past I made top/'best' 30 all-time player attempts that had Bergkamp inside (but outside top 20), but now I'm I guess more in between that and what you said. I remember this set of videos with Bergkamp a place ahead of Muller (from a Spanish/Real Madrid fan IIRC who is somewhat older than me I believe so remembering 70s players first hand etc: to be fair better Muller goals and clips could have been inserted in theory, although it's natural to focus on World Cup and considering this is from early-Youtube days the videos were great and with a good selection of clips I think for sure): (That's the one with Muller and Bergkamp; I never realised before I don't think but I see he does have a Muller-specific video available to see on the channel too as well as a 'Divine Ponytail' (Baggio) one)
in Brazil .. at Least by Brazilian People Of my generation 80's Dennis Bergkamp .. We saw him as the best Player in the World between 1995 until before of World Cup in 1998 in BRazil in this time ;.. 1. Dennis Bergkamp 2. Romário 3. Fernando Redondo 4. Ronaldo Nazario 5. Del Piero 6. Gabriel Batistuta 7. Davids 8. Roberto Carlos 9. Thuram 10. Zinedine Zidane We saw.. Dennis Bergkamp better than George Weah for having an absurd and incredible technical quality.. scored more ++ goals than Weah... We saw...Dennis better than Ronaldo Nazario.. for the game vision.. and better Passing skills quality.. we came better than Zidane Zidane had a supernatural technical quality, something out of this world here... Ball stuck to his feet.. crazything at all ... But there was a lack of decision-making power and effectiveness end product.. few goals and assists before the 1998 World Cup.. But Dennis Bergkamp not confirmed this whole poster and credit that He had in Brazil 90's .. i saw the entire Career Of Dennis Bergkamp ... i was a bigger Fan of him .. ! But .. Dennis Bergkamp for me did not deliver the complete package much to be expected from a player with this incredible class and absurd technique nowadays I no longer have the view of a mere spectator and layman on the subject..or matter ! I have the vision of a football Headcoach demanding and realistic at the same time .. .. . I don't look for art in Football
Dennis Bergkamp ... 90's in Brazil .. was considered as the best player in the World by so far ! we were more ++ 200 teenagers playing FIFA and Pes in BRazil !
Dennis .. Top 103 until Top 125 or Top 150 on the entire World . ! the same Group with ..Ronaldinho Gaucho, Roberto Baggio , G.Vialli, Andy Moller , FRancesco Totti... Kaká ...C. Seedorf nowadays on my view !
🚨 Pyramid of the Greatest England Players of all Time... pic.twitter.com/H35PPmuouu— The Footy Feed (@TheFootyFeed) May 12, 2026
Great player (surely top 200 ever, maybe even top 150), but also a textbook case of european football chauvinism leading to overcelebration (though not as pathological as Zidane being put in the all-time top 10 or a plainly average player like Rijkaard being top 50 or so). Take a look here. Maestro Junior could do anything Bergkamp did. And more.
I don't know if Dennis Bergkamp is over-appreciated, but let's see if his core assets as a player were overrated, and frequently matched by others. That might be easier to discuss. In terms of select traits, I truly believe he warrants the respect he earned. Maybe other technicians are sadly forgotten, but it does not necessary mean his level of virtuosity was easily matched across history. If there were countless equals, even within the domains of strength for Dennis Bergkamp, some of the highlighted characteristics must be easy to topple using quick searches on data-bases and YouTube, if we use all of footballing history. Through-ball assisting ability, for instance. If I personally define through-balls as non-aerial passes that find teammates despite defenders being placed in between the passer and the receiver, setting up the teammate for a somewhat a clear shooting chance on goal without much rearrangement, I think it was one of Dennis Bergkamp's core assets as a player. Dennis Bergkamp's 1998/1999 EPL season through-ball assists (not sure if the criteria is correct, and I'm not entirely sure if these are all EPL matches, but Transfermarkt data seems to suggest all assists are for this season were done in domestic league fixtures): Arsenal Legends: Dennis Bergkamp - All 116 Assists HD Arsenal Legends: Dennis Bergkamp - All 116 Assists HD Arsenal Legends: Dennis Bergkamp - All 116 Assists HD Arsenal Legends: Dennis Bergkamp - All 116 Assists HD Arsenal Legends: Dennis Bergkamp - All 116 Assists HD Arsenal Legends: Dennis Bergkamp - All 116 Assists HD Arsenal Legends: Dennis Bergkamp - All 116 Assists HD Arsenal Legends: Dennis Bergkamp - All 116 Assists HD I personally counted eight, which beats every single WhoScored single-season tally for an EPL creative that had his records registered since the 2009/2010 EPL season (Cesc Fabregas managed 6, David Silva managed 5, and Kevin De Bruyne managed 4 in terms of their season-best). According to WhoScored data, Lionel Messi seems to be player with the most through-ball assists in recent major European domestic league history, with 11 through-ball assists during the 2010/2011 La Liga season. Maybe older playmakers such as Zico also had impressive through-ball statistics, but within the European club context, maybe this ranks amongst the top. Lionel Messi all 25 assists 2010/2011 *HD*
for sure Junior was a much more complete player Total Footballer than Dennis Bergkamp easily ! But Bergkamp, when inspired in matches, had high technical skills levels . but easily for example Junior , Ruud gullit e Cerezo .. They were actually much better than Bergkamp. match by match no doubts !
Your approach is scientifically sound as usual, but personally I'd say comparison cannot be done in the straightforward fashion you suggest, since average values and numbers changed much across time and countries. The end of century/early 2k EPL that Bergkamp used to play in in my opinion has been comparatively a poor league in terms of average level of players and teams. Players that in Italy were considered just good went there and stormed the competition.
I agree Serie A was better (and it was also still a bit less open style wise compared to PL, even if compared to 80s Serie A it was more open), but don't totally see this the same. Looking at top 25 Premier League players as per DBS Calcio (in effect the Independent newspaper I think) ratings for 1995/96 and 1996/97 (in italics as an aside are other foreign Internationals who didn't come from Italy/Serie A): 1995/96: Albert, Curcic, Shearer, Gullit, Sinclair, Ginola, Hendry, McManaman, Kanchelskis, Beardsley, Batty, Lee, Bohinen, Sheringham, McAllister, Monkou, Peacock, Dicks, Giggs, Barton, Cantona, Fowler, Spencer, Bergkamp, Pearce 1996/97: Zola, Batty, Campbell, Bergkamp, Juninho, Pembridge, Keane, Merson, Ferdinand, Emerson, Hendry, Earle, Albert, Peacock, Carbone, Adams, Sullivan, Walker, Keown, McManaman, Pearce, McGrath, Leonhardsen, Leboeuf, Sutton (sorry, accidentally shrunk last two names!)
For 1996/97 for example Di Matteo 66th, Ravanelli 86th, Vialli 88th in DBS Calcio ratings ranking. Vialli had been among the top-rated Serie A players as recently as 1994/95, and Gullit as recently as 1993/94 (although I know both were in veteran stage and arguably it was as much that their Serie A clubs perceived them declined or at end of career as that Premier League teams came in with big money to take them to England). Carbone was pretty high up among Serie A ratings for 1995/96 himself (top 25 on DBS Calcio list - so although Hodgson at Inter was willing to do without him I think, he was another 'rated' player leaving to go to England during 1996/97).
I was thinking of Di Canio. Good player in Italy, genius in Premier League. Same is true for Bergkamp himself actually. EPL defenders in late nineties/early 2Ks would made much easier to shine for skilled players. To me, that is a fact. Nonetheless, I consider Bergkamp wothy of a placement between 100 to 150 in the best ever ranking. And skill-wise, more valuable than van Basten.
I think it's partly that Bergkamp (highly regarded and a Ballon d'Or nominee prior to going to Italy, with impressive Euro 92 and European competition performances) overall didn't shine at Inter as much as expected, partly because of their style of play, but don't disagree that there was more space 'in the hole' to exploit in England or that Serie A defenders in general (and in particular the top ones) were of a higher expertise (and perhaps a bit more cynical too). Di Canio yes, and Thierry Henry, but then it's a question of how much they developed as players as they matured I suppose too?
I was speaking more of (perceived) technical skills of players than overall effectiveness. Players coming from serie A looked a bit like the brasilians in the early 80s in Italy this respect.
Juninho, before he got injured, did start very well in La Liga (not Serie A I know but a different top league) for Atletico Madrid, and Ginola had been a star for PSG, so these players were of a calibre to star in other leagues. Some players were expected to do better than they did in Premier League I suppose, such as Dumitrescu. Klinsmann did better for Tottenham than Inter, but again I think his peak was mid 90s personally.
Not totally. You maybe don't know Ian Bishop well, but he would be about on a par with a Di Matteo in technical skill I would think. Le Tissier was a top technical player. But in terms of average level, to an extent I agree (Italian players, and players from the top league of Serie A generally, tended to be polished in ball control, including defensive players). Silenzi probably had bad form in England, but wasn't a technical master in any case - apart from in overhead kicks I seem to recall maybe in Serie A? - (and didn't seem it in England) for example. I suppose it's similar in the 1980s Italy example in the respect of some players such as Antognoni being exceptional among Italians in technique, but yeah there were some good (and not all of them famous) skilled players in England at that time during the 90s.
The point of failure for Dennis Bergkamp at Serie A probably wasn't his through-ball abilties. I don't know his assist rate at Serie A, but according to Transfermarkt, a decent share of his tallied assists at Inter Milan seem to be through-balls, with two quite similar profile passes coming in the game below. CREMONESE-INTER 1:4 | SERIE A 1993//94 | DOMENICA SPORTIVA | doppietta di Wim Jonk Maybe there are players who had more success with throughball assists both at Serie A, and EPL, during that time-frame, but I personally doubt it. I personally think that if there was WhoScored type data-base for the major European leagues, maybe Dennis Bergkamp would have been the leading through-ball assist specialist of his era, although I have not checked for other contemporary peers such as Rui Costa. The level quality at his core skill-sets was probably evident regardless, but Bergkamp's efficacy may indeed have been context dependent.
It's very difficult to compare players across different eras. That said, anyone who spends even 5 minutes watching a Junior highlight reel will instantly become a fan of his. He's one of the few that could probably excel across any era. A true footballing genius who was well ahead of his time. Bergkamp does not fall in the same category, but I miss players like him. I think it's not so much that Bergkamp was underrated, but rather the kind of footballer he was is no longer valued like they once were. In the modern game, every player on the pitch must press and work very hard off the ball. It leaves little room for any player to walk around, to kind of watch/read the game, and then seize a few moments on the ball to produce something magical. On the international level, where the game is a bit slower and clunkier, because national players don't share the same training ground consistently as much as before, this kind of player can still exist and maybe thrive. Messi and Cristiano would not cut it at a top club in Europe given their age, but at the World Cup, maybe.
His 1993/94 UEFA Cup performances can’t just be brushed aside though as if they never happened. Great UEFA Cup performances in the 1990s certainly aren’t ignored when people discuss Roberto Baggio or Ronaldo Nazário so there is a clear double standard here. Thierry Henry’s spell at a Serie A club was an outright and undeniable failure. Bergkamp’s wasn’t. His time there was only a relative failure when measured against what he produced at Ajax, for the national team and later at Arsenal.
Bergie had a hard time at a very competitive Inter squad. At Arsenal, he learned to kick back, to be more physical.
You are perfectly right, Junior and other players belonging to that "golden" generation of brasilian footballers (those born in the 50s) really looked ahead of their time, really seemingly coming from another world quality-wise when among their foreign peers. That is why they are by far my favorite "team" (in a wide sense, say the players contributing to the Selecao in late 70s/early 80s) ever.