DC United Statistics discussion [formerly the Ursula House of Bad Juju Thread]

Discussion in 'D.C. United' started by ursula, Sep 3, 2007.

  1. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    Thought I'd get your attention with that title. Of course deciding which DCU team is the best ever depends on various perspectives and different values and statistics. One of those statistics however is how many points per game the team averages. Currently the 98 team holds the highest full season points per game mark for United at 1.91. This year's team is also at 1.91 ppg so they have a chance to set the new record. Bet that snuck up on ya!

    Here's a list of all the United teams ranked by ppg:

    1) 98 1.91 (5th best all-time MLS) Won CCC, Inter-American Cup
    1A) 07 1.91
    2) 99 1.88 (7th best all-time MLS) Won SS and MLS Cup
    3) 97 1.84 (9th best all-time MLS) Won SS and MLS Cup
    4) 06 1.72 Won SS
    5) 05 1.69
    6) 96 1.44 Won MLS Cup, USOC
    7) 04 1.40 Won MLS Cup
    8) 03 1.30
    9) 02 1.14
    10) 01 1.00
    11) 00 0.94 (9th worst all-time in MLS)

    Note: United is the only team to have won the SS three times. Only the Gals have also won it more than once with two SS's.


    * Thanks to scaryice for background stats:

    http://usasoccer.blogspot.com/
     
  2. Cweedchop

    Cweedchop Member+

    Mar 6, 2000
    Ellicott City, Md
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Well that's the Kiss of Death if I've ever seen it.

    Thanks Skip! :p
     
  3. sch2383

    sch2383 New Member

    Feb 14, 2003
    Northern Virginia
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    The only stat that matters is the number of trophies won.
     
  4. apqjr

    apqjr Member

    Aug 30, 2003
    PB Gardens, FL
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    WORST. THREAD. EVER.

    Did we not learn anything from last year?

    :) Nothing personal ursula :D
     
  5. Sundevil9

    Sundevil9 New Member

    Nov 23, 1999
    Reston, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Worst thread since Lanky's Best Team Ever thread last year.:mad:
     
  6. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Ha! Yes, I debated with myself about starting this thread but since I'm not predicting anything I figured that its okay! (I'm sure you've noticed how little I've been posting. Its because I don't want to predict anything this year.)



    Yes, and isn't it interesting that all of the best United teams ppg-wise have trophies and this year's team so far fits right in among them?
     
  7. EL MONO MARIO

    EL MONO MARIO Member

    Apr 9, 2002
    Montevideo, Uruguay
    Club:
    CA River Plate
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    They aren't the best ever because they haven't won anything this year! Until they WIN something than you can say if it was the best ever.
     
  8. Talion

    Talion New Member

    May 24, 2004
    VA
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    The 2006 team was on pace for all sorts of records...until they fell off the pace. Ultimately it is silly to compare in-season ppg with full season ppg. DC's on a hot streak at the moment so the pace is good, but streaks come and go during a season (and thank goodness, given how we started).

    But while we're daydreaming of records, if you want an impressive number, I would turn to road goals allowed. 8 goals in 12 games is pretty amazing. Previous season leaders in road goals per game:

    2007 DC .66 rgapg (so far)
    2006 DC 1 rgapg
    2005 DC .94 rgapg
    2004 CLB .93 rgapg
    2003 SJ 1.07 rgapg
    2002 CHI 1.36 rgapg
    2001 MIA 1.17 rgapg
    2000 KC .94 rgapg
    1999 LA 1.18 rgapg
    1998 DC 1.38 rgapg
    1997 DAL 1.56 rgapg
    1996 NY 1.56 rgapg

    To get the all-time record DC has to give up 5 goals or less in their last 3 road games. If they give up 6, they'll tie with 2004's Columbus...that's the Andrulis team that had 13 ties and won the SS on the third tiebreaker (GF) over a KC team with two more wins.
     
  9. Bootsy Collins

    Bootsy Collins Player of the Year

    Oct 18, 2004
    Capitol Hill
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Didn't someone do this last year immediately before the post-All-Star-Game skid started?
     
  10. Bootsy Collins

    Bootsy Collins Player of the Year

    Oct 18, 2004
    Capitol Hill
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    It's hard to know how to interpret these numbers, because the rate of scoring for the league overall has changed over the years. Put another way (with exaggerated numbers to make the point more clear), if ten years ago we were giving up twice as many road goals per game, that wouldn't necessarily mean we were that much better a defensive team on the road now if league-wide, the scoring rate had dropped to 20% of what it was 10 years ago.

    So what you'd want to show is not the road goals allowed per game, but something like:

    For each year:

    Sum_over_DC_road_games(goals_allowed_by_DC / average goals scored at home by that team)

    divided by the number of DC road games.
     
  11. autogolazzo

    autogolazzo Member

    Mar 4, 2007
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Shouldn't there be a "Points Per Game Shield" or something of that nature?
     
  12. JuanMa

    JuanMa Member

    Jul 22, 2003
    MD
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    this isnt baseball. ppg and most other stats are meaningless.

    kill this thread dead.
     
  13. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Yes! And its been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that what we write on BS affects the future!

    :)

    :eek:

    :eek:
     
  14. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Yes, Talion's stat is interesting. What I'd like to know is how much better (or worse) a team is compared to the league in that year. There's been quite a variance in defensive stats year to year.
     
  15. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?


    Well since at the end of the year all the teams will have played the same number of games then the SS is the same as the ppg shield.
     
  16. Winoman

    Winoman Drinkin' Wine Spo-De-O-De!

    Jul 26, 2000
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    No, This is the WORST DCU team, ever! :(
     
  17. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    I began wondering about this during the last game since it is now September, traditionally the time when the teams that are serious about the MLS Cup get their acts together. So I think bringing this up now is very very different (more meaningful) than talking about a team in mid-summer. Its very possible that United has time to cool off but that time is getting short.

    What's interesting in looking at this year's weekly ppg totals is that, as usual a few teams started off hot with ppg averages over 2.00- TFKAM, Kansas, The Revs were notable this year. But by mid-June I think, all of the teams had ducked below the 2.00 ppg mark and the leader in the league continued on a downward trend stabilizing in the 1.70-1.80 range until late August when United took the lead, which they have stretched out to 1.91 now. I'm not sure but I think that in most years this type of trend happens:

    1) A couple teams start hot out of the Spring gate.

    2) A Summer swoon happens for said front runners, bringing them closer to the field if not losing their lead. Some of the Spring also-rans show signs of life.

    3) The business end of the season begins when the heat of Summer moderates (end of August-early September) into Fall when the true contenders move up.

    Its not just United that's moving up. Chivas and the Revs are the other two teams that, for the moment, appear to be separating themselves from the crowd. The Revs have been the most consistantly good team this year while Chivas has had a long upward trend much like United. The rest of the teams have either slowly cooled down or had little spurts here and there that they haven't been able to sustain- or have been awful all year.
     
  18. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    1. The way they've been playing recently is pretty scary. But it's hard to judge a team or a player in the middle of a hot streak. Let's see them keep it up.

    2. It's a pretty amazing statement about MLS' parity that teams that don't get 2 points a game are among the alltime best. I know the shootout era reduced the number of points, but still.
     
  19. RayWhitney

    RayWhitney Member

    Jun 23, 2005
    Laurel, MD
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    KILL THIS THREAD

    [​IMG]
     
  20. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Yes, that surprised me.
     
  21. BigKris

    BigKris Member

    Jan 17, 2005
    Falls Church, VA
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    What's interesting to me about this list is, I don't see a whole lot of trophy-winners on this list. You've got the '06 United team that won the supporters shield (barely) and the '04 Columbus team (again, SS, and again, barely) and I think that '03 San Jose team might've won MLS cup?... I'll have to do some research so I'm not just talking out of my butt, but it appears to me that this stat isn't nearly as strongly correlated with hardware as I would have expected. Interesting...

    EDIT: did the research: that 00 Wizards team won both the shield and the cup; 01 Miami won the shield, 03 SJ won the cup, and as already mentioned both the 04 CLB team and 06 DC team won the shield. So that's six domestic trophies for the eleven season-leaders in this category. I can no longer make up my mind if that's surprisingly few or not.
     
  22. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Now we're screwed.
     
  23. Talion

    Talion New Member

    May 24, 2004
    VA
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    What Bootsy was asking for was actually defense-adjusted road goals allowed per game, which is an extra-good stat since it corrects for the fact that MLS plays an unbalanced schedule. Unfortunately, in addition to being extra-good it is extra-time consuming, and there's only a handful of people around here interested in stats at all so it's not really worth the effort.

    But what you suggest is a lot easier, so here you go. Columns: "Lg Avg" is league average road goals allowed per game. "Best" is the best team's rgapg. "Team" is which team that was. "% Lg Avg" is (Best / Lg Avg) * 100. What can I say, real statistics like standard deviations etc. scare me. I sorted by best percentage.

    Code:
    Year	Lg Avg	Best	Team	% Lg Avg
    [i]2007	1.53	0.66	DC	43.14%[/i]
    2000	1.83	0.94	KC	51.37%
    2001	1.88	1.17	MIA	62.23%
    2005	1.47	0.94	DC	63.95%
    1998	2.04	1.38	DC	67.65%
    2006	1.41	1	DC	70.92%
    2002	1.76	1.36	CHI	77.27%
    2004	1.2	0.93	CLB	77.50%
    1996	2.01	1.56	NY	77.61%
    1999	1.46	1.18	LA	80.82%
    1997	1.89	1.56	DAL	82.54%
    2003	1.27	1.07	SJ	84.25%
    
    Here is the same chart sorted by year so you can see the trend over time. I added trophies for BigKris:

    Code:
    Year	Lg Avg	Best	Team	% Lg Avg	Trophies
    [i]2007	1.53	0.66	DC	43.14%		TBA[/i]
    2006	1.41	1	DC	70.92%		SS
    2005	1.47	0.94	DC	63.95%		-
    2004	1.2	0.93	CLB	77.50%		SS
    2003	1.27	1.07	SJ	84.25%		MLS
    2002	1.76	1.36	CHI	77.27%		-
    2001	1.88	1.17	MIA	62.23%		SS
    2000	1.83	0.94	KC	51.37%		SS
    1999	1.46	1.18	LA	80.82%		-
    1998	2.04	1.38	DC	67.65%		CCC, IC
    1997	1.89	1.56	DAL	82.54%		-
    1996	2.01	1.56	NY	77.61%		-
    
    The league-wide upward trend since 2004 is interesting. It's anecdotal but I've seen a lot less bitching about teams bunkering since then as well (remember all the complaints about Gansler's KC?). Maybe teams are playing more open on the road...and paying the price.

    Trophy-wise, you've got four SS winners, only one MLS cup winner, and no Open Cup winners. One thing to remember though is this isn't a true top 11, some seasons might have a second place team better than other seasons best team. For example, the 1998 LA Galaxy at 1.44 rgapg were 70.59% of the 1998 league average, good enough to bump someone off this list. They won the SS. The 2005 San Jose Earthquakes had 1.07 rgapg for 72.11%, etc. Those are just two teams that immediately come to mind as having good defenses.
     
  24. Saltenya94

    Saltenya94 Member

    Jul 29, 2003
    Brooklyn
    Club:
    DC United
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    Yeah, but there's still 8 games left. Anything can happen, not to mention the Galaxy won MLS cup with a horrible MLS season only a few years ago. And then months later blew a 2-0 lead at Sapprissa stadium.
     
  25. BBBulldog

    BBBulldog Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 25, 2004
    Dinamo Zagreb
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    Re: 2007: Best DCU team Ever?

    ah, just in time for annual inevitable DC 2 month shit form followed by emberassing bounce out of playoffs :D
     

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