PBP: DC - Me against the World - 2025 season game thread

Discussion in 'D.C. United' started by morrissey, Feb 15, 2025.

  1. United1

    United1 Member+

    Feb 23, 1999
    Arlington, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Watching KC at St Louis. Stadium is full, people are into it, and it’s 100x more exciting than what we just watched.
     
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  2. sitruc

    sitruc Member+

    Jul 25, 2006
    Virginia
    Lesesne saying it might just be a twisted ankle for Benteke. I definitely didn't expect that.
     
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  3. Th4119

    Th4119 Member+

    Jul 26, 2001
    Annandale, VA
    I have two good Jamie Watson stories but they’re best saved for in person.
     
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  4. Winoman

    Winoman Drinkin' Wine Spo-De-O-De!

    Jul 26, 2000
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Tease! :)
     
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  5. Q*bert Jones III

    Q*bert Jones III The People's Poet

    Feb 12, 2005
    Woodstock, NY
    Club:
    DC United
    United puts 8 players in defensive roles every game and has the worst defense in the East. And because there are 8 players behind the ball, they have the third worst offense in the conference.
     
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  6. griffin1108

    griffin1108 BigSoccer Supporter

    Dec 5, 2003
    Virginia
    I'm not sure what that means, but really, Fletcher has had two runouts in England with Swansea and an extended stay at Forest with their youth teams and he hasn't received a nibble from either. The Forest stay is damning because he got time to play and was there for over 6 months of play and training. Forest ended his loan early. Most youth players don't make it, yet DCU fans always seem to believe that anyone coming up from the youth ranks here is the next savior. Sort of like the old Deadskins fans' belief that the backup QB could lead the team to the Super Bowl if only given the chance. While I'm not enamored of Lesesne, a number of coaches have seen Fletcher in action and decided "hard pass". Maybe he'll become the next Griffin Yow overseas, or maybe he'll be the next Moses Nyeman now plying his trade in Loudoun. I would expect the latter far more than the former.
     
  7. griffin1108

    griffin1108 BigSoccer Supporter

    Dec 5, 2003
    Virginia
    As for the game --
    Peltola looked good, as someone said on a better team he would be very useful. Tubbs was generally solid, but is afflicted with the Donovan Pines back pass/freeze with the ball issues. With more time I hope he overcomes that. Leal could be a useful change of pace sub, but he can't carry the team.
    As for the truly bad -- Enow is a red card waiting to happen, should have received straight red for his challenge last night. Rowles always seems to be emergency defending, is it poor positioning or just lack of foot speed? If he's starting quality for Australia, that team is not very good.
    Everyone else was "meh". Kijima is active, but what is his best position? I actually think he might be better off the bench going against tired legs, but where? He's not a winger and I'm not sure if he really can be an "8".
    That was a soporific match. On Saturday, Mukhtar will have a brace within 20 minutes against this defense.
     
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  8. Yowza

    Yowza Member+

    DC United
    United States
    Oct 23, 2019
    Arlington
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Nah, Tubbs was strong, He
    Y’know, Fletcher has two goals in 28 appearances all comps, Stroud with three in 44. So that’s the competition.
    I’m not saying Fletcher is a slam dunk but you have to play him to find out. This is what good teams do. You might say Lesesne sees him and he is found wanting, I would say looking at Lesesne’s lineup decisions it is Lesesne that is found wanting.
    Not for nothing, Fletcher was recalled from his loan by DC, not sent away by Forest.
     
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  9. Winoman

    Winoman Drinkin' Wine Spo-De-O-De!

    Jul 26, 2000
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think he was technically "sent away" by Forest, but when they didn't want to exercise the "buy" portion of the "loan/buy" agreement, he was brought home. Whatever the cause/result, you still need to play the young man to see what he's got, if for no other reason than that he's OUR asset and you need to see what his value is. If he can't cut the mustard, you sell him for what you can get, or terminate by mutual agreement. If he can play, then maybe you can keep him, or sell him for something more.
     
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  10. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would argue that one reason our defense is so bad is that we’re too defensive. Hear me out.

    When you play the kind of poor technicians we have up and down the spine, defending us is easy, so teams can afford to be super aggressive. Further, we can’t possess the ball as a defensive tactic because we suck at that. And we can’t play through a press so there’s almost no risk to pressing us. Replacing one of the DMs with a competent 8 would make us harder to score on despite a less defensive line up.

    Maybe I miss Klich? Hard to believe because I thought last year he sucked, but here we are. I guess I naively thought we’d bring in a competent 8.
     
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  11. griffin1108

    griffin1108 BigSoccer Supporter

    Dec 5, 2003
    Virginia
    I think Kijima was "supposed" to be an 8, not sure what he is exactly other than high energy. Last night, the only players who were "good" on the ball were Leal, Peltola and sometimes Schnegg and Herrera. However, I do think your analysis is correct, DCU were constantly under pressure because they couldn't create any offense and often were dispossessed at midfield or worse. I'm not sure how you fix it -- Lesesne doesn't rate either Barajas and Fletcher and they are the most "technical" guys who haven't received serious minutes. Gavin Turner I'm sure regrets not going to UVA at this point. Maybe Hopkins can get into some sort of game rhythm and be a useful 8, but that's a long shot work in progress.
     
  12. griffin1108

    griffin1108 BigSoccer Supporter

    Dec 5, 2003
    Virginia
    Fletcher has been evaluated by coaches at Swansea, Forest and here by Losada, Rooney and Lesesne. He had an extended time at Forest and all of the above said "no thanks" I remember the 2023 Open Cup match against Richmond. Rooney gave Fletcher the start up top and he looked just lost and underwhelming against USL League 1 defenders. While I hope for his sake he reaches his European dream, I'm not clearing out my 401(k) to make that bet.
     
  13. DCU1984

    DCU1984 Member+

    Jan 15, 2009
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Fletcher was found not good enough of a prospect to stick around at a team well in the top half of the EPL this season. That really doesn't tell us if he's good enough to play for this bottom of the table MLS team. I'd like to see him get a shot.

    He probably will at some point and we will barely have the ball or create any chances and he won't look good. We'll bench him for a mediocre veteran that makes fewer mistakes.
     
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  14. PSURoss

    PSURoss Member+

    Sep 30, 2002
    DC Burbs
    Notts Forrest declined the option to buy Fletcher, so we recalled him.
     
  15. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hopkins plays the style they need, but unless he’s gotten significantly better, he lacks the quality needed.

    But at least give him a shot at proving me wrong, what do they have to lose?
     
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  16. Yowza

    Yowza Member+

    DC United
    United States
    Oct 23, 2019
    Arlington
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was at that match, he was ass. I’ve also seen him turn a match around against Toronto, looking like a future star.
    I don’t know what I’m arguing about, if you think playing Stroud is a better option than testing Fletcher, we’re in different universes.
    I think you underrate the willingness of Swansea and Forest to pay for Fletcher. He scored 17 goals with Swansea’s u21, crushed it. If they could get him at a similar rate to the rest of the guys on that u21 team that he was leaps and bounds better than, they would. He didn’t get turned away because if his play, he was their very best performer. It’s disingenuous to say Swansea didn’t rate him, how could they not?
    Maybe he sucked at Forest, I don’t know, but I wouldn’t be surprised as his career to date is marred with inconsistency, something that frequently happens with young players.
    It’s analogous to Yow. He couldn’t get on the field here, Westerlo had a plan instead, didn’t play him for a year, built up his body and then he became good enough for them to be an Olympian.
    DC sucks at developing talent. You’re right about Turner, he’ll regret his decision and very quickly no young player with any sense will sign with DC.
     
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  17. Wyrm2

    Wyrm2 Member

    Apr 29, 2007
    Silver Spring
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
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  18. Cavan9

    Cavan9 Member

    DC United #1, Philadelphia Union, #2
    Nov 16, 2011
    Lower Merion Twp., Pennsylvania
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I have one positive to say about that game: United was able to fight hard and grind out a point. It would have been very easy to lose focus and give up some shitty goal down the stretch.

    The negatives are obvious but I’ll focus on Enow as I used to play that role. He is just not mobile enough. He doesn’t keep, moving to try to get into passing lanes to receive distribution from center backs and doesn’t move to provide support when the ball is on the flank. He is ok with the ball. Credit for him being safe on the ball. Compare his off the ball movement to other MLS starter quality defensive center mids in United’s history. John Harkes is the gold standard but look at Perry Kitchen, Ben Olsen, Felipe, or Russel Canouse. Even look at a dud like Ravel for off the ball movement (Ravel’s problem was that he’d never distribute forward always killing chances for transition. He was very talented just had low soccer IQ on the ball.)
     
  19. Section 107

    Section 107 Member+

    DCU
    United States
    Jul 18, 2018
    Didnt we score two goals without him last time he went out early in a match? Also, his production has been relatively low - while only 4 off the league lead of 10 he is tied in 15th for goals.

    So, I am not too worried - just not expecting much - prefer to be pleasantly surprised.
     
  20. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    Yes, but isn't Peglow still injured?
     
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  21. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
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  22. Q*bert Jones III

    Q*bert Jones III The People's Poet

    Feb 12, 2005
    Woodstock, NY
    Club:
    DC United
    Peglow had the game of his life against Jersey but I haven't seen much else from him at all. He should be a perfectly decent option off the bench and/or occasional starter and not much more. If you're hoping for him to carry the team you are just setting yourself up for grave disappointment.
     
  23. Winoman

    Winoman Drinkin' Wine Spo-De-O-De!

    Jul 26, 2000
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Who do we have that's better?
     
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  24. dcu n bntwn

    dcu n bntwn Member

    Jun 7, 2004
    Watertown, MA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Before Benteke went out, the press looked pretty good. It helped that NYC wanted to play out from the back. We created quite a few loose and deflected passes. We created a few chances, but unfortunately it seemed that most of the 50/50s went their way. After Benteke went out, not only were we unable to create our own scoring chances, but we could not get the ball into their defensive 1/3 to create pressing opportunities (after we lose possession).

    After he left the game, the route 1 hold up option was lost, and there also seemed to be no open passing lanes. Benteke is not only our best scoring threat and vital for his hold up play, but he also occupies multiple defenders and alters the opponent's defensive shape. This creates more space in the midfield and on the wings for others to operate. It is much easier for us to get the ball into the final 1/3 when he is out there.

    It will be interesting to see how Troy adjusts tonight. I agree with the analysis by others above. The movement off the ball in the midfield and attack has to be much better.

    Vamos United!
     
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  25. Th4119

    Th4119 Member+

    Jul 26, 2001
    Annandale, VA
    I feel like you’re conflating two things. It’s totally fair to question what Fletcher’s long term prospects are. The breakdown for me is the comparison with Greene.

    Fletcher is miles above Greene in technical skill, 1 v 1 ability, creativeness, athleticism, and finishing. It’s not apples to apples since they have different profiles, but in the areas that matter the most and are the most valuable to a prospect, Fletcher is far ahead.

    I’m also not suggesting that Fletcher is the key to everything that ails DCU, but his profile is one the team sorely lacks and it’s not as if anyone playing above him (especially while Peglow is out) has been staking a real claim to a position.
     
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