Thiago, a Brazilian, seems to be in good form for the Chicago Fire. I suspect he hasn't been capped for Brazil, since there are probably 20 ahead of him in line at his postion. He's probably as American as David Regis. I know that Germany has seriously considered adding Denilson, who used to play for Werder Bremen, to their national team. Given that there is a shortage of A-mids on the US Nats with O'Brien injured and Reyna needing a vacation, wouldn't he be a good addition to the team?
I feel there are many quality attacking mids coming up through the youth ranks (Donovan, Beasley, Gaven, Adu, Martino, etc.) for the US, that we do not need to use a "Regis" type player again. It didn't work out so well in 98 anyway...
Someone who is serious about becoming a US citizen with reasons that do not include an easier path to international soccer is welcome. We are a nation of immigrants and there's still room for more. Mercenaries who become citizens just for a better playing opportunity are not. This is the United States National team. The United States part has to come first. The Regis example from the previous poster is a black spot on our history. That should not have been done.
No....next question... As stated above, we have capable attacking options in our ranks. There is no need to go after Thiago...and one good player run doesn't deserve a "Should player x play for the US" thread... my .02
I can think of a few other examples of Brazillian players playing on other prominent national teams...Deco for Portugal, Zinha for Mexico, Alex for Japan...I'm sure there are plenty others... Where I have a problem with it is the Deco example...he joined the Portugal national side after he had been hinting he wanted to play for Brazil for years (IIRC...I saw a piece about him during Euro 2004...please correct me if I am mistaken). Also there is Edu, who actually is playing for Brazil...threatened to play for England to get his way. It seems to me that this misses the whole spirit of International Competition...playing for country you love...whether native or immigrant or naturalized or whatever. There shouldn't be "Free Agents" in international competition. Now Alex, on the other hand...I saw a piece about him on Football Asia...he was an exchange student in Japan in high school...then stayed there and played professionally for 7 years. He's a citizen, speaks Japanese and considers himself Japanese. He proudly represents Japan. Could he have used his dual citizen status to get leverage to have played for either country...yes. Did he? No...he plays the country he identifies with. I have no problem with that. As a previous poster said, this is a nation of immigrants...to deny an immigrant who has paid his dues and becomes a citizen and considers himself American the chance to play isn't right. But, Thiago just got here, so I think this debate should be put off for another 5 years.
No No No and I don't think he could make the team anyway. From what I've seen his first touch is horrible.
Good post. In a nutshell I do not think that Thiago would really be good enough. To hit on some other points. The worst mercenaries would have been Ailton and Leandro in Germany. I always say it but it is the reality - the selecao does not really call up attacking/creative players based in Germany... except for maybe 1 or 2 players here and there, or unless there are major injuries (like between 1999-2001 when there was a shortage of consistent forwards... by Brasil standards). Ailton never would have played for Brasil. NEVER. He wasn't good enough, and he would not have dislodged any post 2002 forwards being he was older than all of them but Rivaldo maybe and didn't really grow through the ranks. He tried to play for Qatar... obviously that was blocked. He had no ties whatsoever to that country. Same with Leandro, who hadn't been getting call-ups, if any, and he was playing well in Germany. Again, his move was blocked. Edu didn't stand much chance, and he was a crybaby. No way could be get a shot over Gilberto Silva, Renato, Emerson, etc. It wasn't so much that his 'threat' to play for England got him on the Selecao in Copa America and some random matches, it was that Gilberto Silva wasn't fit, Renato hadn't really convinced, Emerson seemed out of the Selecao picture and of course Vampeta is/has been retired from the selecao. Now... Edu is nothing but a (bad) memory. I don't think he would've even been eligible to play for England to help them and IMO, he wasn't good enough for their first team, or at least their first 11, anyway. If Deco had been patient he most likely would have played for Brasil but instead he took advantage of the system and is playing for Portugal. In the end that might be good for his career anyway but he is Brazilian through and through. No big deal. Would have been good to have him but there are many others that can go into his position and do a solid job for the Selecao and many are just as good if not better (Ronaldinho, Juninho, Kaka.. all if necessary and eventually, Diego when he gets back to playing in a system that fits him). Kevin Kuranyi is playing striker for Germany - he was born in Brasil but is mostly tied to Germany. Maybe his situation is similar to the USA player Benny Felihiber or however you spell his name. Born in Brasil but closer tied to the USA. Same with Alex, who feels more at home and is at home in Japan. Zinho I don't know what his deal is but if he wants to play for Mexico that is good. The thing is, none of these players would probably feature for Brasil. Realistically. Not Kuranyi, not Alex, not Zinho, not Benny. They don't beat out the current Selecao players or youth players or players that could be called into the Selecao. If Thiago considers himself American, has the paperwork and Visas, gets along with the team and would help the team them maybe, yeah. But if he's not good enough or would only be willing to play just to make himself an international, well...
The more I think about, Brazil has so many international quality players it's mindboggling. They could probably field 2 or 3 competetive teams full of stars from many different leagues.
It seems the sentiment is against Thiago. Is he on Coach Arena's radar screen in any case? I would think that if he is a player who can make a big difference he would have to be. Bruce gave Cunningham a try, for example, though he didn't work out.
I think that you have to separate the type of players who change citizenship and end up on the national team. 1. Already established profeesionals who change nationalities just to get WC experience. List includes Regis for US, Deco for Portugal, etc. 2. Players who establish citizenship before becoming any kind of established soccer player. List includes Feddy Adu (7), Benny Feilhaber (3), Pablo Maestroni (when he was a kid). These players fall into the normal immigration patterns. Interesting Alex Santos from Japan is mentioned. He came to Japan as a high school student and was nowhere on the soccer radar in Brazil. He went from high school to pros and worked his way into the NATs. There was a player for their '98 WC team, Wagner who came from Brazil to play in the J-League and changed his nationality to make the WC team. He is one of the main reasons that Japan reached the WC '98.
OH CRAP !!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now Arena is really going to consider this guy dont you know arena listens to what you guys on these boards say just like when people asked for Zavagnin you got your wish same as noonan
And for the record we are the only nation in the hex to have a national coach mexico, panama, gute,t&t,costa rica all have foreing born coaches and yet we have a national who does things right. And in mexicos case they have Zinha who is brazilian. Do we have any players currently on the usmnt to not be born in the us? I dont think so.
Not actually true. While Wagner Lopes only made his J-League debut a year before his first cap for Japan, he had already played amateur and semi-pro soccer in Japan for six years before playing in the J-League. When he finally got into the J-League, it was the first time he had ever played at a fully professional level.
How about someone who has been in the US for a little bit more than half a year? Ronnie O'Brien maybe?
Search his name and you'll find like 93290390230 threads about it. Even one started by me! He's cap tied to Ireland.
But why did he express interest in playing for the US if he's cap tied to Ireland? I've opened up a can of worms, haven't I? I'm sure the answer is buried somewhere in those threads.
In all fairness, I would sub-divide this list into people for whom there is compelling reason to believe that they would receive a country's citizenship at some point in the future regardless of soccer (for example Regis, based on the fact that he has an American wife he was going to become a citizen eventually regardless of the WC) and those who really and truly have no connection to the country outside of soccer.
Not born in USA: Adu Cunningham Not sure about Gutierrez, but I think he was born in Columbia Not sure about Onyewu, Oguchi, but sounds foreign. Mastroeni, as already mentioned
Gooch's parents are from Nigeria but he was born here. Mastroeni was born in Argentina but moved here when he was 4. Ronnie O'Brien played for Ireland in a Fifa U-20? tournament so even if he had citizenship he is cap tied to Ireland. And lastly everyone here seems to have short memories or didn't follow the national team prior to 2002 because before that Regis was a rock in our defense. At the end he sucked but before that Pope was maybe the only one in our defense that was more of a shoe-in to start than Regis