To me, I do not get the hype about Argentina winning the Copa America. There are only 10 countries in South America and the competition is usually a 12-team event. Only Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay, Chile, and sometimes Colombia are serious contenders. Messi has played in 6 Copa Americas. Mathematically, it was almost easier for Argentina to win one than not over the course of his career. This is not like the Euro where you have to qualify for the tournament and there are 7-8 legitimate contenders every time. Also, the Euro is played every four years while the Copa America is played more frequently.
Congratulations, Christina! Yes, it was about time; you deserved a title, and most importantly, Messi deserved it more than anybody; he is a class act. I'm happy for your kid and for you. Enjoy the celebrations!
You could argue Euros is tougher because of the sheer volume of powerhouses, but you’re undermining the difficulty of going to Maracana and defeating Brazil. They are one of the top teams in the world (above most European teams, and for many the candidate to take the WC), while on a historical level they had won every single Copa America they hosted until now. That feat alone is more difficult than most of the Euros. But besides the final, Argentina finished undefeated throughout the tournament. In the process they took on complicated sides such as Uruguay and Colombia, who could easily compete with many European teams. Even the mid-lower echelon rivals (Chile, Ecuador, Paraguay) are more than decent and capable of beating some of the Euro knockout sides, like Ukraine, Sweden, or Czech Republic. As for Euros being less recurrent, that is not necessarily true either. The next CA will be in 2024 (four years after this one, since this was technically the 2020 edition), followed by 2028. It’s every four years, like the Euros. It just happens that in the last decade there were two strange editions that interrupted the pattern and caused an abundance of copas: 2016 was an unprecedented special centenary edition (originally debated if it should even count as a CA or something separate), while the current copa was another anomaly by FIFA/CONMEBOL — created only to align CA with the Euros, so the two tournaments could happen concurrently every four years.
Thank you! I gotta say Neymar was a class act yesterday congratulating Messi his friend and rival. Such a good example of a nice healthy rivalry.
Congrats to Argentina who had a better tournament and desired the most to win. And to Messi who is a nice fellow after all. But we South Americans should be concerned about any chances to win in Qatar next year.
It is true that it is almost impossible for a non-Brazilian side to win in Maracana but my larger point is that Argentina had five attempts prior to win the Copa America with Messi. Mathematically, they really should have snatched one. I would say they underperformed during Messi's reign prior to this edition of the Copa America.
2007: Lost to Brazil in the final. 2011: Knocked out on penalties by Uruguay (went on to win Copa) 2015: Lost to host Chile in the final on penalties. 2016: Lost to defending champion Chile in the final on penalties. 2019: Knocked out by Brazil (went on to win Copa) Lost 3x on penalties. (No extra-time in quarter and semifinals) Lost twice to Brazil. Underperformed? Those aren't too shabby teams they lost to. Always knocked out by the eventual champion. I see no shame. Unlucky, to be sure.
LOL! If you don't get the hype in a finals win over Brazil at the Maracana, is there anything in life - or at least in the world of sports - that can be hyped? Edit: And don't give me beating England at Wembley. It's not exactly the same. Not even close.
Some teams are in transition like Chile and to an extent Uruguay. How will the young strikers shape up to replace Suarez and Cavani. They undoubtedly are talented. I still think Brazil is missing a goal machine upfront and a master in midfield with the ability to surgically pass like a Socrates. There are many issues in CONMEBOL. Aside from behind the scenes. Proper renumeration for clubs losing players to Europe, making sure young kids are not lost in the system when they do go abroad, making more media coverage of the Libertadores, Copa America and Sudamericana with more sponsors. Not to mention aside from Brazil improving existing stadia or improving current ones. Coaching is fine. The modern analysis is catching up and players are just as well prepared physically now. Mentally some teams do still have a complex it seems when they encounter one of the so called European powers. Next year is as good a chance to win it. CONMEBOL will catch up again.
Then you do not get football. This rivalry is cosmic. Most of the teams in Europe would struggle to qualify out of the CONMEBOL group. And many of the sides in UEFA are cannon fodder. Imagine Messi playing against these sides he would have 140 goals plus. The Copa has also never been played on a regular 4 year cycle either. An extra one was added for the centenary of CONMEBOL that is all and this one was delayed a year for obvious reasons.
Yeah, Copa America is just weird, schedule wise. It has been an annual tournament, a tournament played year-long in home and away matches. It has had short breaks and one big long break. It came back in the 70s as a tournament every two years. Then in the 2000s it was made every three years. 2001 - 2004 - 2007... which is bizarre cause obviously that lines up with the World Cup as well. Now that it's finally lined up with the Euros, that will be good for long term stability. I agree with those who have said many of these UEFA teams would struggle to qualify in CONMEBOL. Only a few would be like Brazil/Argentina - usually at the top of the table - and even they have had some lower finishes in the current format. But I'm a bit more of a pessimist when it comes to the long term. Right now I don't see signs CONMBEOL will catch up again. I think the gap will continue to widen and things need to be done to combat that on a national level (CBF for us) and on a continental/FIFA level to give us more varied competition, because playing the same 9 teams every Copa and qualifying cycle will not be enough. Congratulations to Argentina. As a Brazil fan I hope this pushes us to fix some things and come in to 2022 stronger.
Congrats to Argentina for winning the Copa. Also for the Historic win. I do not have to hear about Brazil not losing at home to a South American team since 1975 anymore. I also do not have to hear the stat about Argentina not winning a Cup since 1993.
He already did - the 2013 Confederations Cup. He was absent from the 2019 tournament, but yes, I too expect Neymar will have a Copa title triumph (of some sort) with Brazil's NT in the future.
Dude, I can't believe I'm going to say this, but let the Argentines savor their moment.... if you're not from South America it may be hard to grasp. I get that. But let it go.
In terms of catching up with UEFA, the catching up is spoken of because the best of the best of CONMEBOL aren't in CONMEBOL. If all the members of the rosters of yesterday's finals played in Brazil, then for example, the UEFA domination in the FIFA World Cup would likely not have happened as it has since it was instituted and replaced the old Intercontinental Cup. As for yesterday's final and the tournament, for the most part, this tournament reflects what we've seen in WCQ. Brazil and Argentina are above the rest. A closer examination shows that Brazil, while still excellent, may need more variants from Tite. The latter shows evolution thanks to a rookie manager who, while arguably still having much to learn, has been able to forge the basis for a new team (and it's more than a little ironic that a young manager who is so inexperienced accomplished what Passarella, Bielsa, Batitsta, and Martino failed to achieve - but that's one thing about football... surprises do happen). I didn't like the result, but I'm glad the tournament was successfully held. No one died from Covid-19: all the left-leaning critics from Brazil, some of who conflated the federal government's agreement to hold the tournament with Brazil's fate in this competition, prophesied doom. There was no health-related catastrophe, and Brazil showed it could host a tournament in short order and little notice. 2024 next. And I'm glad - since 2016, it's been tons of Copas América. Having it every 4 years prevents the tournament from being cheapened by commercial interests who push for overly frequent competitions.
Playing the role of a bitter Colombian fan I would say Colombia would have won it if the tournament was held at home in front of packed stadiums and guys like James and JuanFer Quintero were healthy/ allowed to play. Playing the role of a measured, intelligent Colombian fan I will just say que sera sera, It was not meant to be. Winning the Cup could have made the team & manager very complacent and not address the issues and problems we have. Hopefully we improve from this tournament in Brazil and get better.
Which only makes me wonder more "what could have been" if those matches were hypothetically played in front of capacity crowds in Colombia.
yeah, that's not wrong. I don't think there is a team in the world that wouldn't be worried about playing Colombia.
Colombia was great, they have very talented players (Diaz is a beast) and with some improvements it could be conmebol dark horse
Not sure what your point is. It seems like you are saying that they shouldn't celebrate the win, but surely you have a better point than that(?)
There is no doubt that Messi has matured as a leader, both on and off the field. The old Messi who looked like he was carrying a cross whenever he put on the Argentine shirt is gone. The new Messi, while perhaps not as brilliant, inspires his teammates without making the team Messi-dependent. It helps that he is now playing mostly with younger players who idolized him while growing up, but I think it's also growth on his part. In the semifinal against Colombia when they tied the game, I though "here we go again", but Messi stood tall, made his penalty, and with his body language encouraged his teammates. As an example of his off the field leadership, there is a video of the Argentine players celebrating and singing after the final whistle, and one of the younger players started singing a traditional chant that is offensive to Brazilians. Messi immediately stopped him. He was heard yelling decisively, "no, ese no (no, not that one)". He wasimmediately backed by Sergio Aguero, and that particular chant stopped. The old Messi would never have done something like that.