Copa América: USA 2016 [R]

Discussion in 'Copa América Centenario 2016' started by Paul Calixte, May 1, 2014.

  1. unclesox

    unclesox BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 8, 2003
    209, California
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    I would think Brazil and the others that qualify for the Olympic finals would use this tournament as preparation for their provisional U-23 squads.
     
  2. dinamo_zagreb

    dinamo_zagreb Member+

    Jun 27, 2010
    San Jose, CA / Zagreb, Croatia
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    I was expecting something like this to happen, great news.
     
  3. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Almost forgot: according to the same article, Mexico is seeded, so now we're pretty much guaranteed to have the US, Mexico, Argentina and Brazil in Pot 1 for the draw. IMO you put the remaining CONMEBOL teams in Pots 2 (Uruguay, Chile, Colombia, Ecuador) and 3 (Paraguay, Venezuela, Peru, Bolivia) and the CONCACAF qualifiers in Pot 4.
     
  4. mwjppgr

    mwjppgr Member

    Dec 23, 2008
    Montevideo
    Club:
    CA Peñarol
    Nat'l Team:
    Uruguay
    #104 mwjppgr, Sep 28, 2014
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2014
    The seeds for the Copa América 2016 should be:

    USA (only for being the homeowner)
    Brazil (for being Brazil)
    Uruguay (for its present and its history)
    Argentina (for being the most big marketing superpower in whole de soccer world)

    PS: Argentina deserves the award just a little more than Mexico.
     
  5. mwjppgr

    mwjppgr Member

    Dec 23, 2008
    Montevideo
    Club:
    CA Peñarol
    Nat'l Team:
    Uruguay
    The last time Argentina won a match against an European Superpower was in 1986 WC,
    more than 28 years ago. (Goes to 31, as long as they can try in the 2017 Confederations Cup)

    ... And before 1986 the Argentines only had defeated France (in 1930 and at home in 1978), Spain (in 1966) and the Netherlands in extra-time (at home in 1978).

    I repeat: Argentina drags over 30 years without being able to win a game to England, Netherlands, Italy, Germany, etc etc .................. ........ ......

    (Honestly, I think it is very long time to be considered a Superpower like Brazil)

    [​IMG]

    (As if this were not enough) ...and have over 20 years without winning anything.

    Argentina last won title was the Copa America 1993.

    Since that time, or more precisely from 1994 to today, Brazil has become 2 times world champion, 4 times American champion and 4 times champion of the Confederations Cup, while Uruguay was 2 times champion of America.

    However, all that Argentina has to "brag" from 1993, according to their supporters and other fans who consider themselves to be "impartial", are 4 lost finals, 3 of them in a row against Brazil in the Copa America 2004, Confederations Cup 2005 and the Copa America 2007.

    Meanwhile, Uruguay addition to being 2 times American champion in 1995 and 2011, also lost a continental final against Brazil in 1999, and a WC semifinal against the Netherlands in 2010 and another semifinal of the Confederations Cup with Brazil in 2013.

    Ultimately, and appealing to the more rational objectivity that someone is able to consider, I ask myself: Who then is closer to the performance of Argentina in the last 20 years? Brazil or Uruguay?

    [​IMG]
     
  6. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Man, that is a lot of crazy nonsense that has nothing to do with the 2016 Copa.
     
  7. PaulieJay

    PaulieJay Member

    Sep 10, 2013
    Iowa, United States
    Club:
    Wolverhampton Wanderers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Maybe it's a bit jingoistic and egotistically American on my part, but my guess would be that some of the star players from South America would be eager to ply their craft in the US in a competitive tournament. Guys like Messi, Neymar, James, Vidal, Suarez, those are guys that truly have a personal "brand" and these guys don't live in a bubble. They know the US is the largest/wealthiest virtually untapped market and it's not every day that they will have the opportunity to play on US soil in front of millions of American eyeballs and sell some of their own jerseys. As far as the Olympics, I can certainly see Brazil taking it seriously on home soil, especially when the lack of a gold medal has been sort of an albatross for CBF and the youth development in Brazil is and will continue to be under the microscope to look for signs of improvement following Mineirazo. I doubt any of the other teams that qualify will be prioritizing it as much as CC (2 from CONCACAF, 1 from CONMEBOL and 1 play-off winner).
     
  8. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    When it comes to Countries focusing on the World Cup and individuals focusing on their brand...
    ... Country needs over Individual selfishness usually wins the battle. Qualifying is primary focus not some money grab Copa America.
     
  9. PaulieJay

    PaulieJay Member

    Sep 10, 2013
    Iowa, United States
    Club:
    Wolverhampton Wanderers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    By any measure, any FIFA tournament can be described as a money grab. To think WCQ's are the primary measurement of success for an international footballer is simply not the case. Countries like Brazil and Argentina are expected to qualify for the World Cup. Messi wouldn't really grow his greatness to any degree if he scored 40 goals in the next CONMEBOL campaign. It's all about the silverware.
     
  10. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    South Americans will take it seriously. This is the first time the Olympics will be held in South America. Heck , it may be the only time.
     
  11. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    No one is saying WCQ is the primary measurement of success. I am saying it will be the focus that summer for Federations, Managers and yes, players too.
     
  12. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    When Colombia won the Copa America in 2001 but did not qualify for World Cup 2002 people were not like yes we got silverware! We don't care about the World Cup!
    On the contrary, most Colombians and Colombian fans I know would have rather have lost the Copa America and qualified to the World Cup.
     
  13. Dominican Lou

    Dominican Lou Member+

    Nov 27, 2004
    1936 Catalonia
    All this talk about "brand" and reaching out to "markets" is far more important to American athletes and audiences.

    If the stars do end up coming, they'll do it out of pressure from their federations or something else. Fortunately, most South American stars only worry about their public image, not so much their brand.
     
  14. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Speaking of which...deep down in his heart of Argentine hearts, Messi knows he needs to win something with the albiceleste for his legacy's sake. If Argentina don't get the job done next year, I wouldn't be surprised to see him show up (he's already got Olympic gold - a senior team trophy is what's missing).
     
    jared9999 repped this.
  15. Sandinista

    Sandinista Member+

    Apr 11, 2010
    Buenos Aires
    Club:
    Racing Club de Avellaneda
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Messi should've scored that chance he had in the final.
     
    Jsean, Fedechat and Paul Calixte repped this.
  16. Rivaldinho

    Rivaldinho Member

    Jan 26, 2003
    This does make sense. CONCACAF would have looked stupid if their champions didn't go to this tournament. Although it's unlikely that any nation other than the US, Mexico or Costa Rica will win the Gold Cup.
     
  17. Rivaldinho

    Rivaldinho Member

    Jan 26, 2003
    That stuff is important to sponsors. I wouldn't be surprised if Messi is asked by his sponsors to play in this Copa. Neymar too. And Nike might put pressure on the Brazilian confederation to bring a strong team.
     
  18. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But Nike would never pressure a team into making personnel decisions on their terms **coughFrance98cough**. :D
     
  19. Dominican Lou

    Dominican Lou Member+

    Nov 27, 2004
    1936 Catalonia
    Ugh. You're right.

    The optimistic part of me thinks Messi and other international soccer stars are, in general, less beholden to the wishes of their sponsors in comparison to their American counterparts because they care a bit less about being obscenely rich.
     
  20. barcelonista1981

    May 16, 2007
    GUAYAQUIL
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    In all honesty, I doubt any of South America's heavy hitters will play this tournament, they just got off from playing 2014 WC this last summer, they will all play Copa America in Chile in 2015 Summer, If the WCQ schedule remains the same they will start on October 2015.
    There is no way the clubs will allow players such as Messi, Di Maria, Neymar, James, Falcao, Cavani, Suarez, Sanchez, Vidal, Cuadrado, etc etc and risk them of muscular fatigue, after all Summer is meant to be their vacation time, besides It's not even an official tournament the Copa Centenario. It will however give coaches a great opportunity in trying new players from local tournaments.
     
  21. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It is as far as FIFA's concerned. Now, whether the federations decide to placate the clubs by not calling up star players for three tournaments in a row is up in the air.
     
    Rivaldinho, unclesox and HomietheClown repped this.
  22. Rivaldinho

    Rivaldinho Member

    Jan 26, 2003
    Suarez won't. Chile will have all their best players, but I wouldn't be surprised if Messi and a few other top players skip the 2015 Copa.
     
  23. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    I would be VERY surprised if Messi and other stars skipped the 2015 Copa.
     
  24. dinamo_zagreb

    dinamo_zagreb Member+

    Jun 27, 2010
    San Jose, CA / Zagreb, Croatia
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    Six more teams are out of 2016 Copa after being knocked out of Caribbean Cup 2014 contention. That competition line-up is now known:
    group A (Cuba, Trinidad Tobago, French Guiana, Curacao)
    group B (Jamaica, Martinique, Haiti, Antigua).
    Cup will be played in Montego Bay, Jamaica, in November and winner will qualify to 2016 Copa.

    Qualified
    to 2016 Copa
    10 CONMEBOL teams
    USA
    Mexico
    Costa Rica (2014 UNCAF winner)

    Knocked-out of 2016 Copa
    US Virgin Islands
    Turks and Caicos Islands
    British Virgin Islands
    Montserrat
    Aruba
    Bonaire
    Suriname
    Puerto Rico
    Grenada
    Anguilla
    Guyana
    Dominica
    Belize
    Nicaragua
    Dominican Republic
    Saint Lucia
    Saint Kitts and Nevis
    Barbados
    Saint Vincent and the Grenadines

    Didn't take part in qualifiers
    Bahamas
    Bermuda
    Cayman Islands
    Saint Martin
    Sint Maarten
     
  25. PaulieJay

    PaulieJay Member

    Sep 10, 2013
    Iowa, United States
    Club:
    Wolverhampton Wanderers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Don't matter because it is a FIFA tournament. Like another poster mentioned, I would not at all be surprised to see a lot more of the headline players missing from the 2015 edition. Also, the "muscular fatigue" in THIS type of scenario over the course of on year, or the cumulative effect of several years, is not actually a real physiological condition. Muscular fatigue can occur because of overexertion during a shorter amount of time (like a week or a few weeks or even several hours if the body is not properly conditioned). Playing and training 48 weeks a year instead of 45 weeks a year absolutely does NOT cause an increase in injuries. The human body has only made very very subtle physical changes over the course of the last 10,000 years. The concepts of "vacation" and even "retirement" are really only about a century old or so. The adult human body is actually very capable of doing physical work 6 days a week, 52 weeks a year and the vast majority of people have done so regularly in the course of human history. Psychologically, in modern society, it is certainly a different story. The only validity of an increase in injuries would be the fact that obviously any player is slightly more likely to get injured if he is playing 58 games a year as opposed to 52 simply because there are more minutes played, and theoretically more opportunities where one could get injured. Now, if you want to make an argument that there is a psychological fatigue, that's where you may have a more valid point (i.e. Landon Donovan).

    As for potential remaining qualifiers, we're down to 13 teams left for the remaining 3 spots. Guadeloupe is eliminated as well. So just 2 of the remaining Caribbean teams are non-FIFA members. I think their eligibility for the tournament is still up in the air. French Guinea, to their credit, have gone through all 3 rounds of CC qualifying and have a winnable match against Curacao in group, but it's still very unlikely that they would win this tournament or qualify via the GC route. Martinique has at least a punchers chance at either. However, I highly doubt either confederation wants to see Martinique play in this tournament. You can even throw out the fact that they will be obvious minnows in any group in the 2016 Copa, which really doesn't matter because any CFU team will be huge underdogs in any group anyway. I don't think CONCACAF wants to see a non-member play that can't play in WCQ or draw any substantial interest from American audiences since there is not a significant population of Martinique or French OD natives in the US. They want a Haiti, Jamaica or T&T, and most of all they would LOVE Cuba. Therefore, I expect them to make up the rules as they go along.
     

Share This Page