Trying to spin the latest corrosion of your privacy. President acting under presidential and constitutional authority ("but I'm no lawyer"). NSA is closing "seam" between national & international communications between terrorists. Brings up 9/11 commission and fact that closing the link between terrorists here & abroad was hard to do. Russert - "No one has explained what authority the President has. Nixon tried the same thing and was prevented from doing so."
Russert brings up Arlen Specter's highly critical comments in Congress on Fri. Specter wants to know what info. was gathered about who, when and why it was gathered. Condi still spinning about the need to protect us post-9/11. Condi was Nat'l Security Advisor but won't comment on her role at that time. Feingold said Prez. may have broken the law. Basically Congress is P!SSED about the Executive branch creating their own laws. Russert - "Where in the law does it say the President can wiretap?" Condi says he has authority under the Constitution (?). She doesn't know what law of course. Russert - "You expect this to go to the Supreme Court"
another party in control of congress..... and this'd be so much more seriously handled.... Not that it should not now regardless..... BTW, Russert, like many people who do interviews of poiliticians... never goes far enough in his questioning...Already changed to Iraqi constitution topic... i thought we were not done talking about the US one at the time?
Good points. At least now there is enough pressure that the majority of Americans can see through the charade.
I'm not so sure you're right about that. Check the related thread on Congress not having the same info as Dubya. You'll see plenty of posts defending these actions and taking (poor) aim at the messengers. If BigSoccer (where it's generally accepted that the majority of Politics posters are progressive rather than conservative) has this kind of split on that issue, there's no reason to believe the masses could think their way to the truth on this one.
Have hope, not optimism. I don't believe that enough Americans see anything enough to get peturbed enough to do anything about it, which is tantamount to NOT seeing through anything of this nature at all...
I hear ya guys, but I think the People have crossed a threshold over the past couple o' weeks. And I hope they'll do something about it.
Yes. At least, not without getting permission from a special secret court. A president cannot unilaterally usurp judicial branch powers regarding probable cause and reasonable search.
Bush and his entire cabal should be impeached, tried for treason, deported and barred from re-entering the United States. The past 5 years have been filled with so many heinous crimes against the Constitution... I'm furious about the entire thing. Make them live out the rest of their pathetic lives in exile; it's pretty obvious they hate everything at the core of America's character anyway.
Since the "cabal" is obviously going to finish its term, and continue to live in the United States, perhaps its YOU and YOUR ilk who should voluntarily deport yourselves, bar yourself, and willingly not re-enter the United States. Don't you get it? Your insanely preposterous notions are NOT THOSE of MOST of the AMERICAN people/. In fact, most of the American people think folks like you are certifiable.
I rest my case. See below. Exhibit A, ladies and gentlemen. Well, Exhibit D-, but we're being lenient with the curve here.
yes, but then again a sadly growing number of americans are painfully stupid even if they're not painfully stupid, they often care more about being the first one to have the new Xbox than about how their leaders govern many of the american people are voluntarily distracted, chronically apathetic, or just can't be bothered to face the truth... what's your excuse?
Ahh yes the classic "It simply cannot be ME that's wrong or on the fringe" defense. Followed up by the " It's THEM that are the stupid ones, it just CANNOT be me " follow on I love this board because quite frankly without it , I would simply refuse to believe that the looney left really did exsist out there besides in a Rush Limbaugh pain killer induced rant
and what precisely makes me looney left? or is it more of the classic "if they don't kiss bushco's ass, they must be a far left wacko/if you're not with us, you're with the terrorists" spiel?
Your opinions are also not those of most of the American people. And most of the American people think Bush is doing a bad job. Independent centrrists should be extremely upset about this story, not attacking Foos for being upset.
Have a little faith. The Iraq war is only drawing 50% approval among Presidents of the United States of America whose names are George Bush. The American people should have gotten the message before, say, November 2004, but we're getting there.
See, its this attitude that really does you people in. Your assumption that you are smarter and more educated than those that disagree with you really just ensues that you will continue to lose elections... Carry on at your own expense..
I'm sorry, but once again the conservatives on this board become disgusting insult-throwers. Can you just accept that conservatives, moderates, even liberals what what is best for America. And while some of them have these pathetic fantasies about equality and kumbaya sing-alongs where everyone is equal and highly educated and has health care, questioning their loyalties is a pathetic attempt to cover up your own insecurities. This war was not forced upon us. Iraq was a decision made mainly by the president and his cabinet, supported by an American people and Congress that had been brow-beaten by a constant barrage of misleading and hand-picked evidence. MANY of us DISAGREE with the war, because it IS BAD FOR THE COUNTRY. 200+ billion dollars, 2000+ US Dead, 50,000+ US injured, 30000+ iraqi dead, The loss of respect of the world, proven incidents of torture and murder by US soldiers, the loss of personal privacy, and more... Was it worth it to get rid of a 2-bit dictator and make a couple of billion for your well connected friends? Even the administration is having a hard time justifying this stuff with a straight face... And calling those of us who are against the war 'sissies' or 'traitors' isn't going to change that fact.
who is "you people"? why should i not feel smarter than folks who still believe sadaam had something to do with 9/11? why should i not feel more educated when so many of the voters don't bother to stay informed beyond knowing which candidates are against gay marriage? why should i not look down on people who do what fox"news"channel tells them to do? good grief! if stupid people are so sensitive about being stupid, maybe they should do something about it instead of blaming those of us who are able to notice their obvious stupidity
nice dodge... you're right, we should all just go on condoning... nay! applauding sloppy citizenship because above all, it is more important to avoid hurting the feelings of people who truly believe W takes direct and divine instruction from the lord than to be truthful
No, Blue's right, and I understand his anger, even tho I don't really share it anymore. I'm interested in what you think should be said about people who have been led to water, in a manner of speaking, but refuse to drink. Setting aside the "they just disagree" BS for a moment, put yourself in the position of someone who knows better but cannot get the truth across to enough of the masses to move the country and world forward. Would you show your frustration by calling a spade a spade, as he has done, or would you simply sit back with a sandwich and watch the whole thing come apart at the seams so that you could have the pleasure of saying "I told you so"? Admittedly, the latter choice --mine, to some degree-- is more fun, but I know it doesn't make anything better for anyone. Blue comes off as being truly concerned about the big picture and quite bothered that it's all going so horribly wrong. I think that's more honorable than waiting to laugh when the sh!t hits the fan, and certainly more honorable than your approach of chiding him for being in the knowledgeable but powerless minority.
My opinion is that these issues are complex and not black and white. I think Bush has done some good things with good intentions, and he has also made a mess out of other things. Couple that with a poor ability to speak, and he doesnt come across that well. To bo honest, I am still up in the air about the entire Iraq situation. I supported the war from the beginning, and am trying to weigh the still developing results, as to whether I made a mistake. I was from the beginning curious to what the post-war plan was, and am pissed that it wasnt planned out better. Where Blue goes wrong is that he lumps people into "you are stupid, part of the sheeple" category and tries to make it so cut and dried. It isnt. You have extremely intelligent people on both sides of the spectrum, and his simplification of the issue is just plain wrong.