CONCACAF reacts to MLS/MFL

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by 3rd Degree, Nov 25, 2006.

  1. Qdog

    Qdog Member

    May 8, 2002
    Andalusia
    Club:
    Sevilla FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    From what I can tell, S. Korea didn't really gain a lot of respect for their '02 finish; too much refereeing controversy. For all these countries, they seem to do better north of the Alps. Some day they'll break into Spain and Italy.
     
  2. Qdog

    Qdog Member

    May 8, 2002
    Andalusia
    Club:
    Sevilla FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Actually, the idea is probably the best I've heard to date. The question is, can SUM and a TV partner sell full stadium games in an unusual format to the average American sports fan? I think it's possible, but it would take some effort.
     
  3. Heist

    Heist Member+

    Jun 15, 2001
    Virginia
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What does that mean?
    "Full stadium games?"
     
  4. Qdog

    Qdog Member

    May 8, 2002
    Andalusia
    Club:
    Sevilla FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Good question. The sentence doesn't exactly flow well.

    Autogolozo mentioned having the Central American play in American cities with big populations from their homeland that would support the "home" team. Hopefully that would result in full stadiums for these games.

    Hope this helps.
     
  5. Cweedchop

    Cweedchop Member+

    Mar 6, 2000
    Ellicott City, Md
    I'm not sure if the above statements are more about why European and South American teams can do this and MLS teams can't or if it's just sheer ignorance.

    I'll put dollars to doughnuts that any MLS player can go toe to toe with any Premier League player or any Serie A player in terms of conditioning.

    The difference that remains is that it is absolutely easier to play two games a week in moderate to cool temperatures than it is in sweltering conditions (which encompasses most of MLS' regular season). That in turn affects performances.

    Is it any coincidence that every spring (cooler weather and fresh players) and every fall (late September thru the end of MLS season) the games are of much higher quality?
     
  6. The Cadaver

    The Cadaver It's very quiet here.

    Oct 24, 2000
    La Cañada, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Also, do not overlook the roster size issue. The top Euro teams that play heavy league and international schedules have a lot more quality senior players under contract than a typical MLS club. Sometimes an obscenely large number of players. So its easy to trot out a fresh crew in the second game of two closely-scheduled contests.
     
  7. timpcrk

    timpcrk New Member

    Mar 10, 2005
    Bloomington
    First, others, not me, stated that fatigue due to a lack of conditioning is the reason that MLS teams do not do well in the Concacaf Champions tournament. I say, if that is the reason the clubs are losing, then it is good that they lose. Maybe the clubs will find players who are fit and conditioned to replace them. Personally, I think the fatigue issue is a worthless excuse some MLS fans are using to explain the leagues recent shortcomings in the tournament.

    Second, it is a long-held opinion of mine that golf is the only sport requiring less fitness than the NFL. (Not all football, at lower levels you don't get a five minute break between plays for stupid TV timeouts.) So yes, I have made that statement about the NFL countless times.
     
  8. timpcrk

    timpcrk New Member

    Mar 10, 2005
    Bloomington
    Cweedchop,

    First, I want to direct you to the post I just made.

    Second, where in the states are there "sweltering conditions" during February and March? Those are the months in which the MLS clubs are losing in the CCC.

    Third, nice preemptive excuse for why MLS teams would do poorly if the CCC were moved to coincide with the MLS regular season. When, I will agree, that some locales exhibity sweltering conditions.

    Last, I realize that I'm becoming a borderline troll in this thread, but fatigue? C'mon, if that is the reason MLS teams are doing poorly in the CCC (like I said, I think it is just a lame excuse), then American soccer has a serious issue.
     
  9. Qdog

    Qdog Member

    May 8, 2002
    Andalusia
    Club:
    Sevilla FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't know where all your talk about the CCC comes from, but its obvious to me the answers to your post was about fatigue, not excusing CCC failure. You can try to change the subject, but what you originally posted is still there.

    Fatigue for undermanned teams, especially playing in a summer league, is a big issue. If you doubt that, go back and look at Real Madrid's season three years ago. They went into March looking at a triple. But with a shallow bench and the coach unwilling to give the young players game experience, the team wilted the last 3 months of the season and came out with nothing.

     
  10. Heist

    Heist Member+

    Jun 15, 2001
    Virginia
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    "Playing two games per week in stead of just one (not even every week) should not make anyone so fatigued as to affect their performance. If it does they should just get out of the league, because they don't have the fitness to be in pro soccer."
    You did say that though didn't you? I quoted it directly from your post.
    I wish there were other players who were in better shape AND better players. Its about depth of the team, not about specific players that is the problem. As another poster stated, teams as good as Real Madrid get fatigued with all the games they play IF they don't use their bench. In Real's case it was because of the coach, in MLS' case its because of coaches AND a lack of depth. Putting the 17th and 18th roster guys in to start a game just isn't a good option for some MLS coaches so they have to play tired players. Ever notice how poorly some MLS teams play in Open Cup games because they have to start quite a few bench players because the starters need rest?
     
  11. E17Avenue

    E17Avenue Member

    Dec 1, 2003
    Grand Rapids, MI
    Club:
    Queens Park Rangers FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Just to add to the summer/winter debate, I saw this today:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/6206888.stm

     
  12. elvasco

    elvasco 100% Americanista

    Sep 10, 2006
    This isn't the first time blatter mentions that about the footy calendar, he's been trying to change it to a feb-nov calendar ever since he was first elected fifa president, just one of his crazy ideas..........he's not gonna get the big leagues to change their schedule that they've been playing under for 100 years, and since not many want to play through the heat of the a european summer.......


    I couldn't agree more.........

    Come on Concacaf even Asia's got their own champions league, if they can we should 2........:rolleyes:
     
  13. jared9999

    jared9999 Member+

    Jan 3, 2005
    Naucalpan Estado de Mex
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    we do its called copa libertadores :D jk
     
  14. edwardgr

    edwardgr Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 6, 2006
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    MLS squads fail in the CCC in February/March because of conditioning and form issues.

    As an analogy this past spring the first World Baseball Championship was played, all pitchers were on a strict pitch count limit because the competitors were all just starting to get into shape for the upcoming season. It's not that these professional athletes go to seed in the 3-4 months between season, but what they do lose is their game conditioning. There is a difference between being in shape and being in "game" shape.

    So the first issue for MLS teams is that they are coming off a 3-4 month layoff and are expected to play competitive and meaningful matches when they would ordinarily just start conditioning for the coming season. Excepting the few internationals that may play for a given side most of the players are not in game shape come the CCC.

    The second issue is form, even if the players were all in game shape they have not been playing together regularly for several months and therefore lack the cohesion of a team. Whereas our Mexican, Central American, and Caribbean counterparts are usually in the thick of their seasons. They have the advantage of form and conditioning.

    If an MLS team really wanted to win this they would start seriously training earlier and would invite a few European squads over for friendlies to get into game shape. I believe that Germany and neighboring leagues take a few weeks off in the mid winter because of the weather. Logistics may prevent this from working but if it has not been investigated then MLS would do well to look into all options.
     
  15. dcsundevil2002

    Apr 20, 2006
    Ashburn, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    I agree with you, but I think getting South American clubs would be easier, considering that they are going to be starting their season at the same time as ours.

    I have my ideas posted here.
     
  16. el chingon

    el chingon Member

    Dec 31, 2005
    Chicago
    Club:
    Club América
    yea but MLS teams get home field advantage troughout the tournament.
     
  17. elvasco

    elvasco 100% Americanista

    Sep 10, 2006
    So then why does MLS wants to play in Libertadores????? libertadores starts in late january......
     
  18. Sachin

    Sachin New Member

    Jan 14, 2000
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Because road trips to Beunos Aires are more fun than road trips to Jalisco. ;)
     
  19. uclacarlos

    uclacarlos Member+

    Aug 10, 2003
    east coast
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    That "home-field advantage" is negligible if not totally negated by the 27 million Mexicans and Mexican-Americans living in the US who will show up to support their favorite club.
     
  20. jared9999

    jared9999 Member+

    Jan 3, 2005
    Naucalpan Estado de Mex
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    its still held in the U.S.
     
  21. edwardgr

    edwardgr Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 6, 2006
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If you are referring to the CCC the MLS teams do not have home field through out the tournament. In 2006 New England played Alajuelense of Costa Rica, New Englands home game was played in Bermuda, the return leg was in Alajuela.

    LA played Saprissa with the home leg in Carson, and the return in San Jose CR.
     
  22. b1968k

    b1968k New Member

    Aug 4, 2002
    Logan Circle, DC
    And who's fault is that?

    They could have had a home field if they had wanted it.
     
  23. edwardgr

    edwardgr Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 6, 2006
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Home field advantage would be playing both games of a two games series at home. The idea of a home and home is to eliminate "home field advantage". However that being said in a home and home situation I would consider the home team in game two to have a slight advantage.
     
  24. swedust

    swedust Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    Some interesting opinions in this thread. I would just like to throw out a thought that to my friends who are casual friends, the international flavor of games, like the Olympics, is a crucial distinction between soccer and other sports. (Baseball is now getting the point, I recognize.) I know MLS goes to great pains to show soccer is an American sport, not a foreign sport, but I think in this effort they overlook an aspect of the internationalism that works to their advantage, image-wise.

    If this can be made practical, I'm not saying it's going to suddenly lead to full stadia and acceptance by the mainstream sports media, but it will cultivate an aspect that makes MLS unique and interesting among other pro-sports entertainment choices. That can only help.
     
  25. el chingon

    el chingon Member

    Dec 31, 2005
    Chicago
    Club:
    Club América
    yea but how often do they play against mexican teams?? not very often.
     

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